GM: 91 Octane should be the 'standard'

Reprise

Lifetime VIP Supporter
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2018/03/gm-once-again-calls-for-premium-gasoline-to-become-new-standard/

Came across this tonight... I can see why GM would want to do it (it would help them & others reach CAFE numbers, for one thing).

Problem is, while the estimated 3% FE increase helps *them*, it would cost consumers much more than that per gallon / litre.
(and if refineries had to make as much 91 octane available, as they do 87 octane now - 91 would probably shoot up even more in price, since it's more costly to make)

In the article, GM states another reason to switch being that the US fleet is converting to higher FE / non-ICE vehicles (electric, fuel cell, etc.).
Someone needs to remind them that it takes about 20 YEARS on average, to turn over the fleet. Sheesh...

I know many complain about 87 octane, E10 / E15, etc. The US / Canada is pretty much the bastion of 'crap gas' (many other countries get higher octane (and more highly tuned engines as a result) - but they pay a LOT more for it (not all of it due to the refinery overhead.) Would you support GM's proposal?

I wonder how diesel would fare, if the above were to actually come to pass. Diesel is easier / cheaper to make than today's 87 octane, with about a 30% FE improvement on average (although new diesels also require the purchase of DEF in order to run, thanks to the US EPA.) That also assumes that enough diesel engines would be offered to meet expected demand (while they'd be cheaper to acquire than, say, a Tesla, it would require the automakers to make enough of them - and every one that they sold would delay the purchase of a non-ICE vehicle - so they'd be working against their own interests by doing so.)
 

Sparky

Moderator
When 91 used to be only ~20 cents more than 87, sure.

Now that they've decided in the past couple of years to make it upwards of 50-60 cents (or more!) a gallon... no.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Its 30 cents per grade upgrade here.

They will get it by adding ethanol again at likely more than 10% like some midwest states do. You can find 89 or 90 octane cheaper than 87 in some places but its dumber down with corn
 

Sparky

Moderator
It does seem to depend on the station. Most around here have decided to jack it way up. A rare few have not, and those are the ones I fill my Camaro up at. Screw those others.
 

littleblazer

Gold Supporter
It's 50-60 cents more here. Because gas tax that's about to get hiked again. Yay.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Around here you can get 87-89-91-92-93 and some 94. It varies alot as to what the jump in price for octane is. I know three places on the commute where it is 50 cents over 87 to their highest octane and I frequent them. But they vary in octane
 

Mooseman

Moderator
No. Just no. Here we pay through the nose for gas. Here's prices in US$/gal.

87: $3.50
89: $3.79
91: $3.97

So on a 20 gal. fillup, it basically costs $10 more (rounded up).

One more thing about Canadian gas at the moment, except at Petro-Canada, most premium 91 octane gas, at least here in Ontario, does not contain ethanol, which helps with mileage. That sometimes can offset the cost but usually not. If automakers can make vehicles more efficient that paying for 91 octane will be offset by fuel efficiency, it could work. If this were to happen, maybe the supply and demand rules would kick in and 91 would drop while 87 would rise as demand switches. However, knowing the petroleum industry, they won't unless legislated.
 

littleblazer

Gold Supporter
I just checked my local station while I was out. Regular was 2.45 and 92 was 2.95. For the most part everywhere is about the same (except sunoco because they're "special".) Bj's is usually 10 cents lower. If I'm in the area I stop for that reason alone.
 

Sparky

Moderator
I just checked my local station while I was out. Regular was 2.45 and 92 was 2.95. For the most part everywhere is about the same (except sunoco because they're "special".) Bj's is usually 10 cents lower. If I'm in the area I stop for that reason alone.
Haha Sunoco seems to think they're special. There is a Sunoco station near home that is $2.89 constantly, even though others may be $2.29. Almost never see any cars there, wonder how they stay in business. Weird.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Tax write-off for the mob probably
 

littleblazer

Gold Supporter
My truck pings on sunoco sometimes. So I try not to use it...

As for the pure gas @HARDTRAILZ We have three in the state. Two are LL AVgas. The other is 100 octane race gas at my local marina. Very hard finding ethanol free gas sadly.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
We have it at several country mark but none on typically on my routes. Sometimes i will make a side trip to get the good stuff though
 

Redbeard

Well-Known Member
The only place who regularly carries ethenal free around here are the WAWA's. I believe I paid 60¢ gallon more for it and didn't see any change in fuel economy or performance. So on 20 gallons add another $12.00. Back when I ran a nissan p.u. there was an exactly 10% loss of fuel economy when the ethanol was added to the gas. It was easy to tell if the gas companies "forgot" to place it into the fuel. I find it humorus the folks who go to the parts store to purchase products to rid any moisture in the fuel. Heck all it is is Alcholol-the same that is already IN THE GAS! Chemistry 101-alchohol is 100% misable with water. Heck back in the '70 we added a pint of alcholol to the fuel to help pass emissions test-it helped lower the nox's. But them days the fuel did regularly have water in it.
 

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