Counterfeit oil filter alert!

[Paul Bell]

I've been stocking Fleetguard filters for my vehicles for a good number of years now, I've always managed to find the upgraded media versions for my applications.

LF16104 is in question here, which is a tall filter for LS engines.

I ordered online and received three filters that are slightly shorter, have a single dumbed down stick-on label and fluted wrenching end.

The originals have all the marking printed on the can and the end is smooth.

The taller one seems to have a better paint job and it was plastic wrapped & sealed as these filters usually are.

The suspect ones weren't-and were in plain white boxes.

The date codes appear to be:

2010, 61st day for the suspect one.

2013, 277th day for the known good one.

The suspect filter was opened by my filter cutter in three turns.

The good one was very difficult, I ended up needing to put it to the grinding wheel to complete separating the can from the base. The can material as well as the base and number of threads on the good one is thicker.

The bad one is well made inside like a Hastings but is just simple filter media. It sliced like paper.

The good one has the correct Stratapore filter media backed by a thin cloth mesh backed by a steel screen. The white filter media is cotton like and was difficult to cut, I needed to saw the razor knife through it.

THE VERDICT: The suspect one is certainly a counterfeit.

I purchased these from filterbarn.com. Never again!

 

[NJTB]

I remember getting brake pads in an AC Delco original box, unopened, bought from a dealer. After installing them, the car just wouldn't stop. From experience I knew this was cheap brake pads.
After raising hell and alot of effort, it turned out they were knockoffs. The only way to tell was how the glue on the box was applied to the end flaps of the box. Two dots of glue-AC Delco. One stripe of glue-knockoffs.
Turned out the dealer went to a supplier who said he could get great prices on AC delco parts, and wanted to make a bit more money.
Sad to see it's still going on.

 

[Paul Bell]

That sucks, they open themselves up to liability issues when they do that. A GM dealership is supposed to be the most secure supplier of genuine parts.

At one time, counterfeit fasteners were discovered on the space shuttle. It turned out they were sourced from a low bidder who had buckets of Chinese bolts in his garage.

I've always heard the John Deere supply chain is the model of secure parts.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

Tires n now oil filters...the knockoffs are alive and scary!

 

[Capote]

It's frightening hearing about counterfeit parts, i'm definitely going to pay closer attention for parts I order or buy in the future.

 

[djthumper]

Next a counterfeit Trailblazer... Oh hey!

 

[BlazingTrails]

So are you getting a refund?

 

[Paul Bell]

So are you getting a refund?

No, I'm not even contacting filterbarn. No doubt it'll turn into a pissing match. I have three that were ten bucks each so no great loss. One I cut open, one I'm probably gonna send to Fleetguard the other I'll keep intact.

If they send a follow-up email thanking me for the order or email sales offerings I'll sock it to them.

 

[Paul Bell]

Having said all this, I'd like to state that I'm obviously pretty anal about my oil filters. My goal is to use on all my vehicles the old school size that matches ACDelco's PF35, which is a fat & tall big block filter. Eventually, my truck will have a remote filter and oil cooler. My Trans Am has this setup and so did my last truck, a '03 Blazer.

Fleetguard filters come in two styles, "normal" which are like a Wix/Hastings/Mobil1 media which is great or the "upgraded" Stratapore synthetic media which is what I pictured here.

Royal Purple filters are just about identical to the upgraded Fleetguard so pretty much anybody can find filters of this grade. Amsoil EO filters (by WIX) are also very good but not on the level of the better Fleetguard and similar Royal Purple filters.

 

[Mooseman]

Who knows, maybe Cummins might thank you with some free filters. Anyway, good info on the filters for these engines. I couldn't believe how small the stock filter was (I used a Wix). Finding these Fleetguard filters in Canada is going to be harder as there don't seem to be any online retailers here. There are a couple of local truck supply shops but the price is likely to be horrendous. If they are around $15 in the US, in Canada they could be around $25.

I wonder if these filters fro Alibaba are genuine
http://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-fleetguard-filter.html

 

[Paul Bell]

Hey Mooseman, $16 is about right for that filter. Fleetguard offers an upgraded version with the synthetic media as part number LF3363. This is a pretty large filter with a 1-1/2 inch thread, what's it for? Looks to be a Cummins diesel on some construction vehicle?

 

[Paul Bell]

(I was assuming you were looking at the LF670)

 

[Mooseman]

The LF16104 seems more to my liking. The LF670 is way too long. How is the LF16104 diameter wise? The stock one is so small my old oil filter wrench couldn't grab it (worked fine on my 4.2). I had to use the filter wrench for my snowmobile. I just want a bigger and longer filter that will fit the stock location.

BTW, here's a trick I use. I take apart old computer hard drives and take out the magnets. I use them on the filter to trap metal particles. They are super strong and they stay put.

 

[Paul Bell]

It's just over 4-1/2 inches tall. You won't get a filter wrench on it, it gets pretty close to the cross bar under the filter but it does fit.

 

[Paul Bell]

Mooseman, I had it on a lift today, the filter has about a 1/2 inch clearance to that frame member:

 

[Mooseman]

Excellent! If I can't get the Fleetguard, do these sound right as cross reference?

NAPA 1522; PUROLATOR L25288; WIX 51522

 

[Paul Bell]

As I'd pass on the NAPA or Purolator, I looked up the WIX. The 51522 is a hair shorter than the Fleetguard so it'll fit like mine.

Reminder: You won't get a filter wrench of any kind on it.

The Wix 51522 is available in their XP version with a wire backed synthetic media. I'd go for that one. I'm even gonna get one to look inside.

 

[BlazingTrails]

Just thought I would share that napa filters are made by wix. Wix are great filters.

 

[Mooseman]

Apparently they are. Looking at some videos of them being cup open, they look to be the same construction.

 

[Paul Bell]

Yeah, Wix makes a lot of filters for NAPA as well as CarQuest but I don't think Wix's best (the XP line) can be had in their other brands.

My brother's oldest friend is a Wix rep, I'll try to get some info from him.

 

[Paul Bell]

I've found that the Royal Purple 20-59 filter is the same height as the above filters at just about 4.5 inches.

 

[Mooseman]

Lots of good info here. There should be a thread for oil filter comparisons and cross references.

 

[BlazingTrails]

Curious if anyone has ever used mann filter? I used to run them in my Mercedes a few years ago. I wonder how well they are constructed.....

http://www.carid.com/2009-chevy-trailblazer-engine-parts/mann-filter-spin-on-oil-filter-20569881.html

 

[JayWildChevy]

Thanks for the info!

Is there a "Buyer Beware" thread? Maybe we can have a permanent Buyer Beware thread or even forum category. I'd love to avoid buying from scammers, or at least, bad sellers who do not use due diligence in the products they sell.

I'm adding fleetbarn to my permanent "beware" list.

It's hard enough finding a trustworthy mechanic, now people are selling fake parts.

 

[IllogicTC]

Thanks for the info!

Is there a "Buyer Beware" thread? Maybe we can have a permanent Buyer Beware thread or even forum category. I'd love to avoid buying from scammers, or at least, bad sellers who do not use due diligence in the products they sell.

I'm adding fleetbarn to my permanent "beware" list.

It's hard enough finding a trustworthy mechanic, now people are selling fake parts.

I think fake parts have been floating around for quite a while, in various shapes and sizes and with various logos on them.

 

[Mooseman]

The Mann filters seem to be decent except the bypass valve is at the end of the filter so if it goes into bypass mode, it can pick up dirt from the filter media. This video explains it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ANmG5PXWMg

By the way, you could spend days watching videos on opened up filters and comparisons.

 

[Aarkon]

Just thought I would share that napa filters are made by wix. Wix are great filters.

Carquest filters are also made by wix for now eventually they will become Baldwin which im not very excited about

 

[Paul Bell]

Yes, MANN filters are pretty good quality-aside from that issue, which is probably model specific.

Hastings, NAPA Gold, Wix, K&N, Mobil1, and a few others are pretty good filters but all have standard paper filtering media. There are some filters that are flat out crap: Fram, STP, Penzoil, Walmart...

I'm only concerned with the filters with better filter media and support like the Fleetguard with the Stratapore media.

To really judge an oil filter, you'd need to open it up brand new un-used.

 

[Mooseman]

Has anybody heard of these microGreen Oil Filters?
http://www.microgreenfilter.com/

Says that they are an extended filter for use by fleets that can extend the oil change interval to 30 000 miles. Looking at the construction, it looks like a regular paper cellulose filter with a micro fiber filter on the end where the bypass is. Now even if this filter does keep the oil itself cleaner longer, wouldn't the oil itself break down over time? The additives package would just get used up wouldn't it?

Price isn't too bad, $35 for two.

 

[Bow_Tied]

Sorry if this is a newbie question - how do the OEM filters compare that I'd buy at my dealer to the ones proposed here?

Also, I am not familiar with the stratapore media; what makes it better? Does it have a finer micron rating?
Just trying to learn, I am really new to LS engines.

 

[Mooseman]

ACDelco filters? They're on par with Fram. Made by Champion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0wQ9Xzy8mg

OEM doesn't mean better. Honda's filters are now made by Fram! Cheap filter at a premium price.

 

[Paul Bell]

heeheehee Moose, I just posted that very video on LS1tech after some guy said ACDelco was almost the same as Amsoil EA filters & Wix.

I'm only on these forums to learn myself and to reduce false and/or incorrect information from spreading.

Bow_Tied, the Stratapore filters from Fleetguard are pretty good, I believe the micron rating gets lower (finer) as the oil passes deeper through the material.

You can't go wrong reaching for any Wix, Mobil1 Extended, Hastings or K&N filter. They'll always be well made from the proper parts and not made by a sub contractor using crappy parts. Most ACDelco parts can't be trusted anymore since they were spun off by GM after the bankruptcy and they were known as AC-Delco (note the hyphen).

The thing about oil filters is you can't see what's inside them.

Moose, it's disappointing to hear Honda turned to Fram. When oil is on sale at AutoZone or Pep Boys with a Fram filter, I leave the filter behind on the counter.

 

[Bow_Tied]

Thanks. I use K&N in my Chevelle I guess I should use it on everything. I love that 1" nut, makes removal soooo easy lol.

 

[Paul Bell]

 

[Mounce]

Dang that's a rip off on a cap. Where'd you see that?

 

[Mooseman]

The K&N might not fit on the 5.3, at least the longer one, because of that nut if you look at the pic Paul Bell posted, unless you use the regular length filter but even then, I don't think that nut would help. Pretty tight in there.

I still have to see how much those Fleetguard filters are here.

 

[Bow_Tied]

You mean no room for the socket or it would interfere with just the filter?

 

[Mooseman]

It could actually interfere as the crossmember is close. With the regular length filter, a socket and extensions would probably work.

 

[Bow_Tied]

I understand long filter = more media which is better. For a daily driver vehicle not on dirt roads ever do I need the long filter?

 

[Mounce]

I understand long filter = more media which is better. For a daily driver vehicle not on dirt roads ever do I need the long filter?

Why would dirt roads decide what filter you need? Dirt doesn't get in the oil unless you put it in there....