Please help me guys. I’m a 17 year old with a 2003 gmc envoy. I just got it back from the shop yesterday after a motor swap. After i got it back yesterday, i installed a kenwood radio. Everything went smooth and good with that. Today after school i wanted to try and get my driver seat working. It was from a junkyard car and it worked when pulled but never worked with my vehicle. Along story short, i accidentally touched the black and orange wires under my driver seat and heard some switch/pop noises. I put the seat back on and couldn’t get it to work, oh well. But i go to start my car, and it doesn’t start. Doesn’t even turn over. Dash lights only come on in the first key position, headlights only turn on in the first key position, the radio wouldn’t turn on, the headlights would go super dim all the sudden, the headlight controls wouldn’t work, my shifter is stuck in park. I did get it to start after holding it in the start position for a few seconds, and i went to turn it off, and it kept running, even with the key out. It wasn’t really a smooth idle though. It was really rough, like it was about to stall. Please help me guys. I don’t know where to start and my step dad is going off to drill. I just dropped $1200 on a new engine and i don’t want to wait longer without a 4x4 vehicle in minnesota. Thanks.
NEED HELP No crank after electrical short
- Thread starter sdotapel11
- Start date
djthumper
Administrator
i have checked all fuses, disconnected the battery for a while, and disconnected the radio to make sure it wasn’t messing with anything.
Mounce
Member
What do you mean by "ohmed out"? Was the fuse blown or not?
Also, remember there are 2 fuse boxes: 1 under the hood, one under the backseat.
There are quite a few fuses that could be involved in addition to some relays.
More than likely touching those 2 wires together under the seat you created a dead short and could have pulled the battery "low". This would cause sluggish starting and running. It still running in the off position is something I can't currently explain.
Attachments
That orange wire is fed directly from a 30 amp circuit breaker in the rear fuse box labeled "seats". The rear fuse box is fed by your 125 amp megafuse by the battery. have you tried disconnecting the battery for a few minutes and seeing if the battery is bad?
Yes, battery isn’t dead. Certain things have power, and i even got it to start after holding the key for a few seconds. 125 amp fuse is good
if it's not the battery orbattery leads the only other thing that comes to mind could be an ignition switch
Mooseman
Moderator
Even if the mega fuse was blown, the engine would still start. Just a bunch of things wouldn't work. Headlights via the switch are independent of the ignition switch. Wonder if something with the grounds is going on, especially with an engine swap. Check all your ground points first.
Then, I think you might have to check your entire power distribution. Download the manuals (link in my signature) and start following the schematics. Start with the ignition switch. This video shows how to check its operation (cued to relevant info):
Then, I think you might have to check your entire power distribution. Download the manuals (link in my signature) and start following the schematics. Start with the ignition switch. This video shows how to check its operation (cued to relevant info):
Looking at your picture you have other things connected to the other wires what are connected to which wire?
Th
They were the fires from the harness from the trailblazer i got the seats from. I cut the adapter from the trailblazer and just tried splicing it to my vehicle
It did start a few times. i’ll turn the key over and nothing will happen. the first key position, the dash lights up, the second position, the lights turn off, when i start it, nothing happens. I got it to start a few times but still nothing worked. I checked the 125 fuse with a meter and it was good.
Mooseman
Moderator
Im kinda late to the party here.. But.
When you say you checked all the fuses. Did you check BOTH fuse blocks? There is one under the rear seat, and the one under the hood.
When you say you checked all the fuses. Did you check BOTH fuse blocks? There is one under the rear seat, and the one under the hood.
Ok.. One last thing. When you checked the fuses, I am assuming you are using a test light? Or are you OHM ing them out on a multi meter?
you need to back up and start from the beginning with the "no start" condition. To start, you need to turn the key to RUN / RUN (not start).... in this position, your check engine light should be on solid and stay on solid "forever" (ie. as long as the key is in ON. IF this does not happen, you need to trace the voltages leaving the key switch and at the pcm to see what's up and what's not. Go from there.
OHM ing then out
The engine light does stay on with the key in run position
I personally think you need to be checking with a test light. Test each fuse for power in and power out (both sides of the fuse).
You can either buy one from a parts store, or build your own, thats what I did. If you have any extra automotive light sockets, with wiring, all you need to do is strip the wiring off each end. Then take one wire, and have it grounded, and use the other end to touch each end of each fuse. If the light lights up, then you know you have power in and out.
Edit: Or if your multi-meter has Volt function, which it should, same process. One end to ground, the other end to each fuse. Whatever voltage your battery has, the multi-meter should show you nearly the same voltage.
I checked all the little fuses, and 125. no little fuses were burnt, and 125 OHMed out. Should i check the volt of the rest of the big fuses?
Ok... then you need to move on to the "try to start mode". You probably need another pair of hands for someone to turn to start, while you check / listen for things are the fuse and starter.
First, though, currently when you just do a "short attempted start", do you get any starter action? do you hear any relays clicking? Depending on what, you then need the extra hands so that you can start checking things with a meter in the engine / fuse box area.
There is lots of clicking in both fuse boxes when the key is on accessory, the clicking goes away when i go to start it
you need to be checking things associated with the "start" mode as opposed to other positions.... that's why you likely need another set of hands while someone attempts the start and you check which / if any relays are operating. Further, to help your "eyes" look in the right direction, find the start relay... and focus on that.
I would start and make sure your battery is fully charged. It should read at least 12 volts with the multimeter. I would then check the voltage elsewhere not at the battery say maybe the 12-volt accessory socket just to be sure the voltages are the same. If the voltage reads different you've got a poor connection somewhere. The main reason I'm going with this theory is that if you have your key on accessory and the relays are flicking on and off that's indicative of a low voltage scenario.
The battery is good. I just don’t understand any of this because everything was electricly sound yesterday, obviously until i bumped those wires
How do you know the battery is good? Has it been tested? Just because everything worked yesterday doesn't mean there wasn't a problem. maybe there was a loose ground somewhere and when you shorted it out it just caused the ground to fail. Maybe the battery has a bad cell and when A load is applied it can't output.
shorting those two leads together should have done nothing else but trip the circuit breaker on that rear fuse block. we can only guide you but without knowing certain things there's not much we can help you with.
i replaced the ignition switch. Started but still nothing. Wasn’t starting consistent though. Still doing the same things.
Some Small Suggestions:
(1) Download the GM OEM Service Manual for your particular SUV Truck Line via @Mooseman 's Generous Library of GM Factory Service Manuals and locate-print out the Wiring and R&R Diagrams of ANYTHING you are intent upon Tackling... BEFORE you attempt ANY Work.
gmtnation.com
(2) Henceforth and Forever... Think about Scouring GMT Nation FAQs, Repair Articles and On Topic Threads for EVERYTHING you are about to do... BEFORE you get into the DOING of ANYTHING.
Not many 17 Year Old Kids have the combination of the Mechanical Chops and the Desire to learn as much as you obviously do (I saw you reading some Technical Articles the other day...). But... before you Saddle Up in Haste and Smack that Race Horse of Repairs on the Ass ...and lose control of the reigns before you even get a chance to guide that Animal in Motion... Just consider slowing things down just a bit and devising some Logical Plans and Preparation for EVERYTHING you want to do...as ROUTINE.
Knowing where most of the 'Mechanical and Electrical Gopher Holes' are that will lay in your path ahead can prevent many Disasters in the Making. Everyone here will want to help you and will chime in with suggestions if you First Post Inquiring Threads well in advance of Turning any Wrenches...or Cutting any Wires.
Your Step-Dad may have to work hard to make a living and be way too far away to consult with... but you can rely on the many 'GMTN Fathers' here who are willing to answer any calls for help you make and provide the advice and guidance you might need while you strive to improve your 'New' Trailblazer.
--==Best Of Luck!==--
(1) Download the GM OEM Service Manual for your particular SUV Truck Line via @Mooseman 's Generous Library of GM Factory Service Manuals and locate-print out the Wiring and R&R Diagrams of ANYTHING you are intent upon Tackling... BEFORE you attempt ANY Work.
Need service manuals? Get them here!
********* Please note that the FireFox browser has issues with the password handling and that these downloads are not under HTTPS, flagging them as security risks. Chrome and Edge work fine once you allow the download. ********* ATSG 4L60E Manual 4L60E Rebuild Manual 2005 GMC Envoy XUV...
gmtnation.com
(2) Henceforth and Forever... Think about Scouring GMT Nation FAQs, Repair Articles and On Topic Threads for EVERYTHING you are about to do... BEFORE you get into the DOING of ANYTHING.
Not many 17 Year Old Kids have the combination of the Mechanical Chops and the Desire to learn as much as you obviously do (I saw you reading some Technical Articles the other day...). But... before you Saddle Up in Haste and Smack that Race Horse of Repairs on the Ass ...and lose control of the reigns before you even get a chance to guide that Animal in Motion... Just consider slowing things down just a bit and devising some Logical Plans and Preparation for EVERYTHING you want to do...as ROUTINE.
Knowing where most of the 'Mechanical and Electrical Gopher Holes' are that will lay in your path ahead can prevent many Disasters in the Making. Everyone here will want to help you and will chime in with suggestions if you First Post Inquiring Threads well in advance of Turning any Wrenches...or Cutting any Wires.
Your Step-Dad may have to work hard to make a living and be way too far away to consult with... but you can rely on the many 'GMTN Fathers' here who are willing to answer any calls for help you make and provide the advice and guidance you might need while you strive to improve your 'New' Trailblazer.
--==Best Of Luck!==--
I have a mechanic coming to check it out on friday. I don’t want to further mess things up, so i’ll leave it to a pro. He’ll diagnose it, and fix it if it’s a small fix for $100, if the fix is more expensive, he’ll give a quote. So we’ll see and go from there. Thank you though! I appreciate it.Some Small Suggestions:
(1) Download the GM OEM Service Manual for your particular SUV Truck Line via @Mooseman 's Generous Library of GM Factory Service Manuals and locate-print out the Wiring and R&R Diagrams of ANYTHING you are intent upon Tackling... BEFORE you attempt ANY Work.
Need service manuals? Get them here!
********* Please note that the FireFox browser has issues with the password handling and that these downloads are not under HTTPS, flagging them as security risks. Chrome and Edge work fine once you allow the download. ********* ATSG 4L60E Manual 4L60E Rebuild Manual 2005 GMC Envoy XUV...
(2) Henceforth and Forever... Think about Scouring GMT Nation FAQs, Repair Articles and On Topic Threads for EVERYTHING you are about to do... BEFORE you get into the DOING of ANYTHING.
Not many 17 Year Old Kids have the combination of the Mechanical Chops and the Desire to learn as much as you obviously do (I saw you reading some Technical Articles the other day...). But... before you Saddle Up in Haste and Smack that Race Horse of Repairs on the Ass ...and lose control of the reigns before you even get a chance to guide that Animal in Motion... Just consider slowing things down just a bit and devising some Logical Plans and Preparation for EVERYTHING you want to do...as ROUTINE.
Knowing where most of the 'Mechanical and Electrical Gopher Holes' are that will lay in your path ahead can prevent many Disasters in the Making. Everyone here will want to help you and will chime in with suggestions if you First Post Inquiring Threads well in advance of Turning any Wrenches...or Cutting any Wires.
Your Step-Dad may have to work hard to make a living and be way too far away to consult with... but you can rely on the many 'GMTN Fathers' here who are willing to answer any calls for help you make and provide the advice and guidance you might need while you strive to improve your 'New' Trailblazer.
--==Best Of Luck!==--
Mooseman
Moderator
I should have done this at the beginning but I changed your title to actually reflect the problem.
When you put in that ignition switch, did you check power in the wires as shown in the video? I say you probably have a bad or loose connection somewhere and that short you experienced exacerbated it. Or you have two separate issues at play. Just to confirm, it now cranks but won't keep running? That would be the first priority to address.
From the FAQ's: Cranks but won't start
If it sorta starts but won't keep running, I think it could a fuelling issue. One thing to do to confirm this trying starting fluid while cranking.
I know you have a machanic coming to look at it but with the knowledge here, it could help find the issues.
When you put in that ignition switch, did you check power in the wires as shown in the video? I say you probably have a bad or loose connection somewhere and that short you experienced exacerbated it. Or you have two separate issues at play. Just to confirm, it now cranks but won't keep running? That would be the first priority to address.
From the FAQ's: Cranks but won't start
If it sorta starts but won't keep running, I think it could a fuelling issue. One thing to do to confirm this trying starting fluid while cranking.
I know you have a machanic coming to look at it but with the knowledge here, it could help find the issues.