Homebuilt Lift

[teach]

Good Afternoon,

I am wanting to level/lift out my tb, not only do I not like the rake but I also do some mild off roading while hunting and such. I have been researching lifts and while liftmiester lifts look great, I am cheap and I like knowing I have steel supporting my suspension. So I am thinking about building my own lift. I teach shop at school so I have the equipment and the know how when it comes to welding it up. I have been researching lifts. There are some lifts that mount above the strut assembly and some that mount above the springs and below the strut mount. I have read that there are problems with the lifts above the whole assembly.

I am wanting to put roughly a 2" lift on and want to know if it would cause problems to build a lift that goes above the strut assembly? If so why would it be a problem?

Just so you know I am looking at useing 3/8" plate and 1/4" wall pipe to build the spacers in the front, and use solid round stock for the rear spacers.

 

[The_Roadie]

Welcome! You're right to research first, even though I believe home-fabbed lifts are misplaced frugality. The cost of the lift is MINOR compared to the expense of bigger/better tires, recovery and communication equipment, emergency supplies, and an offroad-you're-gonna-break-something fund.

It's also hard to break a cast aluminum spacer, but the rubber or poly upper shock mounts can be a weak spot if not inspected regularly.

That said, the issue with the outside-the-strut spacers is that they lengthen the strut when it's fully extended. More than 1/2" longer strut will stress and break your inner CV joint, which is right at the limit of its design without binding. You could get away with a longer spacer of this design only if you were 2WD, but then the next thing to break would be the upper ball joint's shaft, which goes into the upper control arm at an angle at full extension. If bent at a greater angle, the shaft will bind in its socket and ultimately break off. Most offroaders use a trick we discovered of exchanging the upper control arms from left to right side and flipping them upside down, gaining a few more degrees on the ball joint for safety, not to extend the strut length.

Some criminal Ebay vendors sell 2" outside-the-strut spacers. I used to try to get them shut down, but the more effective way is to try to educate everybody who comes here first for research.

For inside-the-strut spring spacers, all they do is preload the spring, and change your resting height. You essentially trade uptravel for downtravel since there's no free lunch. The stroke of the strut is fixed by the shock design. We also use stiffer springs, since GM offered at least ten different spring stiffnesses for this platform. But again, that just gets you more ground clearance in trade for less uptravel.

 

[djthumper]

This is probably costs less than any other lift that is recommended for our platform, 2in Leveling Lift Kit for 02-07 Chevy Trailblazer / GMC Envoy [289] | Rough Country Suspension Systems. They back their warranty and I have not heard of any major complaints about them. Is your time that you would put into building a set really worth less than that? Is your life worth being that frugal to not go with tried and true equipment?

 

[The_Roadie]

There was this guy in Kuwait on the other site years ago whose fabricator made a 4" OUTSIDE-THE-STRUT spacer. I nicknamed his truck the Kuwaiti Death Trap.

View attachment 32441

 

[teach]

Is your time that you would put into building a set really worth less than that? Is your life worth being that frugal to not go with tried and true equipment?

Not trying to be rude but that lift is an above the strut style which as roadie explained is not good. As for my time I'm at school anyway, it gives the students a chance to use tools to cut out the parts(I don't trust their welds that much) an they can learn how to design precise things. Last really I'm risking my life making my own lift? I'm pretty sure 3/8" plate an 1/4" wall pipe is much stronger than that rough country lift.

Thank you for the advise roadie. Does anyone have any pictures lift components that go between the spring and mount?

 

[djthumper]

Not trying to be rude but that lift is an above the strut style which as roadie explained is not good. As for my time I'm at school anyway, it gives the students a chance to use tools to cut out the parts(I don't trust their welds that much) an they can learn how to design precise things. Last really I'm risking my life making my own lift? I'm pretty sure 3/8" plate an 1/4" wall pipe is much stronger than that rough country lift.

Thank you for the advise roadie. Does anyone have any pictures lift components that go between the spring and mount?

Actually it is not just above the strut. It is built similar to the BDS lift and replaces the rubber isolator and such. It is also on the recommended list on ORTB. But hey what do I know? Are you sure it is stronger? Do you know what the tinsel strength of the metal RC is using on their lift? If you were only making the 1/2" above strut spacers I would say more power to you. You may want to consider further research before telling other members they are wrong in what they post to you when you ask for help.

 

[teach]

Actually it is not just above the strut. It is built similar to the BDS lift and replaces the rubber isolator and such. It is also on the recommended list on ORTB. But hey what do I know? Are you sure it is stronger? Do you know what the tinsel strength of the metal RC is using on their lift? If you were only making the 1/2" above strut spacers I would say more power to you. You may want to consider further research before telling other members they are wrong in what they post to you when you ask for help.

My bad I must have looked at the pictures in the link you sent wrong. But FYI I wasn't trying to pick a fight or tell you that you didn't know anything just voicing my opinion.

I edited what I had put a bit ago because I don't want to be that guy who starts fights so I'm not going to argue with the rest of your post.

 

[djthumper]

Compression is not the only pressure on the lift when you are in motion. granted a lot of that is taken up by the mounting hardware and the strut itself but there is still some lateral pressures including possible twisting. If the pip you use doesn't have enough strength it the compression itself can compress the pipe. So a lot of what it comes down to is the type of pipe you are planning on using to built with and what method you are going to use to weld.

 

[teach]

I do have another question I'm also thinking about just doing a 1 inch spacer in the front just to level it out. Then build or buy the 2" lift when I get new tires. Would it still be a strain on the cv and ball joint with only 1"?

 

[djthumper]

If you are going through all of the trouble to do a 1" spacer you may as well do the 2 or 3" because of the work involved to put the spacer in. If you do a 1/2" spacer on top of the strut assembly it is a lot less work. The 1/2" does a decent job of changing the rake. Any lift will add strain to our CVs due to it changes the angle slightly. You will also have to get a front end alignment.

 

[teach]

If you are going through all of the trouble to do a 1" spacer you may as well do the 2 or 3" because of the work involved to put the spacer in. If you do a 1/2" spacer on top of the strut assembly it is a lot less work. The 1/2" does a decent job of changing the rake. Any lift will add strain to our CVs due to it changes the angle slightly. You will also have to get a front end alignment.

That's a good point I forgot about the alignment part. Would I look goofy running stock tires with a 2" lift?

I cant bring myself to replace almost new tires.

 

[blazinlow89]

That's a good point I forgot about the alignment part. Would I look goofy running stock tires with a 2" lift?

I cant bring myself to replace almost new tires.

You would not be the first, but you can also run up to 30.5" without spacers. Which would be 245/75/16, or 245/70/17 depending on your OEM wheel size. I ran a set of Generals for a while and it was a nice fit. Granted the larger 265/75/16 look a lot better, but may also require trimming as well as spacers. Of course you could also buy spacers to bring the wheels out after the lift which would make the wheels "look" bigger as they would not be stuffed up in the wheel wells.

 

[djthumper]

That's a good point I forgot about the alignment part. Would I look goofy running stock tires with a 2" lift?

I cant bring myself to replace almost new tires.

I ran with stock tires for almost 6 months, August, before I had to buy tires. Then I bought 30.6" tires for my stock 16" rims since I did not have enough saved up for the new rims to get what I really wanted. Just before Christmas that same year I got great deal on a set of new 16" wheels with enough offset that I should be able to fit 32s in there.

I know you are a member over on ORTB, take a look at the build threads over there. Plenty have started out with the smaller tires for a while.

 

[teach]

Thanks djthumper. Those dang build threads started this whole idea. Ha ha. I've been looking through them but will continue to.

 

[The_Roadie]

And don't forget that a 1/2" outside the strut spacer will lift the front end 3/4" because of the lever arm action in the lower control arm. The strut mounts onto a pin 2/3 of the way out from the LCA inboard pivots to the steering knuckle.

 

[teach]

Deleted double post

 

[Envoy_04]

And don't forget that a 1/2" outside the strut spacer will lift the front end 3/4" because of the lever arm action in the lower control arm. The strut mounts onto a pin 2/3 of the way out from the LCA inboard pivots to the steering knuckle.

Roadie, how much extra wear do these alone induce to the front end parts? Such as the case where they'd be used to correct a front end sag issue.

 

[The_Roadie]

Nobody can possibly know the cost in maintenance and wear of any lift components because nobody's done controlled experiments. And there's too much variability in the longevity of wheel hubs and CV shafts anyway. Same thing for how much you lose in gas mileage, although the typical number we throw out on ORTB is just due to decreased aerodynamic efficiency of the underbody->ground distance you might lose 1-2 MPG. Tires with more rolling resistance can rob you of another 1-2 MPG. Roof racks even more.

That usually persuades the kids who just want to "look aggressive" that they can't afford any worse gas mileage, and they give up their silly ideas. Cheap ass kids.

 

[IllogicTC]

I thought the TrailBlazer already looked aggressive, in fact the last of the GMT designs to do so. Everything else now is built to look stupid, sleek, or "husky" rather than straight-up mad. But it doesn't look offroading aggressive, that's the big pivot point I guess

 

[blazinlow89]

That usually persuades the kids who just want to "look aggressive" that they can't afford any worse gas mileage, and they give up their silly ideas. Cheap ass kids.

Never seen that, if I would have read that I would have kept my mall cruiser at stock height

I have been places I never would have gone without the lift, worth every penny and the increased size of my carbon footprint which makes hippies cry.

On a serious note, I want to say I read on a site a while back that for every inch of lift you increase wear on various components by 5-10%. Throw in wheels spacers, less offset wheels, bigger tires and the increased angle on the front end components and I am sure we are at about 20-30% faster wear. Like Roadie has pointed out we have no good control for the true life expectancy to go against.

 

[The_Roadie]

Offroaders who let their components wear out instead of breaking them just aren't wheeling it hard enough.

 

[IllogicTC]

which makes hippies cry.

Why can I only hit like once?

 

[blazinlow89]

Offroaders who let their components wear out instead of breaking them just aren't wheeling it hard enough.

I was thinking that if someones biggest issue with a lift is increased wear on parts, they need to re-evaluate what their goal is.

That is an awesome picture by the way Roadie, I can hear Doc Brown saying "where were going, we don't need roads".

 

[The_Roadie]

I can hear Doc Brown saying "where were going, we don't need roads".

HOW DID YOU POSSIBLY KNOW....that's my lucky offroad tshirt?!?!? :wootwoot: I have two of them, and I've never once rolled down a 4000 foot dropoff while wearing one.

 

[paul2005tb]

Is that a real life picture of the Roadie ?

 

[Mounce]

In the flesh

 

[paul2005tb]

That Roadie pic makes sense, I see wisdom oozing out of his ears. ..

Question: Is the danger of the top of the strut lift associated with the fact that we only have two mounting bolts?

For instance if we had 4 or 5 mounting bolts would such a lift be suitable ?

 

[Mounce]

It's explained in the third paragraph of post #2 by The Roadie himself.

 

[minisuv]

Welcome! You're right to research first, even though I believe home-fabbed lifts are misplaced frugality. The cost of the lift is MINOR compared to the expense of bigger/better tires, recovery and communication equipment, emergency supplies, and an offroad-you're-gonna-break-something fund.

It's also hard to break a cast aluminum spacer, but the rubber or poly upper shock mounts can be a weak spot if not inspected regularly.

That said, the issue with the outside-the-strut spacers is that they lengthen the strut when it's fully extended. More than 1/2" longer strut will stress and break your inner CV joint, which is right at the limit of its design without binding. You could get away with a longer spacer of this design only if you were 2WD, but then the next thing to break would be the upper ball joint's shaft, which goes into the upper control arm at an angle at full extension. If bent at a greater angle, the shaft will bind in its socket and ultimately break off. Most offroaders use a trick we discovered of exchanging the upper control arms from left to right side and flipping them upside down, gaining a few more degrees on the ball joint for safety, not to extend the strut length.

Some criminal Ebay vendors sell 2" outside-the-strut spacers. I used to try to get them shut down, but the more effective way is to try to educate everybody who comes here first for research.

For inside-the-strut spring spacers, all they do is preload the spring, and change your resting height. You essentially trade uptravel for downtravel since there's no free lunch. The stroke of the strut is fixed by the shock design. We also use stiffer springs, since GM offered at least ten different spring stiffnesses for this platform. But again, that just gets you more ground clearance in trade for less uptravel.

what do you think is the better way to golift meiser/rough country? I will be adding a body lift as well to get 285/70/17 under their.

 

[Blckshdw]

what do you think is the better way to golift meiser/rough country? I will be adding a body lift as well to get 285/70/17 under their.

MarkMC all day long.

 

[Sparky]

x2, I'd get Mark's 3" lift personally. But you're talking almost a 33" tall tire and fairly wide. I rubbed slightly with a 265/75R16 tire which only took a minor trim of the bumper's corner at the mount point, but still rub the liner on occasion (cranked wheel in reverse usually). You may need to do a body lift also to gain enough clearance, and be prepared to trim stuff, quite possibly more than just some plastic liners.

 

[minisuv]

MarkMC all day long.

3inch or a little smaller to give room for stuff to move since all is maxed out already.

 

[minisuv]

I live in a quiet mountain town with many tourists rolling through. There was a trail blazer in town that was way ff the norm. almost 2500 for a 4" lift. He sent it to CA they changed the oilpan, motor mounts and did crazy stuff then put a 3 body lift when they were avail. It was a nicer ride then mine smooth with 36's on it 10 wide wheel. He showed me a pic book of hid friend who went up 6"+ with a coil over straight axle set up which is neat to. Oil pan was smaller with a race set up external pump and other goodies also bought a 3" body lift and sat on it he ran 35/14/17 super swampers on 12" wide wheels when he gets hoe he will email me pics of both rigs to share. It is nice to see people are still messing with these trucks. I am soo tempted to go straight axle up front but my wallett says idk. Moral of the story no homade lifts. I have seen hocky pucks for 1" body lift and spacers made for pathfinder that failed.

 

[Sparky]

I had a dream of customizing the oil pan on my truck to lower the diff, but it never happened.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

This guy built his own lift...

 

[Blckshdw]

This guy built his own lift...

... and exoskeleton!! That's pretty damn impressive, I gotta say.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

10,000 lbs of awesome

 

[Sparky]

Who's truck is that?!

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

Its a guy in TX or OK on Pirate4x4. It is basically a buggy with axletech 4000 axles.

 

[minisuv]

there are quite a few that made their own lifts I would do a 6" lift straight axle if I could 35's. one hell of a way to go and wheel. I found a forum on extreme 4x4 a guy in Iceland did it they run toyotas up their but someone set theirs up to run deep glacier snow. He is sending me build pics I will post the when I get them and it still looks like a trail blazer not hacked up. but nice wide dick cepek tires, fenders cut, nice bumpers they know how to do it up there.