You KNOW there's going to be a "will it fit" thread

fishsticks

Well-Known Member
It doesn't seem to be pulling data for some of the larger tire sizes... maybe that was intentional.


I figured it'd be polite to ask. :biggrin:
 
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Shdwdrgn

Shdwdrgn

Well-Known Member
fishsticks said:
It doesn't seem to be pulling data for some of the larger tire sizes... maybe that was intentional.


I figured it'd be polite to ask. :biggrin:
It's not actually 'pulling' data from anywhere. I used the chart from the first post at OffRoad TB - View topic - Lift/Tire Chart to create a text file with the original data. At this point, the information is static and can only be changed by updating the text file.

Now if I really wanted to go crazy with it, I would write the back-end using a mySQL database, and provide a method for individual users to enter their own specific data -- tire size, suspension and body lifts, a URL to link to pictures of their vehicle, and specific notes on what was required for their lift. All of this data would then be available for anyone to check out, and make it easier to track down specific information for reproducing the original user's setup. This chart I made last night was more of a proof-of-concept thing without putting too much effort into it. If there is an interest in a full-blown database driven chart, I can probably put out a working version in another evening or two. I just wasn't going to waste the time if there isn't any interest in using the code on one of the sites.
 
I'm all ears. If you'd like to email me (offroadtb.com at JD :wink:), we can chat about ideas.

These are the kind of resources that I feel would be extremely useful to our members on ortb.
 

navigator

Well-Known Member
JamesDowning said:
I'm all ears. If you'd like to email me (offroadtb.com at JD :wink:), we can chat about ideas.

These are the kind of resources that I feel would be extremely useful to our members on ortb.
and I would be honored if someone could take the info I gathered in that chart on ORTB and make something more useful out of it.
One note is the contacts are actually links to those builds. If there is a way to capture that it would be great. I think that is part of the real value is seeing the actual builds.

I'm also working on a build chart thread over there but It doesn't appear I will ever finish it.
That chart is more to highlight the other offroad related mods and give a quick reference on those that have them.

OffRoad TB - View topic - Build Chart
 

jbones

Well-Known Member
Shdwdrgn said:
OK folks, here's my contribution... I made an active table that merges the data from ORTB with my chart. This page allows you to select your wheel size and other options, then gives you the tire sizes available for that combination of choices. Hovering over the column names gives a more detailed description. Please be aware that this page uses javascript to update the view.

Envoy/Trailblazer Wheel Fit Chart

If anyone is interested in the code behind it, I use PHP to generate the table, with a tab-delineated flat text file holding the actual data, and a little CSS for the styling.
Have you looked to populate any of these chart sizes from The Ultimate 'Will it Fit' Chart? - Chevy TrailBlazer, TrailBlazer SS and GMC Envoy Forum in your chart, I see the 255/65/17 shows on the trailvoy chart but not on yours.
 
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Shdwdrgn

Shdwdrgn

Well-Known Member
jbones said:
Have you looked to populate any of these chart sizes from The Ultimate 'Will it Fit' Chart? - Chevy TrailBlazer, TrailBlazer SS and GMC Envoy Forum in your chart, I see the 255/65/17 shows on the trailvoy chart but not on yours.
My old chart was created from going through that thread, but that was over a year and a half ago. Of course more information has been added since then, it simply wasn't worth keeping up with because at the time nobody responded with interest to my chart. Obviously there's a lot of interest now!
 

jbones

Well-Known Member
Sounds great!
You may what to call it "The all encompassing tire fit chart" sounds like buy the time your complete it should answer most any question that could be asked.
 

fishsticks

Well-Known Member
Shdwdrgn said:
It's not actually 'pulling' data from anywhere. I used the chart from the first post at OffRoad TB - View topic - Lift/Tire Chart to create a text file with the original data. At this point, the information is static and can only be changed by updating the text file.

Now if I really wanted to go crazy with it, I would write the back-end using a mySQL database, and provide a method for individual users to enter their own specific data -- tire size, suspension and body lifts, a URL to link to pictures of their vehicle, and specific notes on what was required for their lift. All of this data would then be available for anyone to check out, and make it easier to track down specific information for reproducing the original user's setup. This chart I made last night was more of a proof-of-concept thing without putting too much effort into it. If there is an interest in a full-blown database driven chart, I can probably put out a working version in another evening or two. I just wasn't going to waste the time if there isn't any interest in using the code on one of the sites.


An SQL database was the road I was thinking about going down with it...


If you're feeling up to it, go ahead, as I have enough "work" on my plate to keep me busy for the next few months, so the chances of me actually getting to this anytime soon are small.
 
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Shdwdrgn

Shdwdrgn

Well-Known Member
By the way, it may also be worthy of noting what size tires will still fit in the underside spare-tire carrier. I run 265/75-16s which fit with plenty of clearance. I would imagine a larger diameter tire can safely fit up there, however I would not go with a wider tire. Mine already looks like it is hanging down nearly as far as the differential.
 

Pittdawg

Well-Known Member
What is the stock offset and backspacing?

I'm looking at 18 inch rims with an offset of 30mm and backspacing of 5.66". Do those figures move me away from hitting the ball joint with 30.5 inch tires or move me closer?
 

Pittdawg

Well-Known Member
Shdwdrgn said:
One thing that always bugged me about TV was the lack of any kind of quick-reference chart for the tire info. I have a chart I made some time back to compile the info I found at the time, perhaps this could be of use?
Code:
          |          | *Wheel  | Wider | Upper ball | Spring | Body | Cutting &
Tire size | Diameter | spacers | rims  | joint mod  |  lift  | lift | hammering
----------+----------+---------+-------+------------+--------+------+-----------
245/70-16 |  29.5"   |         |       |            |        |      |
255/70-16 |  30.1"   |         |       |            |        |      |
245/75-16 |  30.5"   |         |       |            |        |      |
265/70-16 |  30.6"   |         |       |            |        |      |
285/65-16 |  30.6"   |   ?     |   ?   |            |        |      |
255/75-16 |  31.1"   |   ?     |       |     ?      |        |      |
265/75-16 |  31.6"   |   X     |       |     ?      |   ?    |      |     ?
285/70-16 |  31.7"   |   X     |   ?   |     ?      |   X    |      |     ?
285/75-16 |  32.8"   |   X     |   ?   |     X      |   X    |  ?   |     X
255/85-16 |  33.1"   |   X     |       |     ?      |   X    |      |     X
----------+----------+---------+-------+------------+--------+------+-----------
245/65-17 |  29.5"   |         |       |            |        |      |
255/65-17 |  30.1"   |         |       |            |        |      |
245/70-17 |  30.5"   |         |       |            |        |      |
265/65-17 |  30.6"   |         |       |            |        |      |
255/70-17 |  31.1"   |   ?     |       |     ?      |        |      |
245/75-17 |  31.5"   |   X     |       |     ?      |        |      |     ?
265/70-17 |  31.6"   |   X     |       |     ?      |   ?    |      |     ?
255/75-17 |  32.1"   |   X     |       |     X      |   X    |      |     ?
265/75-17 |  32.6"   |   X     |       |     X      |   X    |      |     ?
305/65-17 |  32.6"   |   X     |   X   |     X      |   X    |  ?   |     X
285/70-17 |  32.7"   |   X     |   ?   |     X      |   X    |  ?   |     X
285/75-17 |  33.8"   |   X     |   ?   |     X      |   X    |  ?   |     X
305/70-17 |  33.8"   |   X     |   X   |     X      |   X    |  ?   |     X
----------+----------+---------+-------+------------+--------+------+-----------
* Using rims with an incorporated offset is preferred over using wheel spacers
? May require this mod, depending on the particular tire used
I've been trying to think of some way a chart could be linked to useful information, and I have an idea... Would it be possible to create 'hidden' sub-forums under the off-road section, using a tire chart as the starting point? So for instance, someone brings up a chart (using mine as an example), and they see that if they want to install 265/70-17's there may be some cutting involved. From here, they would click on the tire size, and it would take them to a forum that only discuses the 265/70-17 tire (lifts, wheel-spacers, body mods, and of course pictures).

I just noticed over the past year that this seems to be THE most common question that comes up in the off-road section, and since we're starting from scratch here, maybe this problem can be tackled before it becomes a problem?

* As a final note... THANK YOU for choosing a forum software that allows me to paste a block of fixed-width text! I was never able to do this on the old site.
All the 265/65/17 tires on tirerack indicate a minimum of a 7.5 inch wide rim. Sadly, stockers are 7 inches wide :frown:
 

Pittdawg

Well-Known Member
265/65/17 BF Goodrich Long Trail Touring = 30.6.

Very close to ball joint but still safe I believe, anyone disagree? Should I be at all worried about the proximity of tire to ball joint?
 

Attachments

jbones

Well-Known Member
Pittdawg said:
265/65/17 BF Goodrich Long Trail Touring = 30.6.

Very close to ball joint but still safe I believe, anyone disagree? Should I be at all worried about the proximity of tire to ball joint?
Just get spacers and prevent the wondering!
 

DenaliHD66

Well-Known Member
Thinking about getting MarkMC's wheel spacers, then going with 255/70/17's. Unless cutting/ball joint mod negates this, I'll drop back to 265/65/17. On mine, 255/65/17's are close enough to upper ball joint, so it definitely needs spacers for anything bigger. Just don't want to lift it. Do wheel spacers also increase handling ability? Just seems like a wider stance = less body roll maybe maybe?

Hmm so this is interesting. You'd think that with increasing wheel size and increasing size that tires would get more expensive. Well on Tirerack.com, my current 255/65/17 Bridgestone Dueler Revo 2's are $209 each. The 255/70/17's are $181 each. That's $112 less for all 4... which is half the cost for the wheel spacers themselves. I'm sold :tongue:
 
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Shdwdrgn

Shdwdrgn

Well-Known Member
I wouldn't worry about the ball-joint mod. That's actually a very minor mod and shouldn't be a reason to stay away from larger tires. According to the data I have, going with 255/70/17 tires should not require any cutting, and neither the ball-joint mod nor the wheel spacers may be required, depending on the specific tire you get.

When you say your 255/65's are close to the ball joint, how close do you mean? When I got my tires, I had less than 1/4" clearance after grinding on the ball joint. I've been driving those tires for a year and a half now, without any problems.

I agree that tire pricing can be crazy. It's probably just a matter of which size gets used on commercial vehicles and thus they make more of them.
 

DenaliHD66

Well-Known Member
Shdwdrgn said:
I wouldn't worry about the ball-joint mod. That's actually a very minor mod and shouldn't be a reason to stay away from larger tires. According to the data I have, going with 255/70/17 tires should not require any cutting, and neither the ball-joint mod nor the wheel spacers may be required, depending on the specific tire you get.

When you say your 255/65's are close to the ball joint, how close do you mean? When I got my tires, I had less than 1/4" clearance after grinding on the ball joint. I've been driving those tires for a year and a half now, without any problems.

I agree that tire pricing can be crazy. It's probably just a matter of which size gets used on commercial vehicles and thus they make more of them.
Even on my worn-down Bridgestone Duelers, I can't fit the tip of my finger through the tire tread and the ball joint (which hasn't been cut). If I got the 255/70's I would definitely need spacers, and could probably just avoid cutting the ball joint altogether.

Edit: What do you guys even use to cut that down anyway?
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
DenaliHD66 said:
Even on my worn-down Bridgestone Duelers, I can't fit the tip of my finger through the tire tread and the ball joint (which hasn't been cut). If I got the 255/70's I would definitely need spacers, and could probably just avoid cutting the ball joint altogether.

Edit: What do you guys even use to cut that down anyway?
You grind the balljoint. Flatten the round part.


However you really need to keep in mind that tires can vary vastly from one model or maker to the next. I know that you can buy a set of 315-70-17 that are 33.5 inches tall or a set of 315-70-17 that are 35.2 inches tall. Same size on sidewall but greatly different when it comes to fitment.
 

Sparky

Moderator
HARDTRAILZ said:
You grind the balljoint. Flatten the round part.
Not the ball joint itself, but the part of the spindle that the joint is pressed into, right? Just wanting to clarify just in case someone tries to grind the side of the balljoint ball or socket or something.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Sparky said:
Not the ball joint itself, but the part of the spindle that the joint is pressed into, right? Just wanting to clarify just in case someone tries to grind the side of the balljoint ball or socket or something.
Details details....

Grind the spindle.
 

DenaliHD66

Well-Known Member
So I think I'm for sure going to get 265/65/17 Michelin LTX MS2's. I'm in between getting spacers... I know the upper ball clearance will be very close. Anyone else fit these tires on their truck at this size? If I got markmc's spacers, does the truck handle better too... given the wider stance of the tires?
 

Pittdawg

Well-Known Member
DenaliHD66 said:
So I think I'm for sure going to get 265/65/17 Michelin LTX MS2's. I'm in between getting spacers... I know the upper ball clearance will be very close. Anyone else fit these tires on their truck at this size? If I got markmc's spacers, does the truck handle better too... given the wider stance of the tires?
Check out post 53.
 

DenaliHD66

Well-Known Member
Sounds good. I think the spacers would give it a better stance though. I really don't like the tucked-in look of the wheels under the body. Makes the truck look too long and narrow.
 

DenaliHD66

Well-Known Member
Forgot to take a "before" picture and measure, but I got new tires on today.

Old: Bridgestone Dueler AT Revo 2 (255/65/17)
New: Michelin LTX MS2 (265/65/17) 34.5" from ground to top center of rear wheel well, 33.5" from ground to top center of front wheel well. Clearance is VERY close to upper ball joint, but they said I would not have to worry about it. Only about the width of a pencil in space, maybe a bit less than that. Also, my alignment was toe-in half a degree.

So basically, my old tires rode kinda rough, and I got a decent amount of wheel hop on pot holes and bumps (plus the misalignment). On the way to the tire shop on the highway, it was snowing and the wind was blowing, and my truck was kinda all over the road. The body was swaying, I didn't feel that planted, and there was also some tire noise.

Got the new Michelins on, and the steering eased up a lot, even at idle. It was much more smooth, although going in a straight line felt slightly numb at first. But I noticed an immediate difference in ride quality. The tread just soaks up the bumps. The wider tire also helped the handling as well, and I felt way more planted in the turns, with reduced body roll. On the highway, I was literally just gliding. I was going 80, and it was smooth as butter. There was absolutely no body roll even when I got hit with strong wind gusts, and the steering was nice and easy and tracked very smoothly. Absolutely no road noise at all, other than the wind howling along the body.

Conclusion: If you want the best all-season road tire out there, go with the Michelin LTX MS2's. I can't wait to try them out on a snowy/icy road. I went with 2 sizes wider than stock, which I felt way more planted and much more smooth. Probably overall like half an inch bump in ride height, although that's not really noticeable. The close tread pattern isn't ideal for off road, so if you need off road traction look for something else. But if you wanna improve the ride of your Trailvoy, get these tires in this size, and they will fit without any modification!





 

DenaliHD66

Well-Known Member
BTW these tires are absolutely amazing. Best winter traction I've ever had. Never slipped sideways once... they have so much lateral grip. If you wanna turn your GMT into a handling master, get the largest size of these that you can fit and get Bilstein's all around, and you'll go around any corner like a car.
 

paul2005tb

Well-Known Member
The charts are packed with information. Many thanks to all that contributed to building them.

My take away is that a 3in suspension lift and 1.5in spacers along with minor trimming of plastic bumper material is worth the investment but it still only get you from 30.5" diameter tires to about 32.5 depending on the width and tread of the particular tire. A 2in gain in tire diameter at most ...

In order to get above 32.5/10 one must also install a body lift. From what I can gather this is due to the fact that tires larger than 32.5/10 will interfere with the sheet metal (not just plastic) on the back side of the front wheel well.

This is all not so intuitive as with my lift I measure over 35 inches vertical from the ground to the wheel well and about 35 inches across. It is hard to understand how a 33in tire with 10 inch width doesnt fit since 33^2+10.5^2=34.6^2 <35^2 ... Certainly suggests that 32.5 is a very easy fit.

So I must be missing something as the empirical data doesnt lie.
 

paul2005tb

Well-Known Member

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
That forgets to account for backspacing and wheel width which is really important in what needs cut
 

paul2005tb

Well-Known Member
HARDTRAILZ said:
That forgets to account for backspacing and wheel width which is really important in what needs cut
I think it accounts for wheel width but not backspacing.
 

paul2005tb

Well-Known Member
So I think I'm for sure going to get 265/65/17 Michelin LTX MS2's. I'm in between getting spacers... I know the upper ball clearance will be very close. Anyone else fit these tires on their truck at this size? If I got markmc's spacers, does the truck handle better too... given the wider stance of the tires?
I noticed a much more stable ride after the markmc spacers.
 

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