mirror turn signals AND running lights

[Wyle]

I've read Jman's article on retrofitting turn signals into the side mirrors. Got it. No problem.

I also saw a related article on the OS about making them running lights as well by tying the "ground" into the circuit for the parking lights instead of back into the turn signal circuit.

I understand circuits and I understand the instructions to actually do it, but I don't get how the dual function actually works. Does someone have the related schematics or know the details of how the (dim continuous) parking lights and (bright relay controlled) turn signals control power to the same single-filament, 2-wire mirror bulb?

Thanks,
Wyle

 

[Blckshdw]

I've read Jman's article on retrofitting turn signals into the side mirrors. Got it. No problem.

I also saw a related article on the OS about making them running lights as well by tying the "ground" into the circuit for the parking lights instead of back into the turn signal circuit.

I understand circuits and I understand the instructions to actually do it, but I don't get how the dual function actually works. Does someone have the related schematics or know the details of how the (dim continuous) parking lights and (bright relay controlled) turn signals control power to the same single-filament, 2-wire mirror bulb?

Thanks,
Wyle

With a filament bulb, it doesn't matter which direction the current flows in, to cause it to light up. Each signal, uses the others connection, as a ground to complete the circuit when it sends it's own signal. So when the turn signal activates, the current goes from the turn signal side, to the parking light side, and you get light. When the parking lights are on, the signal goes from the parking light side, to the turn signal side, and you get light. When the parking lights are on, and the turn signal activates, the turn signal STOPS the current flow, so the light turns off.

This is the exact same functionality of the front corner turn signal lights. If you look at them at night, you'll notice the smaller corner lights flash out of phase with the larger bulbs. This is why. Now if you want to put LEDs in your mirrors, (or in the corner bulbs) that's a whole other ball game, requiring some relays to maintain the full functions. Hope that helps some.

 

[ScarabEpic22]

I did this to my 02 about 4 years ago, looked badass with the Northface Clearance lights and the mirror turns on from the front.

I just went the easy way, tapped the parking light wire under the dash, fused it, then ran it to both doors. One side of the mirror turn bulb is the turn signal and the other is the parking light. With the lights on the do flash opposite of the turn signal indicator on the dash. But as Blckshdw said, one of the front bulbs does the same thing so I didnt care.

 

[Mark20]

With a filament bulb, it doesn't matter which direction the current flows in, to cause it to light up. Each signal, uses the others connection, as a ground to complete the circuit when it sends it's own signal. So when the turn signal activates, the current goes from the turn signal side, to the parking light side, and you get light. When the parking lights are on, the signal goes from the parking light side, to the turn signal side, and you get light. When the parking lights are on, and the turn signal activates, the turn signal STOPS the current flow, so the light turns off.

This is the exact same functionality of the front corner turn signal lights. If you look at them at night, you'll notice the smaller corner lights flash out of phase with the larger bulbs. This is why. Now if you want to put LEDs in your mirrors, (or in the corner bulbs) that's a whole other ball game, requiring some relays to maintain the full functions. Hope that helps some.

This makes it real clear. Gad I haven't rushed out to change turn signals and marker bubs to LEDs.

 

[Blckshdw]

This makes it real clear. Gad I haven't rushed out to change turn signals and marker bubs to LEDs.

In the LED mod thread, I posted how to make a polarity changer, so if you're comfy with relays and making wiring connections, then you can still pop some LEDs in there without too much effort.

 

[Mark20]

In the LED mod thread, I posted how to make a polarity changer, so if you're comfy with relays and making wiring connections, then you can still pop some LEDs in there without too much effort.

Thanks! Yeah I saw the write up and with the above info it all makes sense. And I don't doubt my abilities to make the mod. It only takes about 5 minutes to change a side marker light in ('05 Envoy so getting the housings out is pretty easy). But it will take a little longer to wire up for LEDs there.

If anything, I think I'd go for turn signal mirrors first. Should start looking for those parts.

 

[Blckshdw]

Thanks! Yeah I saw the write up and with the above info it all makes sense. And I don't doubt my abilities to make the mod. It only takes about 5 minutes to change a side marker light in ('05 Envoy so getting the housings out is pretty easy). But it will take a little longer to wire up for LEDs there.

If anything, I think I'd go for turn signal mirrors first. Should start looking for those parts.

Do you already have turn signals? Mine didn't, so I had to build all of it from scratch.

 

[Mark20]

No don't have turn signal mirrors.

 

[cody_s]

So if instead of tapping into the parking light wire, could I just run wires between the side mirror turn signals and the turn signal/parking light in each headlight? Would that work for LEDs as well with no hassle?

*EDIT* Just read Fireman's post in the LED thread, looks like this would work. I'm only running the stock bulbs for now, but want to make sure that if I do upgrade to LEDs that they'll still work.

I ran two wires from the mirror to the front side marker. I will snap a few pics tomorrow in the day light.

 

[Blckshdw]

So if instead of tapping into the parking light wire, could I just run wires between the side mirror turn signals and the turn signal/parking light in each headlight? Would that work for LEDs as well with no hassle?

*EDIT* Just read Fireman's post in the LED thread, looks like this would work. I'm only running the stock bulbs for now, but want to make sure that if I do upgrade to LEDs that they'll still work.

Don't forget, LEDs are polarized. If you try it this method, you'll have parking lights, and turn signals ONLY when the parking lights are already on. You will not have turn signals during the day. To see what I'm talking about, take a 194 LED bulb, and put it in your corner turn signal up front. Then go through the 3 different scenarios

 

[cody_s]

They don't do much during the day anyway, they're quite tinted, only visible at night as is.

 

[cody_s]

Also, where are you guys running the wire through? Are you actually taking the plastic off your doors to hide the wire?

 

[Blckshdw]

Also, where are you guys running the wire through? Are you actually taking the plastic off your doors to hide the wire?

I ran mine through the factory grommets between the cabin and doors, in front (meaning to the inside) of the window regulator (so the wires wouldn't get snagged when rolling the window down), then through the small hole in the factory insulation to the DDM/PDM (where I had my relays to permit both functions) then to the mirrors.

Edit: of course if you're gonna tap the corner lights up front, you can just go straight up from the door's grommet, to the mirror. If your current mirror doesn't have turn signals, you'll have to drill a small hole to fish the wiring through.

 

[cody_s]

I ran mine through the factory grommets between the cabin and doors, in front (meaning to the inside) of the window regulator (so the wires wouldn't get snagged when rolling the window down), then through the small hole in the factory insulation to the DDM/PDM (where I had my relays to permit both functions) then to the mirrors.

Edit: of course if you're gonna tap the corner lights up front, you can just go straight up from the door's grommet, to the mirror. If your current mirror doesn't have turn signals, you'll have to drill a small hole to fish the wiring through.

This makes sense. One more thing I noticed, my turn signals have two wires going to them, one positive, and one ground. The cornering lights have three wires, labeled A, B, and G. I found that A is the blinker, and that B is the parking lights, with G obviously being the ground. Should I run both A and B to the positive wire in the mirror light? Because I found that when running just wire B to the mirror light, if I have the lights on, and use the blinker, it only flashes once, then goes back to being steady.

 

[Blckshdw]

This makes sense. One more thing I noticed, my turn signals have two wires going to them, one positive, and one ground. The cornering lights have three wires, labeled A, B, and G. I found that A is the blinker, and that B is the parking lights, with G obviously being the ground. Should I run both A and B to the positive wire in the mirror light? Because I found that when running just wire B to the mirror light, if I have the lights on, and use the blinker, it only flashes once, then goes back to being steady.

I think the method used by the other member, was to tap the small 194 bulb that's in the headlight, not the cornering light. That way you only have the 2 wires (turn signal and parking light) and they use each other as a respective ground. Besides, that would be less wiring you have to deal with.

 

[cody_s]

I think the method used by the other member, was to tap the small 194 bulb that's in the headlight, not the cornering light. That way you only have the 2 wires (turn signal and parking light) and they use each other as a respective ground. Besides, that would be less wiring you have to deal with.

Oh wow, I never even realized that bulb was down there, only the big bulb works on mine, the 194 bulbs don't do anything. Never could figure out what they were supposed to do lol. There's really not that much of a difference with out them (Envoy, not a TB, so it's literally only in the bottom corner of the headlamp assembly) so I just haven't bothered with them. I'll see what I can figure out. Thanks for the tips

 

[cody_s]

Also, exactly where do I run the wire through? Do I go in through this seal?

How do I pull it through the other side?

 

[Blckshdw]

Also, exactly where do I run the wire through? Do I go in through this seal?

How do I pull it through the other side?

That foam padding in the hole, pulls out. There's a pair of nuts in there, just like the one on the right side of your pic. 10mm I think... All 3 of those come off, and release your side mirror. If you need to drill a hole in the mirror to pass your wiring through, I can take a pic of my old mirrors when I get home, to show you where I drilled mine at if you need me to.

 

[cody_s]

Fantastic, finally got it ill post pics tonight
*edit* well half done, only got one side done so far, then had to head to the eye doc. Finishing up in a bit.

 

[cody_s]

Damn, maybe not. Now when the parking rights are on, the dash shows a solid green turn arrow indicator. If I turn the turn signal on, the blinker will flash once, then do nothing.
*edit* Think I know what went wrong, I'll test again in a bit.

 

[cody_s]

Fixed. What was happening was I connected the wire from the parking lamp up front to the wire going to the mirror light. However I forgot to cut the wire that was already going to the mirror light (sending the turn indicator current), so it was acting up. Cut it, and just have the parking light wire going to the mirrors. Don't think I'm going to end up running the turn signal wire as well, I kind of like the way it looks as is.

 

[Blckshdw]

Fixed. What was happening was I connected the wire from the parking lamp up front to the wire going to the mirror light. However I forgot to cut the wire that was already going to the mirror light (sending the turn indicator current), so it was acting up. Cut it, and just have the parking light wire going to the mirrors. Don't think I'm going to end up running the turn signal wire as well, I kind of like the way it looks as is.

You know better!!

 

[cody_s]

You know better!!

Haha touche. Well here ya go:

Looks kinda crappy since it's a cell phone pic, and the front lights are so much brighter than the mirrors (tinted), so here's a closeup of the mirror:

Was thinking about upgrading to LED, but I think they're the perfect brightness. I think having LED lights right there would get irritating while driving after a while. But I'm quite happy with how they came out.