So depressed....

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
Yeah, I'd almost be crazy not to get Phantom 2 toned for only $200 extra. I like the deep dark red on the bottom and black on the top. I'm trying to keep boy-ish/Phantom-ish colors.

I thought about doing 2 toned like Harmless, but that would just be weird lol
 

Denali n DOO

Member
May 22, 2012
5,596
Voymom said:
Yeah, I'd almost be crazy not to get Phantom 2 toned for only $200 extra. I like the deep dark red on the bottom and black on the top. I'm trying to keep boy-ish/Phantom-ish colors.

I thought about doing 2 toned like Harmless, but that would just be weird lol

I thought you were thinking of Pink?
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523

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HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Is he doing the door jambs and everything? Because materials alone to two-tone right with decent paint is probably more than the $200.

Find out if this is a "good" paint job or just a respray. Is the truck coming apart so everything is done properly. bumpers, doors, trim, seals, lights and such removed so it can be fully painted?

Look at this thread

http://gmtnation.com/f67/my-68-gto-build-4866/

Thats what it takes for a good paint job.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
HARDTRAILZ said:
Is he doing the door jambs and everything? Because materials alone to two-tone right with decent paint is probably more than the $200.

Find out if this is a "good" paint job or just a respray. Is the truck coming apart so everything is done properly. bumpers, doors, trim, seals, lights and such removed so it can be fully painted?

Look at this thread

http://gmtnation.com/f67/my-68-gto-build-4866/

Thats what it takes for a good paint job.

From what I seen when I walked into his shop yes...He was in the process of prepping a Semi truck cab for a custom job, and he had everything ripped apart, and certain area's taped or covered with a clear plastic. A guy I run into when picking the kids up from school had his s-10 painted there(single color), but everything was painted, including door jambs. Now I know just because he did a good job on the s-10 doesn't mean shit, but he had the semi torn apart, doors were taken off, bumper was off, lights were out, and the backside where a trailer would connect to was covered up in plastic and taped.

If he doesn't take the time to do mine like that, I will be taking the truck back, and having it done through the warranty. But as far as what I seen, he does take a number of things apart. In fact I was surprised by it because I didn't realize how much a vehicle had to be torn down in order to be painted.

I'll have to go in and get a picture of his price list....2 tone says to add an extra $200 for labor, so like you said, it would likely be more than just labor costs after he purchases the materials to do it. Even still, it's not a bad price, if I can budget it in, I will do it, if not I'm perfectly fine with just a black truck.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Voymom said:
If he doesn't take the time to do mine like that, I will be taking the truck back, and having it done through the warranty. But as far as what I seen, he does take a number of things apart. In fact I was surprised by it because I didn't realize how much a vehicle had to be torn down in order to be painted.

Who enforces, or who stands behind, or what company sells, this warranty? Is it just a piece of paper he had drawn up and him and his brother sign it? Is it backed back a reputable warranty company like used car warranties? You can say you will just get it warrantied, but if it is only his warranty...he can easily say, sorry, but you got what you paid for. Then your options are to spend a few 1000 to take him to court or make scene/threaten him/terrorize his shop and likely end up in jail and paying for fines and damages.

Make sure this is a legit warranty and there are protocols and steps and people behind it. I know plenty of companies...esp contractors and builders that did business for years and gave word of mouth or their own signed warranties and when the work failed or they really go taken to task...they skipped town. And these were not fly-by-night contractors, but some decades old. I have been in real estate for 15 years and know of several builders that would be strung up if the people they did "budget" work or home building for could find them now.

I know you said he has been around for awhile, but if he decides not to honor the warranty...what are your options?
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
HARDTRAILZ said:
Who enforces, or who stands behind, or what company sells, this warranty? Is it just a piece of paper he had drawn up and him and his brother sign it? Is it backed back a reputable warranty company like used car warranties? You can say you will just get it warrantied, but if it is only his warranty...he can easily say, sorry, but you got what you paid for. Then your options are to spend a few 1000 to take him to court or make scene/threaten him/terrorize his shop and likely end up in jail and paying for fines and damages.

Make sure this is a legit warranty and there are protocols and steps and people behind it. I know plenty of companies...esp contractors and builders that did business for years and gave word of mouth or their own signed warranties and when the work failed or they really go taken to task...they skipped town. And these were not fly-by-night contractors, but some decades old. I have been in real estate for 15 years and know of several builders that would be strung up if the people they did "budget" work or home building for could find them now.

I know you said he has been around for awhile, but if he decides not to honor the warranty...what are your options?

Hmm...You know I didn't think of that. I didn't know that warranties were backed by different people/companies, or that it should be/matter. I will have to look into that now, and do some asking of questions where it pertains to this warranty. That is a very good point, and I'm glad you brought that up. I always figured an agreement was an agreement, and as long as you had proof from the other party with signatures you had a legal binding kind of like a rental agreement. I will ask my step mom, she is an attorney and I can have her look over the warranty to make sure I understand it fully as well.

I know he has been in the same location doing auto body and paint for 15 years, so I would think if he was going to up and scoot out of town over something like this he would have already done it, but then again I guess anything is possible. I have plenty of time to ask my questions and do further research on him and his company before I take the truck in anyways. We have to wait until Mat has his TB anyways, that way we at least have one vehicle for transportation.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
It may be binding, but to get it honored or enforced may cost more than the paint job.

Be nice if he had several customers you could talk to and see his work in person...esp to see how it holds up and if any of them needed the warranty.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
HARDTRAILZ said:
It may be binding, but to get it honored or enforced may cost more than the paint job.

Be nice if he had several customers you could talk to and see his work in person...esp to see how it holds up and if any of them needed the warranty.

I guess I could have Mat ask him for references? I can talk to the guy with the s-10 a bit more about it. I know he had his truck in 3 times for rust, but like I mentioned before, the shop didn't warranty the rust work, but I know the shop fixed it for free anyways.

I have done my fair share of small claims in small claims court, and it wasn't very expensive at all to file or go through the process, it was more of a pain in the ass than anything, and I know just because you take someone to court and win, doesn't mean you will actually see any of the money. But I will definitely look a bit further into it before I sign anything or bring the truck in. I would hate to spend the $1600 and need to use the warranty, not have it honored, and be out that money, especially when I can apply that to something that may be better, although slightly more expensive.
 

northcreek

Member
Jan 15, 2012
3,330
WNY
Voymom said:
I'm not worried about the little scratches, it's the BIG area's and overall issue. A nice wax won't even do much good.

WOW...I haven't seen that much peeling since the wife and I decided to play nude beach at a deserted pond and burned our collective asses to a crisp:eek:
 

Fire06

Member
Dec 18, 2011
7,223
northcreek said:
WOW...I haven't seen that much peeling since the wife and I decided to play nude beach at a deserted pond and burned our collective asses to a crisp:eek:

That sounds painful:yes::yes:
 

Boricua SS

Member
Nov 20, 2011
3,080
Ohio
im surprised my brother hasn't chimed in on this thread as we all know what he does for a living... http://gmtnation.com/f41/josues-collision-repair-thread-1128/.. and as Kyle pointed out in the GTO thread (which cost him over $7,000 to paint that thing)... there is a TON of things involved in repainting a vehicle...

if i were you, i would really consider things and really do your research... $1600 for a FULL paint job and some rust repair, and repair to your fender, and you have the XL not the SWB... all for $1600??? am i the only one missing something here??? even you would have to agree that that seems a little cheap to do all that work and expect it to last even 6 months.. warranty or not.. why go through all of that... Don't get me wrong.. im all about finding deals, where deals are meant to be had... but a COMPLETE paint job and repairs for $1600... its just unheard of... that's like me buying my built trans for $1000, instead of the $2500 it usually costs... or an SS for sale for $5,000 instead of $20,000... it just wouldn't make sense... hell, my bumper would've cost me well over $600 to repair if it wasn't for my brother.. materials ALONE for the ONE bumper was over $100... for ONE bumper lol...

i hope it all works out for you if you go through with it... but man... something just seems fishy here... im not trying to be a debby downer.. but you get what im saying lol..
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
FWIW the materials for one bumper may be $100, but it isn't linear. The more you do the less cost "per panel" so to speak.

At the same time, I know a guy who does good work and he quoted me $2000 to repaint my old car, including fixing some underbody rust, dents, fitting a couple new panels, realigning the nose, and a few other things, so it is possible to get those really good deals. The guy I know is semi-retired and simply does not have the overhead most full shops do. That might be the case with this person Voymom is looking at. I'd certainly see if she can find some people who had him do work a few years ago on vehicles they kept and see what they say about both durability of the work done and how any issues that may have come up were handled. So far from what she has found he sounds pretty decent.

From what I understand almost no place will warranty rust work because it is a cancer - unless you spend oodles of time and money on making absolutely sure ever bit of it is gone, it will always come back.
 

SBUBandit

Member
Dec 5, 2011
597
Have you considered switching from a straight up black to a metallic black. If you were to do the two tone, and both colors metallic, it would look slick, plus the metallic black hides alot of those little swirls and scratches in the paint that black is notorious for.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Add some flake to the clear too.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
I understand where everyone is concerned....I decided to call Maaco and the local body shop who gave me my quotes. Maaco mind you just did a rough estimate without seeing the truck, so the number I give is not a definite amount. I also asked both places how many coats of primer, base, and clear that they use, typical time to prep for them, brand of paint, and type of paint. I also asked Maaco their labor fee's but the guy wouldn't answer that question without beating around the bush. The estimated cost for Maaco starts at $4500

Maaco told me(I think his name was Carl)that they use 1 coat of primer, 2 coats of base, and 1 coat of clear. They wouldn't give me a brand name on the paint they use, but it is water based. Typical tear down for them is between 1-8hrs(not sure why such a time gap). As far as the labor prices go, he just said every shop is different. :crazy:

Rick at my local shop- He uses 2 coats primer, 3 coats base, and 2-3 coats of clear. He uses PPG brand paint which is also water based. Typical complete tear down can take a day or two, day 3 they double check their tear down and start planning out the prepping, which for them can be a few hours to a few days depending on the size of the vehicle(He paints semi trucks too) and type of paint job, with custom taking longer. He purchases his paint from PPG in large amounts so he can get a wholesale price, which helps keep the material prices down. He charges a flat rate for his labor which depends on the size of the vehicle. 4 door vehicles start at $800 and larger vehicles will cost more. His labor price for me is $1200.00 no tax if I pay in cash. His typical labor price for a semi truck is $2500 plus materials run a bit more as most truckers do some type of custom color or design.

I told him I had a few concerned friends because the price seems to be just to good to be true. He flat out told me that he does NOT need to keep the shop open in order to live a financially stable life, he runs the shop because he enjoys doing his job, and because he enjoys his motorcycles and money to throw away in them. The money he makes goes back into the shop to help pay bills like electricity for the shop, replace materials such as tape, plastic, sand paper, etc...He is able to not charge so much because he has no employee's to pay, it is him and his brother that own, run, and work at the shop. His brother does the major custom paint jobs and designs so when someone orders a customized job or design they pay for both him and his brothers time, and materials can get extremely pricey with custom work. He said a custom color such as cotton candy pink can run upwards of $300-$400 for paint alone, where as he can get basic colors like black, white, red etc....for wholesale price because it is used more often, and if he doesn't see a return in paint prices from one paint job using black, once he paints 3-4 cars, the paint would be more than paid for. The pink however is rarely used, and the can could sit in his shop for a year or more, or even get thrown away at some point, so his customers will pay full price on the cost of any custom color paint.

So, I hope this clears a few questions up for some. I have plenty of time for more questions before I bring the truck in. I do appreciate everyone being concerned, and I value everyone's opinion, questions and outlook on this, I am still considering having him paint my truck. Sometimes a good offer is a good offer, and sometimes you get raped. I guess people don't understand my concerns, My truck is in HORRIBLE condition paint wise, and if I don't do anything about it, eventually I will have no clear, and no paint left on the fender and door....in that scenario I'm looking at my truck who has VERY little rust to begin with, turning into a complete rust bucket in very possibly a short amount of time. I could use touch up paint, but it just masks the issue, and doesn't fix anything. With 6 kids, trying to buy a home, nursing school, and other things, I cannot afford to drop 10k into a paint job right now, and I'm not sure when I will be able to or if I ever will be able to. If I just sit here and let the truck go to shit, I will be in a much harder boat, because I will have to eventually replace my truck, something I don't want to do.

Call me a whiner, I don't care lol I just want my truck to be better. If a shitty $1600 paint job can get me through the next 5-7 years, by then I will either be in a newer Envoy or have the 10k saved up for a good paint job. No amount of touch up paint(SMALL ass bottles) will keep up with the severe peeling this truck has. By this time next year, I may not have clear or paint on my fender. Sometimes you just have to do what you have to do, and accept what you can and cannot afford. And right now, there is no way in hell I can afford a 10k paint job.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
SBU- I never considered it, but it is an option. If it hides swirls better.

At this point, I don't even know if i'm keeping the truck now.

I guess we'll see.
 

SBUBandit

Member
Dec 5, 2011
597
Voymom said:
SBU- I never considered it, but it is an option. If it hides swirls better.

At this point, I don't even know if i'm keeping the truck now.

I guess we'll see.

Tami,
your call, but I'd hate to see you get rid of a vehicle I know you love and have put alot of time into over paint. You'll figure something out

As for metallics, take a look at the current black Ford Fusions, they come in metallic black and look slick. My previous car was a Chevy Prizm (Corolla) and was metallic black, while my father in laws car it was parked next to every day was a Gloss Black Grand Prix. My car always looked cleaner and when waxed it looked like glass, and his you had to work twice as hard to get it to look half as good.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
SBUBandit said:
Tami,
your call, but I'd hate to see you get rid of a vehicle I know you love and have put alot of time into over paint. You'll figure something out

As for metallics, take a look at the current black Ford Fusions, they come in metallic black and look slick. My previous car was a Chevy Prizm (Corolla) and was metallic black, while my father in laws car it was parked next to every day was a Gloss Black Grand Prix. My car always looked cleaner and when waxed it looked like glass, and his you had to work twice as hard to get it to look half as good.

You're right, I just get very discouraged very easily, especially when I feel stuck lol. I know in the long run that I have to do what I feel is best for my current situation. This has just been an excruciating topic for me, it's VERY minor yes, and completely uncharacteristic of me to dread over, and I need to just suck it up, make a call, and be done lol.

I think I get wishy washy about trading in the truck, because I have allowed myself to become obsessed over the problem :biggrin:

I don't want to be looked down upon for getting a "cheap" paint job, and why I care so much about what people think NOW is beyond me lol I will definitely take a look at metallic paint vs just plain paint. I have a while before I have to make up my mind, but I don't think Mat will let me trade the truck in over paint lol
 

HARDTRAILZ

Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Wow...
 

hockeyman

Member
Aug 26, 2012
726
Voymom said:
The last thing I want my Phantom to look like is this.........

9485-so-depressed-images-41-.jpg

Wow, whoever did that deserves to be tied to the whipping post!!
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
hockeyman said:
Wow, whoever did that deserves to be tied to the whipping post!!

Snooki from Jersey shore.....She ruined this truck!

- - - Updated - - -

HARDTRAILZ said:

Wow what??? :undecided:
 

Boricua SS

Member
Nov 20, 2011
3,080
Ohio
Voymom said:
I don't want to be looked down upon for getting a "cheap" paint job, and why I care so much about what people think NOW is beyond me lol... , but I don't think Mat will let me trade the truck in over paint lol


at the end of the day who cares what you do Tami... its your truck... and if you want that cheap paint job... then by all means... do it... we're just a bunch of people on an internet forum with constructive criticism... i get blasted all the time for my SS on tbssowners... those folks over there are all about speed and that their chit don't stick just because they own an SS... so when i do cosmetic things to my truck.. they all bash me... but you know what.. ITS MINE!!!! like i give two chits what they think ya know... no reason to beat yourself up over this... we're just letting you know that prices THAT low... are just purely unheard of... for the "cheap" paint jobs, people go to Maaco... but you answered that yourself... they quoted you $4500... and thats a cheap place... but this guy is $1600... you're answering yourself in your own replies lol... i will agree that PPG is a good paint.. i used that for my show truck that i had growing up.. (my paint was the Viper GTS Blue Pearl and cost me $800 per gallon) and when i got my truck repainted.. it was already prepped by my brother and the shop STILL charged me over $1500 WITHOUT materials just to paint it and buff it out... and that was a 2 door short bed, standard cab truck over 10 years ago...

so again, at the end of the day, its your ride, and your money... do what you see fit.. if it flakes off, peels, orange peel, over spray, etc... well hey.. you knew what you were getting into lol... but if its going to be beneficial to you for the next 5 years until you get rid of it.. then why the hell are we talking about it :rotfl::crackup:
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
Maaco would do 1 coat of clear? Forget that. Not enough IMO.

The local guy sounds much, much better. Sounds similar to the guy I know - can do it cheap because it isn't his livelihood but because he enjoys it.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
Boricua SS said:
at the end of the day who cares what you do Tami... its your truck... and if you want that cheap paint job... then by all means... do it... we're just a bunch of people on an internet forum with constructive criticism... i get blasted all the time for my SS on tbssowners... those folks over there are all about speed and that their chit don't stick just because they own an SS... so when i do cosmetic things to my truck.. they all bash me... but you know what.. ITS MINE!!!! like i give two chits what they think ya know... no reason to beat yourself up over this... we're just letting you know that prices THAT low... are just purely unheard of... for the "cheap" paint jobs, people go to Maaco... but you answered that yourself... they quoted you $4500... and thats a cheap place... but this guy is $1600... you're answering yourself in your own replies lol... i will agree that PPG is a good paint.. i used that for my show truck that i had growing up.. (my paint was the Viper GTS Blue Pearl and cost me $800 per gallon) and when i got my truck repainted.. it was already prepped by my brother and the shop STILL charged me over $1500 WITHOUT materials just to paint it and buff it out... and that was a 2 door short bed, standard cab truck over 10 years ago...

so again, at the end of the day, its your ride, and your money... do what you see fit.. if it flakes off, peels, orange peel, over spray, etc... well hey.. you knew what you were getting into lol... but if its going to be beneficial to you for the next 5 years until you get rid of it.. then why the hell are we talking about it :rotfl::crackup:

That's the thing though, I posted about getting a quote on a paint job, and I never originally asked any questions about it, people were asking me questions, and giving me things to ask and consider. I asked the 2 paint shops my questions, posted the answers here.

I got a TON of really good feedback from everyone who posted here, and I took a lot of this advice into consideration, but there was never any question really. This thread has turned out to be a wonderful resource for information regarding paint jobs, body condition etc...but it shouldn't be made to deter people from taking a good deal either. Most shops operate to generate money as profit and to take care of their families at home, which is normal, that is a normal business! But there are people out there who do things that they like and enjoy for extra income which can allow for lower prices. Just because something is unheard of, does not mean it does not exist.

after all it is my truck, and my money, you are absolutely correct, but I just thought I would come here to share my find, and my excitement with others.
 

jrSS

Member
Dec 4, 2011
3,950
Maaco would paint ontop of a dead animal on your car and not think twice about it.
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
jrSS said:
Maaco would paint ontop of a dead animal on your car and not think twice about it.

I kind of got that vibe when I called them, and never got any direct answers to my questions. In fact the guy at the Des Moines(Clive) shop "Thought" the paint base was water....but didn't know for sure. I'm sure he knew, but for some reason I just could not get a definite answer to much....
 

Boricua SS

Member
Nov 20, 2011
3,080
Ohio
hey i agree with ya... there are deals out there... but it just raises eyebrows thats all... i always look for deals as well.. like my brakes... was going to cost me well over $250 just to replace my front brakes... but... found a guy on the the forums that sold me a complete set (rotors and pads) all the way around for $75.. so you best believe i jumped on that lol... so i do agree that sometimes a deal is a deal.. just be careful of things, and remember... you get what you pay for... the guy could do great work.. we all dont know that... so we're all looking forward to you getting this done so we can see :thumbsup:
 

Voymom

Original poster
Member
Feb 3, 2012
2,523
Boricua SS said:
hey i agree with ya... there are deals out there... but it just raises eyebrows thats all... i always look for deals as well.. like my brakes... was going to cost me well over $250 just to replace my front brakes... but... found a guy on the the forums that sold me a complete set (rotors and pads) all the way around for $75.. so you best believe i jumped on that lol... so i do agree that sometimes a deal is a deal.. just be careful of things, and remember... you get what you pay for... the guy could do great work.. we all dont know that... so we're all looking forward to you getting this done so we can see :thumbsup:

And like I mentioned before, I do really appreciate ALL the advice and things that everyone mentioned for me to take into consideration. And yes SOMETIMES you get what you pay for, however that isn't always the case....I have seen some things that cost well over 2k and not be worth the packaging it came from lol.
 

CdnGMan

Member
Nov 22, 2011
1,393
Toronto
I think the best thing you can do for your own piece of mind is to check out his past customers...
Talk to them and see what they think / thought of his work...ask if they've ever had an issue with the warranty, etc...

The fact that he's not doing it for "profit" is good, as he won't be is big of a rush to "get it done"...

But like many have said, it's your money & your ride, so you need to do whatever you feel is right for you... personally, I'd be inclined to take the deal as it should get you at least 3 years (or more) of piece of mind... YMMV...
 

meerschm

Member
Aug 26, 2012
1,079
FYI

(poor charlie)

[video=youtube;eTOV6BgGfkw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTOV6BgGfkw&feature=related[/video]
 

meerschm

Member
Aug 26, 2012
1,079
you have to watch like six of these to see how the truck comes out. pretty nice. lots of work, and there seems to be some swearing involved.
 

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