How old is the battery? If you have electrical problems i would be focusing on the battery, alternator and ignition switch.
Reset camshaft crankshaft thingy? I think....
- Thread starter Voymom
- Start date
Voymom said:
But what about the connections to the battery? Mine were all green and corroded and I had to buy new battery bolts. Can't imagine yours would be any better.
Specifically you need to slide the red and black boots off the battery cables to inspect. This requires taking the bolts off first. You can pry them out with a flat head screwdriver.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
Actually our bolts are nice and shiny along with the connectors. We have disconnected the battery enough times and have been able to inspect it thoroughly, in fact the battery connectors are probably cleaner than anything else on the truck. No green, no residue, no dust, clean as a whistle.
We had the connectors off earlier today when checking all the electrical grounds. I have that stupid clicking noise from the rear actuator now....uhg! It will shut off eventually though. I'm not ruling out the ignition switch either...is there a way to test that?
Voymom said:
The point I was trying to make is that there might be corrosion inside. You never mentioned you checked that. The battery bolts themselves can look in pristine condition on the outside however if you take them out of the eye hole from terminal end of the red and black boots and pull those boots off you might see a different picture. This was my case.
Voymom said:
You would have to take it out and check the continuity. You can test it hot but not recommended.
Voymom said:
Are you talking about a walk-through? I pass. In reality it's just best to replace it in these vehicles. Especially a 2003 model. Its a ticking time bomb which will totally fail you at some point. GM redesigned the switch and you can pickup one online or the dealer or just get a Borg Warner (BWD) switch from Advance Auto.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
Not really a walk through...I'm sure Mat could figure it out. I'd rather test than replace. If it was bad or going bad, then we would replace it....but if it's good then no need to put the money into that right off.
Mat goes by the " if it's not broken, don't fix it" method
I'm just the wife....so I get to tag along lol
Voymom said:Not really a walk through...I'm sure Mat could figure it out. I'd rather test than replace. If it was bad or going bad, then we would replace it....but if it's good then no need to put the money into that right off.
Mat goes by the " if it's not broken, don't fix it" method
I'm just the wife....so I get to tag along lol
Ok well if your going by that logic you might as well say that the fuel filter wasn't broken so you shouldn't have changed it.
Trust me. The ignition switch is a problem part that came from the factory. People including myself have replaced it as preventative maintenance.
Come to think of it I can't remember a time my vehicle has ever stalled after replacing it.
And it's not unnecessary. It might not be related to the current issues your having but it definitely makes future troubleshooting easier.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
Understood 100% but what i'm trying to explain is that I would rather make sure my engine is healthy and not going to blow up on me anytime soon, before I worry about the ignition switch. If the compression/combustion test comes out okay, then I will move along and start replacing the ignition switch, and the other 500 things it can possibly be. I have never said I ruled the ignition switch out yet....I haven't ruled anything out yet. But I want to rule out the engine, and the other very important things first.
If a kid comes into a hospital with a broken arm and a concussion, you treat the vital area's first...like the head over the broken arm. That's all I want to. Make sure the big things are okay first.
I know everyone is doing their best to help us, and I appreciate it so very much....i'm just exhausted from wracking my brain over all this. If I sound snappy, I'm not meaning to....it's just very hard being new at all of this, with an issue like we have. Hell for all I know it could just be the way the truck is...I doubt it, but boy would that be nice lol If you can tell me my truck's engine is okay or will be okay...I will change the ignition switch tomorrow...well Monday lol
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:Ok. Goodnight Tami.
I hope I didn't piss you off...You have been very helpful and valuable to Mat and I in this whole ordeal. I know you have taken the time out of your day and possibly away from your family, so my intentions are not to make anyone angry of feel that we aren't appreciative. I will work 6 days a week trying to figure this all out, but Sunday is my off day lol. I refuse to get out of my jammies on Sunday's lol
gmcman
Member
- Dec 12, 2011
- 4,656
Ok, you can take the night off.
Just keep in mind and not to make light of your concerns....the engine's internals or the vital component is being deprived of something which is causing the stall.
Something that keeps popping in my head is the injectors so hopefully the 44K will shed some light on that. Perhaps they just can't adjust quick enough to the off-idle demand but once they get working faster there is no issue......not sure though. They do change in pulse width also and stay open longer but from idle to accel there may not be enough fuel delivery to keep the motor going, above 1K there is enough time to catch up.
This is just a theory so time will tell.
Just keep in mind and not to make light of your concerns....the engine's internals or the vital component is being deprived of something which is causing the stall.
Something that keeps popping in my head is the injectors so hopefully the 44K will shed some light on that. Perhaps they just can't adjust quick enough to the off-idle demand but once they get working faster there is no issue......not sure though. They do change in pulse width also and stay open longer but from idle to accel there may not be enough fuel delivery to keep the motor going, above 1K there is enough time to catch up.
This is just a theory so time will tell.
Voymom said:
Huh? Not at all. Just saying goodnight cause its nighttime. Thought you were going to bed?
bravad'oh
Member
- Sep 15, 2012
- 44
I have a unit similar to this.
Metal OBD2 USB V1.5a ELM327 CANBUS Auto Car Diagnostic | eBay
This one is $41 but saw another on Fleabay USA for $14. The main thing you are looking for is ELM327. That is the computer chip in the little box that lets your laptop connect to your vehicle. I use it with EasyobdII which is a free download or you can upgrade for $16.99.
EasyObdII Software | OBD-II | Free OBD2 Software for ScanTool.net USB and serial Interfaces
EasyObdII Version 2.4.5
Released 04/11/2012
Features:
•Auto Com Port with Scantool Recognition and Configuration
•Windows 2000 SP4 to Windows 7 Compatibility
•Scantool.net Serial/USB Elmscan 5 and OBD-Link Support
•Scantool.net Bluetooth OBD-Link MX Support
•Speeds up to 115200 Baud
•Touchscreen Compatible
•Impoved Datalogging with Saving to Text and Csv Files - LIMITED TRIAL
•Improved CAN Data Support
•Vehicle Dashboard - Revs , Speed , Load ,Throttle , Battery - LIMITED TRIAL
•Pending Diagnostic Trouble Codes
•Monitoring test
•Live Sensor Data
•Freeze Frame
•Enhanced Error Detection
•Reads and resets vehicle trouble codes and MIL (Check Engine) Lamp
•Show text descriptions of generic Powertrain (P) and Network (U) codes
•Manufacturer specific and other generic codes will be displayed without text description
I don't know what others are using but this has worked for me to diagnose stuff and clear trouble codes. You can also see the O2 sensors, fuel trims,
and drive around while watching what the vehicle computer is doing.
Metal OBD2 USB V1.5a ELM327 CANBUS Auto Car Diagnostic | eBay
This one is $41 but saw another on Fleabay USA for $14. The main thing you are looking for is ELM327. That is the computer chip in the little box that lets your laptop connect to your vehicle. I use it with EasyobdII which is a free download or you can upgrade for $16.99.
EasyObdII Software | OBD-II | Free OBD2 Software for ScanTool.net USB and serial Interfaces
EasyObdII Version 2.4.5
Released 04/11/2012
Features:
•Auto Com Port with Scantool Recognition and Configuration
•Windows 2000 SP4 to Windows 7 Compatibility
•Scantool.net Serial/USB Elmscan 5 and OBD-Link Support
•Scantool.net Bluetooth OBD-Link MX Support
•Speeds up to 115200 Baud
•Touchscreen Compatible
•Impoved Datalogging with Saving to Text and Csv Files - LIMITED TRIAL
•Improved CAN Data Support
•Vehicle Dashboard - Revs , Speed , Load ,Throttle , Battery - LIMITED TRIAL
•Pending Diagnostic Trouble Codes
•Monitoring test
•Live Sensor Data
•Freeze Frame
•Enhanced Error Detection
•Reads and resets vehicle trouble codes and MIL (Check Engine) Lamp
•Show text descriptions of generic Powertrain (P) and Network (U) codes
•Manufacturer specific and other generic codes will be displayed without text description
I don't know what others are using but this has worked for me to diagnose stuff and clear trouble codes. You can also see the O2 sensors, fuel trims,
and drive around while watching what the vehicle computer is doing.
I know I'm late to this party, but I was experiencing some of the same symptoms. My 2003 TB would hesitate and threaten to stall when in gear (never tested in Park/Neutral). It did stall about 3 times over about a year or so but I got used to backing off the gas so it didn't stall. The first time I got a P0340 code, for the camshaft position (CMP) sensor. The code cleared itself after a few trips and I didn't notice any problems at the time so I forgot about it. Several months later, I randomly got the P0340 code again, with apparently no symptoms (I guess I didn't connect the hesitation issue since I was used to dealing with it). I also say May03LT's video on his intermittent CMP sensor problem in which he used an oscilloscope to diagnose the problem and got lucky by catching it failing. If I remember correctly, he never got a code. I have also noticed that my gas mileage had been worse than usual in the past few months. Long story short (too late), I replaced my CMP sensor about a week ago and it seems to have fixed my hesitation problem. The engine no longer hesitates at all and it seems to rev up much more quickly/responsively. I got for about $24 shipped from Amazon and it takes about 5 min to change.
I also inspected my FPR, which was clean and dry on the vacuum hose side, so I don't think that was a problem for me.
Given the similar symptoms and the low cost and time involved, you may want to consider changing the CMP sensor as well. Hopefully this was helpful, if a bit long-winded!
I also inspected my FPR, which was clean and dry on the vacuum hose side, so I don't think that was a problem for me.
Given the similar symptoms and the low cost and time involved, you may want to consider changing the CMP sensor as well. Hopefully this was helpful, if a bit long-winded!
Voymom I to have been having the same problem as you but will add mine also happens after I come to a stop and begin to take off again. It happened to me Fri. while going to work and I noticed my lights dimmed so after work I went to Autozone and got my Battery and Alt. checked, both were fine so I had him check for codes and he pulled
P0014, P1523, P1516. I've never had these codes before. In July I cleaned the cpas but I'm going to replace that very soon and the cam sensor also the crank sensor but that's harder to get to and I don't know if some type of relearn is necessary. going to get a can of that BG44K also for $28.
P0014, P1523, P1516. I've never had these codes before. In July I cleaned the cpas but I'm going to replace that very soon and the cam sensor also the crank sensor but that's harder to get to and I don't know if some type of relearn is necessary. going to get a can of that BG44K also for $28.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
bravad'oh;106439 said:
I have the torque 2 app for android, but need to order the dongle to use it. Then....reading it will be the next BIG thing because I have never used a scanner before, and i'm guessing they don't use 1st grade language in the mechanical sense
I'm waiting to fill the truck up on Thursday to stick the 44K in it. The guy told me not to put it in with any less than a full tank because it's so strong it can corrode the actual innards it touches?
I wanted to let everyone know, that after pulling #4 spark plug to check it, and re-seating it and tightening the valve cover bolts, our gas mileage has gone up on the DIC, from 11.3 MPG to 16.0 MPG. Not sure what the hand calculated amount will be just yet. It also runs smoother and has a bit more kick to it on WOT. We can actually WOT on a decent hill and get 0-60 in 10 seconds with a fully loaded down truck.(tools, kids, etc...) when it used to be in the 12-13 second area. The surging seems to be coming from turning the A/C or heat on, as I didn't notice the tach needle moving at all or the engine noise when it was turned off. Still sputtering. No change in the other symptoms though. I'm hoping the 44K will help, and then in 3-5k more miles we will put in another can.
Voymom said:
It wont corrode anything. Its comprised of jet fuel and mineral spirits. Those are fuel oils. It treats up to 20 gallons so I wouldnt fill the tank up all the way. About 1/2 to 3/4 of a tank would be about right. There are no instructions on the can.
Voymom said:
And your using the fill method to calculate this ? This figure seems suspicious.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
I asked him about this, as I believe our tank is 25 gallons, and he said to ignore the 20 gallon instructions and fill the tank completely.
Fill method?? I was just basing it as it is now on the DIC. My tank is at 1/4 before empty right now.
WarGawd said:
I believe the mileage is better...it was 13 MPG City and about 16-16.5 HWY. I'm getting 18MPG HWY now...per the DIC though. It's not a "real" calculation.
Voymom said:
Put it in now and fill the tank to 3/4. It will be fine. Hell. Ive actually run off the stuff with less than 1/4 tank of gas and never had any problems.
The problem i have with your friends comments about just filling up the tank is "WHAT THE HELL DOES IT MATTER?"
why does it matter if you have a 10 , 12, 15, 20 or 25 gallon tank? Just fill it up? What an idiot.
Of course it matters. You could inject this stuff directly into the fuel rail and itwould work quicker. More concentrated is better. Its a friggin fuel not MEK.
Voymom said:
Yes. Fill method. Google.
Voymom said:
The dic is well known to not be very accurate. Use the fill method to calculate mileage. A quick search on google will show you how. You dont drive the vehicle very much so geting an accurate mileage figure is going to take some time. Please dont post mileage figures until you understand the fill method. Its very simple. Until then you are just deluding the audience and yourself.
bravad'oh
Member
- Sep 15, 2012
- 44
Voymom said:I have the torque 2 app for android, but need to order the dongle to use it. Then....reading it will be the next BIG thing because I have never used a scanner before, and i'm guessing they don't use 1st grade language in the mechanical sense
That seems like a good app. The people on this site can easily tell you what your readings should be and I don't think you would have any trouble. The fact that you can reset CEL s is one of the biggest plusses. When you are able to get the Bluetooth connector I am sure you will find it very useful.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
LOL, this person WAS NOT my friend, in fact I have never seen him a day in my life. He was the guy who sold the 44K to me.
Will do
The dic is well known to not be very accurate. Use the fill method to calculate mileage. A quick search on google will show you how. You dont drive the vehicle very much so geting an accurate mileage figure is going to take some time. Please dont post mileage figures until you understand the fill method. Its very simple. Until then you are just deluding the audience and yourself.
Okay, okay...Hey now I was being asked what my mileage was...I was just answering the question
EDIT- Mat just told me this is the method he used a few months(maybe 3 months ago) and the mileage was 15 MPG's city. We actually drive it daily, but our destinations 90% of the time are 2-3 miles one way...so 4-6 miles a day. I also wanted to add...that my OLM is at 71% changed the oil early October...not as bad as I thought. I could have sworn it was in the 60% range, but it's not.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
bravad'oh;106519 said:
Yes, I'm excited to be getting the dongle so I can use the app. I have opened it up and browsed it to see how it works, but haven't been able to pull a reading off it yet.
SAR85- I haven't ruled that out yet. In fact I think I will go search up May0's videos and see if I can find the one you are talking about. I had someone on the FB page of GMT tell me the same, unless of course your that person lol I don't know many first name's around here. Just a few.
VON- I will have to answer you in a bit...I was going to answer you now, but can't remember what you said lol SORRY!!! Just so much going on.
gmcman
Member
- Dec 12, 2011
- 4,656
SAR85 said:
Even though you checked in late......that's some good intel right there.
Hopefully that's the issue and the good thing is even though she has taken many hours to investigate, pretty much everything that Voymom has done is for the better and mostly a necessity anyway. Sounds like something I may swap out in the near future for some good preventive maint.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
gmcman said:Even though you checked in late......that's some good intel right there.
Sounds like something I may swap out in the near future for some good preventive maint.
I agree 100% I may end up swapping mine this week since it's so cheap and doesn't look all that hard to get to. And yes, everything I have done so far...time consuming, PITA, not exactly cheap...is all the basic maintenance and tests that should have been done already. The previous owners didn't give 2 craps about this truck, and it shows. It's just taken me a while to get to everything, but it's all getting done now lol
Well fwiw I used to have a random stall about 8 months ago. Since replacing the camshaft sensor and ignition switch it hasn't stalled. But thats just my situation. Can't say if this would be your case. I do know that you can remove the camshaft sensor and the truck WILL keep running. So if you suspect it's a cause you can remove it and see if it stops. Many sensors on the truck are like this. A list of the sensors that can be removed is below. Removing these will not keep your truck from running.
1. Camshaft position sensor
2. Knock sensors
3. Camshaft Position Actuator Solenoid
4. O2 Sensor
5. Pedal position sensor. One of them. there are two
6. Throttle postion sensor. One of them. there are two
7. Oil pressure switch
1. Camshaft position sensor
2. Knock sensors
3. Camshaft Position Actuator Solenoid
4. O2 Sensor
5. Pedal position sensor. One of them. there are two
6. Throttle postion sensor. One of them. there are two
7. Oil pressure switch
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
My question is though...that if the CMP sensor is faulty and causing my symptoms, removing it won't show any significant difference will it? If the truck is running but acting looney with a failed one, I would imagine removing it won't do much? I can see the changes happening if I replaced it with a working sensor though.
Sparky
Member
- Dec 4, 2011
- 12,927
What can happen with a sensor that acts wonky is it randomly spits bad data at the computer that can make the engine gag. Removing the sensor so the computer runs in "safe mode" removes the random spat of bad data. If it runs in that safe mode for that circuit and the sputters go away, then that can point to that sensor being the cause.
Similar thing happened with my O2 sensor for example. It was failing, and sending garbage to the computer at times, and when it would the engine would start running weird. Then the sensor cut out entirely, so the truck switched to open loop, ignoring the sensor, and it ran flawlessly then. In the case of the cam sensor, you are forcing it to ignore the potentially glitchy sensor.
Similar thing happened with my O2 sensor for example. It was failing, and sending garbage to the computer at times, and when it would the engine would start running weird. Then the sensor cut out entirely, so the truck switched to open loop, ignoring the sensor, and it ran flawlessly then. In the case of the cam sensor, you are forcing it to ignore the potentially glitchy sensor.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
Sparky said:
Ahh okay!! Makes sense! I will be removing it soon and see what happens. Would be nice if this was the cause, since it is an extremely easy fix lol At the same time I would feel horrible for racking up over 100 posts/replies for a tiny little sensor
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
Well I unplugged the CMP sensor...drove it until the SES light popped on. Came home and parked the truck so I could see if there was any difference in symptoms, and there wasn't. It stayed the same.
Mat put the 44K in and I'm going to go have the code ran to see if there is more than just the CMP sensor code being thrown, in case that activated the computer to throw a code related to our issue.
Mat put the 44K in and I'm going to go have the code ran to see if there is more than just the CMP sensor code being thrown, in case that activated the computer to throw a code related to our issue.
The first thing to check it you use Torque or have a scan tool is the coolant temp. It should be around 195-205 deg F at all times. Anything extremely low below 180F will cause problems from forcing the engine to run rich. It can cause rough idle and stalling if there is too much fuel being added.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
CaptainXL said:
I do know the guy who did the tech 2 said I had a sticky thermostat, but didn't give me the actual numbers. It's a fairly new t-stat, just put it in I believe in March of this year. But I know the failure rate with them, and I will have it checked again. I had these symptoms even after I replaced a thermostat that was clearly stuck open....so I don't think that is the issue, but it probably needs to be looked at again anyways, and it won't hurt anything, so might as well lol.
WarGawd
Member
- Sep 2, 2012
- 468
CaptainXL said:
Hmmm. Can you clairfy where you got that? I'm curious because it directly relates to my problem - not trying to hijack the thread, so I won't get into much detail. Depending on your answer, I may start a new thread on it.
What I understood was the median/consensus of this thread was a range of 206-210, which fits with what I recall generally from the OS before I migrated over. Hope you can comment soon, as mine is booked in for early this morning for work that might not be as necessary as I thought, and maybe I can wait until Spring and save a few hundred bucks. It would also alert me to start looking for a different source for my issue.
One other thought - noticed it fairly prominently today for the first time. At the 82 - 92 deg C / 180 - 198F (scan tool obtained, still can't independently corroborate that) it runs at now, I have noticed a consistent sulfurous smell {EDIT: maybe I should say at idle, but I thought that was kinda obvious} . So if mine is running rich at that temp, and that has the potential to cause problems, might it not be wiser to start declaring "extremely low" being anything below say, 190? Or 195 even?
{Aside, fwiw - I've only gotten 3 P0128's over this time despite the more frequent occurrence of the temp drops over the last few months. But the reason this is happening for me is the way I drive it, the vast majority of my ignition cycles aren't run under the criteria that the PCM requires to set the code; if I drove it more like most other people do, I suspect I'd be getting them much more often now}
The 180 limit is where you start doing damage to the cat. Found this out by downloading ths pcm codes and conditions for the cel to be set. I think its on the os. It shows you all theconditions that must be met in order to trip a cel or code. I will see if I can find it again. It a hefty 50 page printout at least.
WarGawd said:
Richer definitely. Smell depends on the cat a lot. It converts hydrogen sulfide (rotten egg smell) into sulfer dioxide which is odorless. A vehicle warmed up should have little to no smell coming out the tailpipe at idle.
bravad'oh
Member
- Sep 15, 2012
- 44
Voymom, you said you already got Torque, so go ahead and get yourself the Bluetooth adapter. I didn't do alot of research but if I had to choose right now I would pick:
ELM327 Bluetooth Adapter Scanner Torque Android OBD2 OBDII Code Reader Scan Tool | eBay
$25.99 and you will be able to turn of the SES yourself plus get your own data. I have seen others as low as $13.99. Your Co-pilot may be able to see something show up while you are driving around that doesn't show up otherwise. Others on this site may have an informed opinion on which adapter to get but you need to get hooked up.
ELM327 Bluetooth Adapter Scanner Torque Android OBD2 OBDII Code Reader Scan Tool | eBay
$25.99 and you will be able to turn of the SES yourself plus get your own data. I have seen others as low as $13.99. Your Co-pilot may be able to see something show up while you are driving around that doesn't show up otherwise. Others on this site may have an informed opinion on which adapter to get but you need to get hooked up.
- Feb 3, 2012
- 2,523
WarGawd said:
This is touchy...only because when I first got the truck my t-stat was bad, really bad. It took me about a month to convince Mat that it needed to be changed, and on top of that we had no idea how long it was like that. I know the truck sat on the dealers lot for 6 months, and had occasional test drives from prospective buyers. I had absolutely NO rich gassy smell at all. My temp was hoovering around 160-170 degrees. I took pictures of it...it was bad. We got extremely lucky to not have a clogged cat with it running as rich as it was. When we got it home, Mat did the fill method to calculate mileage, and we were getting 9-10MPG city.
When we changed it, it was quite obvious that the thing was stuck open...very stuck lol. It never even reached the middle line of 210 degrees on the gauge.
Now in relation to my problem...I will have the t-stat checked again to find what our running temp is. I do notice that the warmer (60 degrees and up) on outside temp my temp gauge needle only makes it to the line right before 210. When it's cold out (anything below 60 degrees) it has absolutely no problems getting to the 210 mark on the gauge. Not sure of gas mileage yet as we're still calculating. Just filled the tank half way yesterday. So we'll see.
View attachment 24047
Edit-Someone from the GMT FB page keeps telling me that motor mounts were causing him to have the same symptoms. I do have a light shake when stepping on the gas in park, but it goes away after I reach a certain RPM. Is it possible that the mounts could be causing this issue, how would I investigate it further?
