Envoy Spare Tire Hoist (Winch)

jlbjlb

Original poster
Member
Mar 31, 2012
3
Hey Gang - this is my first post on the new site. I've learned a lot on the old site and thought I would share my experience with the spare tire hoist, winch and cable that is used on Envoys and I'm assuming Trailblazers.

NOTE: This fix will only work if you have your spare tire already off of the truck.

Step 1: With the spare tire off, crawl under the back-end of the vehicle and unbolt the entire spare tire hoist assembly (the pic below is a new one for reference only). There are only 3 bolts and it's best if you hit them with PB Blaster in advance. There is only one bolt on the side that attaches to the frame support and a notch in the frame where the unit rests, so you may have to hit it with a hammer to release. The top of the pulley unit is plastic and will more than likely have a crack in it - probably on the edge, so be careful when removing.

View attachment 20006

Step 2: Now that you have the entire assembly off of the vehicle, lock it into a vice upside down (see pic). The top plastic housing is held in place by 5 or 6 rivets (sorry, I forgot to count how many when I removed). With the unit upside down and secure, grind down the end of the rivets so that they are flush with the back of the assembly.

View attachment 20007

Step 3: Once you have all of the rivet heads ground down flush, use a punch and a hammer to hammer them out. I moved the pulley unit in the vice so that the pulley shaft was being held instead of the cable tube. This will give the unit support while you are punching out those old rivets. You may have to move the unit around to get to all the rivets and it's probably best to have a friend holding the opposite end or have it supported in some fashion.

View attachment 20011

Step 4: Now that all the rivets have been removed, carefully flip the entire unit over and remove the plastic housing. There is a post that is inside the assembly and that appears to be what my cable got caught up on (see pic).

View attachment 20008

Step 5: With the plastic housing off, I suggest that you take a picture of the insides and/or remove the 3 or 4 plates and make notes of how it is put together. You're going to have to try and pull that cable free and there is a possibility that then you do all those parts will go flying. Again, a friend helping you at this point would be good. Have one person hold down the metal plates on the pulley and have the other person pull the opposite end of the cable. What you're trying to do is release the tangled up cable.

View attachment 20009

Step 6: With the cable pulled out of the pulley, try to straighten out as much as possible since you will more than likely have knots in the cable (see pic). I used lineman's pliers to slowly crimp the cable straight. You're not going to get the cable perfect, but you want to work the kinks and knots out.

View attachment 20010

Step 7: WIth the cable as straight as you can get it, put the plastic housing back on and use bolts and nuts to replace the rivets that you hammered out. DO NOT TRY WINDING THE CABLE UP UNTIL YOU HAVE THE UNIT BACK ON THE VEHICLE.

Step 8: Attach the entire unit back on the vehicle in the reverse order that you removed.

Step 9: Now that everything is attached and untangled, put the spare tire back on the truck using the crank just like you normally would.

NOTE: When my buddy and I were working on this, we figured out that the reason this happened and is probably happening to so many other people, is that the wheel is being put on wrong. When cranking the spare tire back up under the vehicle, MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THE OUTSIDE OF THE WHEEL FACING DOWN. If you do it in reverse, the distance is different and you will bunch up the cable inside the assembly again.

I know that this solution may not work for everyone, but we got this fixed in under 40 minutes. Beats having to pay $125 for a new one.

Peace... out.
 

Attachments

  • envoyHoist.jpg
    envoyHoist.jpg
    52.2 KB · Views: 438
  • envoySpare2.jpg
    envoySpare2.jpg
    49.6 KB · Views: 47
  • envoySpare5.jpg
    envoySpare5.jpg
    41.9 KB · Views: 45
  • envoySpare3.jpg
    envoySpare3.jpg
    59.7 KB · Views: 46
  • envoySpare4.jpg
    envoySpare4.jpg
    37.4 KB · Views: 40
  • envoySpare6.jpg
    envoySpare6.jpg
    57.1 KB · Views: 46

Mooseman

Moderator
Dec 4, 2011
25,335
Ottawa, ON
This was an interesting write up. My only concern is using a damaged cable. For a safety item as this, wouldn't be better to replace it?
 

Wooluf1952

Member
Nov 20, 2011
2,663
Milwaukee, Wisconsin


NOTE: When my buddy and I were working on this, we figured out that the reason this happened and is probably happening to so many other people, is that the wheel is being put on wrong. When cranking the spare tire back up under the vehicle,
MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THE OUTSIDE OF THE WHEEL FACING DOWN. If you do it in reverse, the distance is different and you will bunch up the cable inside the assembly again.

If that works for you great. However, according to the owners manual. it is supposed to be mounted with the face and valve stem up.

My theory is when people lower the spare, they keep unwinding and the cable gets tangled inside the spool.

Kind of like when the line on a fishing reel gets tangled. :twocents:


Also:

:tiphat: Welcome:tiphat:

In case you haven't heard:
http://gmtnation.com/f5/welcome-gmtnation-com-heres-story-226/
 

jlbjlb

Original poster
Member
Mar 31, 2012
3
Mooseman said:
This was an interesting write up. My only concern is using a damaged cable. For a safety item as this, wouldn't be better to replace it?

Agreed - if that cable is toast, you should replace with a new one.
 

jlbjlb

Original poster
Member
Mar 31, 2012
3
Wooluf1952 said:


NOTE: When my buddy and I were working on this, we figured out that the reason this happened and is probably happening to so many other people, is that the wheel is being put on wrong. When cranking the spare tire back up under the vehicle,
MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THE OUTSIDE OF THE WHEEL FACING DOWN. If you do it in reverse, the distance is different and you will bunch up the cable inside the assembly again.

If that works for you great. However, according to the owners manual. it is supposed to be mounted with the face and valve stem up.

My theory is when people lower the spare, they keep unwinding and the cable gets tangled inside the spool.

Kind of like when the line on a fishing reel gets tangled. :twocents:

i agree with this too, but i guess to be safe with regard to the cable getting tangled,*upside down won't cause the cable to bunch up.
 

northcreek

Member
Jan 15, 2012
3,319
WNY
"that works for you great. However, according to the owners manual. it is supposed to be mounted with the face and valve stem up."

Yes,the manual states that in order for the secondary safety latch to work properly,the tire must be face and valve up.I KNOW IT SEEMS BACKWARDS BUT,THAT'S WHAT GM IS SAYING....Mike.
 

Mark20

Member
Dec 6, 2011
1,630
With the damaged cable the secondary safety becomes more important.
 

Mooseman

Moderator
Dec 4, 2011
25,335
Ottawa, ON
The problem is that the secondary latch is of a poor design and fails to release on a regular basis due to corrosion. Why do our trucks have them anyway? My 08 Montana doesn't have one. In the past, the problem was the cable corroding and letting spares drop while driving but have since been switched to stainless cables. Just bringing down the spare and checking the cable once in a while is enough, and while you're at it, lube it with some grease. Oh, and I also have the spare valve facing down for two reasons, the secondary lock doesn't work and to be able to check the pressure more easily.

Probably the cable got damaged when the secondary failed to release (as usual) and the person just kept cranking, eventually getting the cable mangled inside the crank.
 

Envoy09

Member
Mar 26, 2012
57
I just took out the spare wheel for the first time after buying the vehicle brand new and the valve stem faces upwards, and that's what the owners' manual too says.
 

Mooseman

Moderator
Dec 4, 2011
25,335
Ottawa, ON
I would imagine that there isn't a lot of rain and even less snow in Kuwait :biggrin:. For us in pretty much anywhere non-desert, we have issues with rust and the secondary latch jams on a regular basis, especially when you need it most :mad:
 

Envoy09

Member
Mar 26, 2012
57
Mooseman said:
I would imagine that there isn't a lot of rain and even less snow in Kuwait :biggrin:. For us in pretty much anywhere non-desert, we have issues with rust and the secondary latch jams on a regular basis, especially when you need it most :mad:

I've got lot of experience with rains & rust issues. I'm from southern India where we got lots of rain :smile: Kuwait is just where I work and yes, here there are no rust issues at all.....only the fear of tires or some other part succumbing to the heat :biggrin:
 

mcc

Member
Apr 8, 2012
49
Any tips on getting the notch unstuck from the frame with the tire still installed? I've had to resort to unbolting the winch because the cable is tangled beyond hope and the secondary latch is jammed. I've tried kicking the tire in a direction from the driver's side taillight toward the rear passenger-side door. There's a metal bar behind the rear diff that's making it impossible for me to push the tire far enough to release the notch. I can't get behind it with enough leverage to meaningfully use any kind of tool on it either.

I plan on installing the tire backwards once I get the new winch in. The entire design is a failure and the secondary latch seems to exist only to make retrieving the spare an exercise in futility.
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
If you can get the center "plunger" to push upward that will release it. Issue is that part tends to rust and jam up.

This thread reminds me that I need to check mine again. It's been perfect ever since I replaced the unit but I don't want to forget about it and then have it jam.
 

Wooluf1952

Member
Nov 20, 2011
2,663
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
mcc said:
Any tips on getting the notch unstuck from the frame with the tire still installed? I've had to resort to unbolting the winch because the cable is tangled beyond hope and the secondary latch is jammed. I've tried kicking the tire in a direction from the driver's side taillight toward the rear passenger-side door. There's a metal bar behind the rear diff that's making it impossible for me to push the tire far enough to release the notch. I can't get behind it with enough leverage to meaningfully use any kind of tool on it either.

I plan on installing the tire backwards once I get the new winch in. The entire design is a failure and the secondary latch seems to exist only to make retrieving the spare an exercise in futility.

First:
tiphat.gif
Welcome
tiphat.gif


In case you haven't
heard:
http://gmtnation.com/f5/welcome-gmtnation-com-heres-story-226/




Did you try the directions in the owners manual?

Put the jack under the middle of the secondary latch and jack it up.
 

mcc

Member
Apr 8, 2012
49
Thanks, but I've tried jacking up the center post roughly 10 times, soaking the mechanism with WD-40 and eventually PB Blaster. It's completely jammed.

Thanks for the welcome!
 

mcc

Member
Apr 8, 2012
49
I finally got it off- I took the bolt holding the winch to the frame off again, jacked up the tire to take strain off the tab, and hit the tab a bunch with a 4lb blacksmith hammer with a long handle. Then I took the jack off and gave it a few good kicks to get the winch/tire off. After that I was able to get at the latch mechanism and get the tire off of the winch itself.
 

pbagley

Member
Oct 19, 2012
7
Thank you for posting all of the above. My winch got stuck with the tire about 2" down, won't go up or down. Case is cracked, cable is balled up inside there. I think I need to cut the cable.
 

meerschm

Member
Aug 26, 2012
1,079
mine was stuck, I got it to move, but it would only drop around 2 inches. I picked it up from there a bit with a jack ( I used a floor jack and short board) and then could jiggle it to release from the secondary latch.

I just ordered a new latch assy, ( $110 plus shipping) from autopartscheaper.com since mine was pretty well shot from corrosion.

gave the spare wheel a quick wire brush and coat of rustoleum primer and black paint. also used some cold galvanizing on the rusty spots around the mount. the tire got a coat of some tire shine. (next year when I get new tires, I will replace the unused ten year old spare with one of the other ones, which are half that age.) original spare is same size as the others and still has the paper label on it. also has dents in the sidewall where it was pressed up.

The latch is there to keep flying spare tires from heading all over the freeway system. would make a sad day to see one flying at your windshield. if you decide to mount it upside down, i would rig up some kind of safety cable to limit the distance if the latch fails.
 

pbagley

Member
Oct 19, 2012
7
meerschm said:
I just ordered a new latch assy, ( $110 plus shipping) from autopartscheaper.com since mine was pretty well shot from corrosion.

Thanks for the lead on a new latch assembly. I'll see if mine can be saved, I have my doubts.
 

meerschm

Member
Aug 26, 2012
1,079
View attachment 23520

This is the old one

View attachment 23521

Close up

View attachment 23522

and the new one, nice and clean.

looking back, not sure why I called it a latch assy. must have been a long day. part order details:

Code Item Qty Price Grand Total
25911640 2002-2009 GMC Envoy Chevrolet Trailblazer New Spare Tire Mounting Hoist OEM 1 $109.95 $109.95


I had to run to the auto parts store for a 10mm 1.5 nut

the original captive one broke when I attempted to tighten it back. snapped off the mount. Gee I guess it was rusty too.
 

Attachments

  • 100_3007.jpg
    100_3007.jpg
    97.9 KB · Views: 11
  • 100_3008.jpg
    100_3008.jpg
    96.2 KB · Views: 11
  • 100_3009.jpg
    100_3009.jpg
    94.1 KB · Views: 12

Taz6056

Member
Dec 21, 2011
49
I have already replaced my hoist once, so now I am in the habit at every oil change(5000 miles) I drop the spare to check the air pressure in the tire and run antiseize on the mechanism liberally.

Marc.
 
Feb 24, 2012
133
Taz6056 said:
I have already replaced my hoist once, so now I am in the habit at every oil change(5000 miles) I drop the spare to check the air pressure in the tire and run antiseize on the mechanism liberally.

Marc.

Apparently my Yukon has the same (or very similar) spare tire cable. It also has the secondary safety which is what bound up the one time I needed to get my spare tire off. I replaced the entire assy and now drop the spare and lube the mechanism at every oil change too. At least I can pretend to know it will work when I need it (which will be, by Murphy's law, never again)...
 

nedmacd

Member
Aug 26, 2013
1
I am a new visitor to GMT Nation. Just got my 2002 GMC Envoy spare tire off the secondary latch which is guaranteed to be the problem with spare tires hanging loose but unable to move up or down. The best advice I found was this you tube video ([video=youtube;qhZ2LP7nfLU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhZ2LP7nfLU[/video]). I had to watch and listen to the video 8 or 9 times before I understood and could release the secondary latch with a pair of channel locks. When your spare tire is hung up on that latch, it is not coming off without either releasing the latch or cutting off the ball and/or bracket suspending the tire. Once you have the tire off anybody who has a socket wrench and 5 minutes can find the 3 bolts holding the winch to the frame and a cross member remove them and remove and replace the old winch. As someone else in this thread said, trying to use an old winch and damaged cable is not a good idea because it doesn't work once dirty, but in good condition and has less chance of working with a damaged winch or cable. I live in Michigan - we use salt on snow and ice. My underbody was not that dirty and cruddy but obviously it was enough to cause that cable and secondary latch to hang up like everyone else who is looking at this thread. I am a retired GM engineer and proud to say I had nothing to do with this winch design and particularly its location with brutal exposure to whatever splashes up under the rear underbody. My secondary latch was all rusted and my cable was all twisted up inside the winch but the safety latch was fully engaged and not letting go so the tire was absolutely safe but the winch didn't work - a very bad design.
jlbjlb said:
Hey Gang - this is my first post on the new site. I've learned a lot on the old site and thought I would share my experience with the spare tire hoist, winch and cable that is used on Envoys and I'm assuming Trailblazers.

NOTE: This fix will only work if you have your spare tire already off of the truck.

Step 1: With the spare tire off, crawl under the back-end of the vehicle and unbolt the entire spare tire hoist assembly (the pic below is a new one for reference only). There are only 3 bolts and it's best if you hit them with PB Blaster in advance. There is only one bolt on the side that attaches to the frame support and a notch in the frame where the unit rests, so you may have to hit it with a hammer to release. The top of the pulley unit is plastic and will more than likely have a crack in it - probably on the edge, so be careful when removing.

View attachment 5563

Step 2: Now that you have the entire assembly off of the vehicle, lock it into a vice upside down (see pic). The top plastic housing is held in place by 5 or 6 rivets (sorry, I forgot to count how many when I removed). With the unit upside down and secure, grind down the end of the rivets so that they are flush with the back of the assembly.

View attachment 5564

Step 3: Once you have all of the rivet heads ground down flush, use a punch and a hammer to hammer them out. I moved the pulley unit in the vice so that the pulley shaft was being held instead of the cable tube. This will give the unit support while you are punching out those old rivets. You may have to move the unit around to get to all the rivets and it's probably best to have a friend holding the opposite end or have it supported in some fashion.

View attachment 5569

Step 4: Now that all the rivets have been removed, carefully flip the entire unit over and remove the plastic housing. There is a post that is inside the assembly and that appears to be what my cable got caught up on (see pic).

View attachment 5566

Step 5: With the plastic housing off, I suggest that you take a picture of the insides and/or remove the 3 or 4 plates and make notes of how it is put together. You're going to have to try and pull that cable free and there is a possibility that then you do all those parts will go flying. Again, a friend helping you at this point would be good. Have one person hold down the metal plates on the pulley and have the other person pull the opposite end of the cable. What you're trying to do is release the tangled up cable.

View attachment 5567

Step 6: With the cable pulled out of the pulley, try to straighten out as much as possible since you will more than likely have knots in the cable (see pic). I used lineman's pliers to slowly crimp the cable straight. You're not going to get the cable perfect, but you want to work the kinks and knots out.

View attachment 5568

Step 7: WIth the cable as straight as you can get it, put the plastic housing back on and use bolts and nuts to replace the rivets that you hammered out. DO NOT TRY WINDING THE CABLE UP UNTIL YOU HAVE THE UNIT BACK ON THE VEHICLE.

Step 8: Attach the entire unit back on the vehicle in the reverse order that you removed.

Step 9: Now that everything is attached and untangled, put the spare tire back on the truck using the crank just like you normally would.

NOTE: When my buddy and I were working on this, we figured out that the reason this happened and is probably happening to so many other people, is that the wheel is being put on wrong. When cranking the spare tire back up under the vehicle, MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THE OUTSIDE OF THE WHEEL FACING DOWN. If you do it in reverse, the distance is different and you will bunch up the cable inside the assembly again.

I know that this solution may not work for everyone, but we got this fixed in under 40 minutes. Beats having to pay $125 for a new one.

Peace... out.
 

kickass audio

Member
Aug 25, 2012
955
Just a little tip for what I did to my truck to get the tire off when the secondary latch is engaged is to get a little flat head screw driver that is the width of the locking mechanism like around 1/4" and push on it from the side. To know which side to press in on if you look at the under side where the cable attaches to the main knuckle (if thats what its called idk, im trying to describe the part where the secondary latch resides and where the winch cable comes through) you will notice that this piece is oblong, the side that is wider is the side you need to push in with a screw driver. Only one side will work so what I do is I turn down the tire and when I see it can't drop any further I pull up the tire 2 full turns, then I get under the truck and stick my screw driver in on the secondary latch and pry inward on it and then reach out while still holding the lock in and turn the winch to lower the tire. If you get the wrong side and it doesn't go down just go on the opposite side of the knuckle and follow it upward and push in on it to release it then lower it. Im sorry its hard to describe it until you do it but its not hard to do. I put a ton of bearing grease on my entire cable and I soaked the locking mechanism with pb blaster as well as the connection where the rod goes through the bumper to ensure everything is lubricated. I only drop my tire once a year and have had no issues.
 

meerschm

Member
Aug 26, 2012
1,079
nedmacd said:
I am a new visitor to GMT Nation. Just got my 2002 GMC Envoy spare tire off the secondary latch which is guaranteed to be the problem with spare tires hanging loose but unable to move up or down. The best advice I found was this you tube video ([video=youtube;qhZ2LP7nfLU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhZ2LP7nfLU[/video]). I had to watch and listen to the video 8 or 9 times before I understood and could release the secondary latch with a pair of channel locks. When your spare tire is hung up on that latch, it is not coming off without either releasing the latch or cutting off the ball and/or bracket suspending the tire. Once you have the tire off anybody who has a socket wrench and 5 minutes can find the 3 bolts holding the winch to the frame and a cross member remove them and remove and replace the old winch. As someone else in this thread said, trying to use an old winch and damaged cable is not a good idea because it doesn't work once dirty, but in good condition and has less chance of working with a damaged winch or cable. I live in Michigan - we use salt on snow and ice. My underbody was not that dirty and cruddy but obviously it was enough to cause that cable and secondary latch to hang up like everyone else who is looking at this thread. I am a retired GM engineer and proud to say I had nothing to do with this winch design and particularly its location with brutal exposure to whatever splashes up under the rear underbody. My secondary latch was all rusted and my cable was all twisted up inside the winch but the safety latch was fully engaged and not letting go so the tire was absolutely safe but the winch didn't work - a very bad design.

that is not how the wheel is supposed to mount. if you put outside down, the secondary catch will not operate.

the outside of the tire/wheel goes up.
 

Mooseman

Moderator
Dec 4, 2011
25,335
Ottawa, ON
I put the wheel upside down for two reasons. One is to prevent the secondary latch from getting hooked up. It's not needed as the cable is made of stainless steel and won't break. This was added as a knee jerk reaction after a few lost their spares in the past when they were using cheap steel cables that rusted out. My '08 Montana doesn't have a secondary latch. Second is so that I can check the spare tire's pressure without having to drop it.

It's a completely useless system. Has anybody heard of a spare tire that was prevented from falling on a highway because of it? No.
 

meerschm

Member
Aug 26, 2012
1,079
Just pointing out the design.

if you want to mount upside down and skip the secondary latch, that is between you and the OPP.

If someone wants to make an informed decision, that is fine, but no different than putting the spare on the roof and securing with some home grown tie down.

you are modifying the design and are responsible for the outcome.

enjoy.

:smile:
 

Forum Statistics

Threads
23,321
Posts
637,914
Members
18,526
Latest member
GODSBROOKS