Power Stop/Kinetic wheel bearing hubs?

Mooseman

Moderator
I'm usually a big Timken fan for hubs but money is tight right now and I have at least one going bad with the usual noise and the other possibly bent. Was looking at cheap alternatives and found these on Amazon
http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00DGRN88K/ref=gno_cart_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3DWYIK6Y9EEQB

I can't find anything at all about Kinetic hubs but looking at the picture, saw "PWR 513188". A Google search found that they are Power Stop hubs sold at Summit Racing
http://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/pwr-513188/overview/

And a Google search of the UPC confirms that they are both the same. One UPC index says that they are Kinetic and owned by a company called Sbc Ltd. in California. Can't find anything about Sbc.

More than likely, they are made in China. There is no warranty information anywhere. Anybody know anything or have experience with these hubs? If I could get 6 months out of them until the money situation improves, I'd be happy.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Just the shipping to Canada is a bitch. I ordered them yesterday and got them today (gotta love Prime!) Plain white box with "made in China " sticker on them. I'll have to wait till the cold lets up before I can install them.
 

littleblazer

Gold Supporter
Mooseman said:
Just the shipping to Canada is a bitch. I ordered them yesterday and got them today (gotta love Prime!) Plain white box with "made in China " sticker on them. I'll have to wait till the cold lets up before I can install them.
That was my predicament 2 years ago. My mom goes, my car makes a noise when I turn. Took it for a drive couldn't pin point it so i jacked up the passengers side. I shook the wheel, there was literally as much play as there would be with a failed tie rod, over an inch in every direction. She says I'll take it to the shop, I countered and said that it probably wouldn't make it to the shop. Picked up a timken from advanced for almost 200, sat in the dark in the cold (20 degrees Fahrenheit but thirty mile an hour winds, I'll never do that again) and beat it apart, 130k on salted roads isn't kind to hubs, and put it back together. It took around 2 hours but it was quiet after. So when I was on amazon in September and saw the tahoe/escalade/surburban/ every other shared part for that hub for 68$ and it was genuine timken, I pounced on it. I pulled it out, marking and everything matched the other and I installed it preventively when it was warm out. :woot: So I feel you for waiting till its a little warmer windchill at 20 probably isn't as bad as the Canadian winter. Let us know how they work though, and if the abs sensor holds cruise above 70 (replacing my one cheap bearing brought it to 75 so thats got to be the problem) and build and longevity, always good to keep a cheap spare in the garage.

P.S. sorry for ranting on your thread. :redface:
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Hey, that's fine. I do that on occasion too :biggrin: .

Today it's -10c (14f) without the wind. This morning it was -27c (-16f). I'm hoping the weekend will be better. Even -10c isn't too bad if there is no wind.

I'll definitely put up a review thread on these and keep it updated. These are a cheap alternative if they hold up.
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Update. Finally installed one today as my old one was getting very noisy (usual whirring sound). Just for my own benefit, my truck had 153 161km when installed so if it fails, I can report how long it lasted. BTW, it only took me 45 minutes to install it, outside in -6c in a snowy driveway. Went for a quick test drive, all's good, including the ABS sensor.

Here are some unboxing pics.

20150210_183720 (Large).jpg
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20150210_183836 (Large).jpg
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
At 169k km later, still no issues except that the connectors for the ABS sensors are made of a brittle plastic and broke the clips when I had to separate them. Had to use zip ties to positively keep them together.
 
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WarGawd

Well-Known Member
Been lurking for ages, haven't posted in forever but this seems like a great time to bump this thread. I have a front bearing going out, after lots of reading I was resigned to spending a decent pile of money on the Timken or SKF from RockAuto. Then my girlfriend cross checked CarID and found the Timken's $30 cheaper, and in following a link she sent me I saw they had the PowerStop hubs...my calipers are all PowerStop, I've been pleased with them for over 2 years and probably 50k km+...seemed like I should at least consider them...went searching for any members who had experience with those, tripped over this post by Mooseman, and saw HardTrailz' reply....soooo I figured if he got a year out of the ones he linked, under extreme conditions with huge wheels and a lift, I could consider lowering the bar a bit.

As it turns out, the manufacturer is Canadian, the warehouse was in Ottawa, 1 or 2-day shipping was free, and I was able to get a lifetime warranty (one time replacement only though) for an extra ~$10 on a PAIR bringing the total to $106 CDN...so all things considered, I decided to save a pile of money knowing in advance I chose CCC parts, but I got a spare part if it fails prematurely, I can get each replaced once, and now knowing the job is likely only a couple hours I'm willing to risk it..buys me time to decide whether putting Timken or SKF on a '05 with 175k miles is really worth doing or not.

Here's the link for the lifetime warrantied version (on ebay it'll have a red banner that the 6 month warrantied part doesn't have):
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/181354136130

Thanx all, the feedback was enormously helpful...and thanx Moose for updating your actual review on Amazon so I could see the life you're getting out of the Kinetic/PowerStops

Cheers :smile:
 
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cornchip

Well-Known Member
My personal experience....cheapo's are no better than big brand jobs. When I change hubs...I always remove the original sensor (if it comes off) just in case the new one suffers an early death.
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Did the Prime Choice have the same markings as mine? Reason I ask is because I had a bad experience with their hubs on my '00 Jimmy. Replaced one with theirs and the ABS would cycle as I would slow down (which is a usual symptom on a failing hub). Replaced the sensor, nada. Pulled the ABS fuse until the hub failed about a year later and replaced with another brand. Mind you, this was about 7-8 years ago. Swore off their hubs (and alternators) forever. I've had great luck with their radiators though. Their brakes are for vehicles you are selling. They warp more than potato chips.

And I doubt very much that these hubs are made in Canada. Mine were made in good 'ol China.
 

WarGawd

Well-Known Member
Did the Prime Choice have the same markings as mine? ....
I won't know for a short bit...parts arrived at my door this morning about 24 hours after placing the order via Ebay (side note for future Canadian readers - I went the Ebay route because ONLY in Canada do our stupid hybrid debit/credit cards have the potential to not be recognized for processing by merchants' particular systems - Ebay let me facilitate payment by PayPal..it was also like $6 cheaper).

I picked up my deep impact socket at Napa this morning for $27 + tax....still gotta decide if I want to go purchase or borrow/rental route on a torque wrench, so I haven't unboxed them yet. I'll snap a few comparative pics when I do. And yeah 7 or 8 years is a long time to have maybe changed or tightened up manufacturing tolerances and inspection specs...my decision was heavily influenced by Hardtrailz' result, and so I know MMMV.

And I doubt very much that these hubs are made in Canada. Mine were made in good 'ol China.
They aren't manufactured IN Canada, they are sourced out of China (my CCC reference was Cheap Chinese Crap not Cheap Canadian Crap). But I see the confusion...the company they're being manufactured on behalf of and distributed by is Canadian...a bit of semantics I suppose ;-)
 

WarGawd

Well-Known Member
So I got around to doing the first of them the other night. Was about a 3 hour job alone outside in the parking lot. The axle nut fought me the whole way off & I should have just removed it while the wheel was on the ground. Snapped a pry bar in two while using it for leverage against the ground and between a couple lugs!!

And as it turned out, I got fooled by 3 pieces of evidence that pointed to the drivers side - left turns made the sound disappear, the noise actually sounded louder to that side, and May03LT's trick of using the bearing temperature - it was slightly hotter on that side.

So I did the passenger side tonight (axle nut removed with wheel on ground, much easier!) . Swapped in the old drivers side hub assembly since nothing really seemed wrong with it and I'll keep the second of the pair I bought as a spare. The passenger side bearing was definitely shot to hell, was noisy and I could tell it was bone dry just rotating it in my hand...so happy my 3 month noise problem is gone!

In both cases I elected to use the old sensor rather than fight with the clips and that pain in the ass connector. On the first one I was pressed for time and didn't want to get over anxious trying to disconnect the harness connector, and risk ripping out wires or yank it out of the wiring harness it leads into. However the new hub on the drivers side came with two shims under the sensor whereas OE parts have the riveted stainless shim, so I thought it best to install them.

Somehow that seems to have introduced a very low speed ABS cycling (with or without application of brakes) mainly as I'm slowing down at around 3-5 mph. Unsure if it's shim height related, or if I managed to ever so slightly misalign the sensor on re-installation. I had zero ABS issues leading up to the hub swap.

I'm also not happy with the sound of the new bearing...at low speeds below where tire and/or wind noise would begin to mask the sound, it sounds like I've driven thru a little patch of tar and the tire is making a sticky slightly velcro like sound as it rotates. It MAY just be the backing plate rubbing a tiny bit, and I'll take a closer look when I play with the sensor a bit more.

I have some images for comparison with Mooseman's above:

*EDIT - some seem to have posted more than once, but when I edit the thread to remove them, it still only shows the 6 I intended as being attached?

S0231492_Web.jpg S0241493_Web.jpg S0261495_Web.jpg S0281497_Web.jpg S0291499_Web.jpg
S0231492_Web.jpg S0241493_Web.jpg S0261495_Web.jpg S0281497_Web.jpg S0291499_Web.jpg
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Apart from the last 6 digits, they seem to be different. The rear seal is different and the studs are black (mine were white metal).

For the ABS, that is EXACTLY the same issue I had with their hubs on my Jimmy. It may be the OEM sensor that doesn't like the new hub. Try the new sensor in place with the shims but with me, I tried the old sensors, new sensors, whatever, it did the same thing.
 

WarGawd

Well-Known Member
For the ABS, that is EXACTLY the same issue I had with their hubs on my Jimmy. It may be the OEM sensor that doesn't like the new hub. Try the new sensor in place with the shims but with me, I tried the old sensors, new sensors, whatever, it did the same thing.
Your experience was every combo you tried resulted in the low speed ABS cycling, and in my case the old sensor that was perfectly functional before now seems to behave the same. Given your experience, I suspect the new sensor will not behave differently in my case either.

Which leads me to believe that either something internal to the hub gives rise to this, or else the shim height may be at the root of the problem. I know I've read threads where rust buildup under the riveted shim on OE hubs gave rise to a change in sensor height that resulted in similar ABS misbehavior, and upon cleaning that rust and getting the shim seated properly, the problem vanished.

So, I am considering as a first attempt removing one or both of the shims that came with the new hub, onto which I installed the old sensor. One is brass and one appears to be stainless, slightly thicker.

Anybody have any opinions on that idea? If I choose to remove only one, should I take out the brass or the stainless? Will removing both result in possible contact of the sensor magnetic pickup with the bearing?

Mooseman, did you ever try a configuration that excluded any or all of the shims?

If I get a chance to test something before any feedback arrives, I'll post the results...

*EDIT - a little Googling led me to info which hints at the sensitivity of the ABS sensor signal to the air gap between the pickup and the ring...I'm gonna remove both shims from under the sensor of the new spare hub assembly since it's quick and easily accessible. I'll measure the thickness of both and see what impact removal of each may have on the installed hub. Got a warm and fuzzy gut feel that tolerance buildups on both the ring and the shim thickness are conspiring to yield a lower than desired ABS signal. I'll get this done in the next week or so, off camping for the weekend :smile:
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
It's been so long, I can't even remember shims on those hubs.

Why won't you try the new sensors that came with the hubs?

If you remove the shims, be sure the sensor doesn't contact the ring inside.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Never had good luck using old sensors with new hubs. Always use the new ones now.

Never shimmed a sensor either. Did not even know that was a thing.
 

WarGawd

Well-Known Member
An update here has been outstanding quite a while.

Per the footnote on my last post I was going to consider some adjustment to the shimming to see if it resolved the ABS issue. On examination, the shim was ~ 0.014". Any attempts to rotate the hub assembly at a variety of consistent rates to measure sensor output turned out to be more complicated than I anticipated. Further, any attempt to remove the shim resulted in direct contact between the sensor and the tone ring. I concluded that shim adjustment was not a viable path to resolving the ABS activation at low speeds, and resolved to just go get a high end hub.

I went with SKF from RockAuto (3yr warranty vs 1yr for the Timken)...about to install it tonight now that I've resolved my (more recent) throttle body and coil pack problem.

Will update this in the near future :smile:
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Just to update anyone possibly looking at the Kinetic hubs, still going strong and I'm almost at 200K km.
 

WarGawd

Well-Known Member
SKF hub now installed in place of the CCC I resorted to last fall. There was a fair bit of grunge inside the ABS connector up on the frame, but the dielectric grease seemed to have done it's job and the contacts showed no corrosion at all. Cleaned and re-greased prior to reconnecting. On test drive after, sure enough the ABS low speed engagement annoyance is completely gone! :Lager Louts:

I did notice something I hadn't picked up on before...only one of the front two wheels has the OEM axle nut with the integrated washer. Either I lost the separate aftermarket washer when I changed the hub in Sep, had been lost on a prior change, or never had one at all.

Anybody think the lack of a washer has a huge impact the torque & preload in the short term? (I'll pick up a replacement in a cpl weeks) If so, I'll swap the OE nut to the new hub side, and not care if the washerless nut on the the side with the old bearing causes premature wear/failure since it will be replaced soon too.

Thx :smile:
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Some have washers, some don't. Mine are the flange type without washers. I wouldn't worry about it.

See, I told about those Prime Crap hubs!
 

tcurlee

Well-Known Member
A lot of info on this thread ! I'd like to get an opinion of anyone who'd like to chime in. Sounds and feels like it's time for a wheel hub replace ( I'm thinking the L. side but I'm going to do both just b/c ). I went on Rockauto and the list goes :
Raybestos - Moog - Timken- ACDelco Advantage - ACD. OEM & SKF. Price goes up from Raybestos to SKF ( $95 to $163 ). Mine is an '05 Envoy with 185K + and I plan on keeping it. I don't so much mind paying for the SKF's if they're THAT much better but if there's a better or an 'as good ' option at a lower price - who wouldn't want to pay less ?! Any opinions would be appreciated.
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Whatever you choose, stay away from Raybestos. I had a VERY bad experience with them, one of which grenaded unexpectedly within a month or two, and the other made noise.

Timken is a safe bet and is a favourite. SKF is basically high end, with the price to match, and is a safe bet but not any better than Timken. I have no knowledge/data of the other ones.

I can however vouch for the Kinetic, which are available on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/Kinetic-513188-Hub-Bearing/dp/B00DGRN88K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1491510602&sr=8-1&keywords=513188+kinetic

At $62, not a bad deal at all. My only gripe with them is the brittle plastic for the wheel sensor wire clips so you have to be careful disconnecting them.

Be sure you check on Amazon as a lot of times, the prices are better than at RA.
https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=513188
 

tcurlee

Well-Known Member
Thanks Mooseman !! Sorry it's taken me so long to reply. I'll go with the Timken on your recommendation . And i'll check around for the best price.
 

tcurlee

Well-Known Member
Thanks Mooseman !! Sorry it's taken me so long to reply. I'll go with the Timken on your recommendation . And i'll check around for the best price.
update: Just installed my Timkins ( left & right ). Took a little longer than I thought it would. Those damn clips for the wire gave me a fit - I had to get rough with them ! Drives nice a quiet now !! Especially after i changed out the pulley underneath the alternator. You shoulda heard the noise that was making ! Funny how you just get used to noises and deal with them for way too long !!
 

07TrailyLS

Well-Known Member
Since this is a thread about bearing/hub assemblies I'll make it a point to say DO NOT but autozones top shelfers. Lifetime warranty yes. 140 USD a piece. I've gone through 4 of them in the last year and a half.. it's a shame
 

Tiggerr

Well-Known Member
Since this is a thread about bearing/hub assemblies I'll make it a point to say DO NOT but autozones top shelfers. Lifetime warranty yes. 140 USD a piece. I've gone through 4 of them in the last year and a half.. it's a shame
I've never seen anything worth buying at AZ..its all junk....
I won't even buy oil there..
Oil is cheaper at Walmart anyway lol
 
I have the ABS activation during a non-ABS stop, after recently installing Autozone bearing. It's been driving me bonkers! Well it's going back!!!!! Thanks guys!
 
Well replaced both wheel bearings & hubs today with the TRQ hubs. No more ABS activation during a non-ABS stop, and a lot smoother ride overall. Also returned the Autozone Duralast one back and got my $100+ back, the TRQ hubs are only $59.50 for TWO. what a touch, and they come with a lifetime warranty, compared to Autozone's two yrs.

:hijack:
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
At almost 202k km, one is starting to make the noise, seems to be the right side, gets a little worse when turning left and when braking. So just a little less than 50k, I would have expected more. I have the old Timkens from the 02 TB as spares that I can throw on when it gets warmer or if noise gets bad.
 

Chickenhawk

Well-Known Member
LOL. Yes, make sure you have two. For some strange reason, on our platforms it is more likely to be the left side. (Don't ask me how I know ... but I bought two Timken bearings at the same time, and the DHL courier from Amazon dropped them off on my front step pretty much as the old ones were off.)
 
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Mooseman

Mooseman

Moderator
Well, replaced it and it was the right side. It was loose and dry to spin by hand. And now that they're $74CAD, they are definitely not worth it. There are cheaper if you need cheap crap to sell the truck. Now I'll keep an eye open in the pick-a-parts for good used ones.
 

Hindsight

New Member
Well, replaced it and it was the right side. It was loose and dry to spin by hand. And now that they're $74CAD, they are definitely not worth it. There are cheaper if you need cheap crap to sell the truck. Now I'll keep an eye open in the pick-a-parts for good used ones.
For the money you did get 3 years out of them. For someone with vehicles that don't get driven that much it still seems like a fine alternative. Plus its gives a good reason to take your stuff apart every now and then for re-greasing, freeing bolts before they get grown together and whatnot. Putting the Power Stops hubs on my Tahoe 4x4 with a 2" Torsion re-key lift @ 188.000 miles ( that's 302,000 km for you Canucks) They got them for 29.95 a piece right now (05/05/2018) @ Rockauto, so $60 bucks to replace both sides just to make sure it is the wheel bearings in the first place is also reasonable. I put a full Power Stop Performance rotor and pad kit on my 2012 Ram 1500 reg cab and so far very sweet product.
 
Well replaced both wheel bearings & hubs today with the TRQ hubs. No more ABS activation during a non-ABS stop, and a lot smoother ride overall. Also returned the Autozone Duralast one back and got my $100+ back, the TRQ hubs are only $59.50 for TWO. what a touch, and they come with a lifetime warranty, compared to Autozone's two yrs.

:hijack:
7K miles and my TRQ's are still holding up.
 

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