Looking to tow my 02 Envoy SLE 4x4 behind my motorhome. My Envoy has a Snoway plow setup so I can't put on a towbar without removing the plow frame. I want to tow it behind the motorhome using a car dolly. The manual says it can be flat towed with the transfer case in neutral and trans in park and goes on to say it is not designed to be dolly towed. Does anyone know why GMC says the Envoy is not designed to be dolly towed? With the transfer case in neutral would the rear axle roll fine with the front wheels strapped to a dolly or would the front whels also have to be able to roll? Has anyone dolly towed an Envoy/TB with the transfer case in neutral?
Can a 02 Envoy 4x4 be towed on a car dolly?
- Thread starter offduty
- Start date
Welcome!
I'm sure the neutral TC mode will let the wheels roll just fine for short distances. The issue is possibly that the relative speed of the front driveshaft (zero) and the rear driveshaft (road speed) now appears across the transfer case clutches. Even though the clutches are not engaged, the relative motion is going to churn up the fluid, heating it up, and any residual friction between the clutch plates can damage them. Of course, thinking more, this is the identical situation if the front wheels are on the ground, unless neutral mode also engages the front axle actuator and then the front driveshaft is turning in the otherwise neutral mode and the only thing disconnected is the transmission.
A bit of experimentation would show if the front driveshaft is turning while rolling in TC neutral mode. Sorry I'm not with my shop manuals to see if they discuss the issue.
I think removing the rear driveshaft, or fabricating a tow bar adapter for your plow mount, are your only two options.
Also, does your tow dolly have electric brakes controlled by the MH? If not, that's a problem for many jurisdictions that limit the weight of unbraked towed things to 1500 or 2000 pounds. Perhaps your MH has brakes up for the task, but without self-powered electric brakes in the toad or the dolly, you won't have breakaway protection. That's a scary prospect.
I'm sure the neutral TC mode will let the wheels roll just fine for short distances. The issue is possibly that the relative speed of the front driveshaft (zero) and the rear driveshaft (road speed) now appears across the transfer case clutches. Even though the clutches are not engaged, the relative motion is going to churn up the fluid, heating it up, and any residual friction between the clutch plates can damage them. Of course, thinking more, this is the identical situation if the front wheels are on the ground, unless neutral mode also engages the front axle actuator and then the front driveshaft is turning in the otherwise neutral mode and the only thing disconnected is the transmission.
A bit of experimentation would show if the front driveshaft is turning while rolling in TC neutral mode. Sorry I'm not with my shop manuals to see if they discuss the issue.
I think removing the rear driveshaft, or fabricating a tow bar adapter for your plow mount, are your only two options.
Also, does your tow dolly have electric brakes controlled by the MH? If not, that's a problem for many jurisdictions that limit the weight of unbraked towed things to 1500 or 2000 pounds. Perhaps your MH has brakes up for the task, but without self-powered electric brakes in the toad or the dolly, you won't have breakaway protection. That's a scary prospect.
Roadie, Thanks for the reply.
The dollies I'm looking at all have surge brakes w/breakaway but from what you say about how the TC works with clutches it sounds like dolly towing an Envoy is out. Bummer.
If the front driveshaft is turning with the TC in neutral would there be a chance the front axle would/could engage?
I like the idea of using a dolly since it could be used to tow different vehicles without having to have numerous tow bar mounts and braking systems installed. Guess I'll have to shop for a cheap front wheel drive car to toss on the dolly.
The dollies I'm looking at all have surge brakes w/breakaway but from what you say about how the TC works with clutches it sounds like dolly towing an Envoy is out. Bummer.
If the front driveshaft is turning with the TC in neutral would there be a chance the front axle would/could engage?
I like the idea of using a dolly since it could be used to tow different vehicles without having to have numerous tow bar mounts and braking systems installed. Guess I'll have to shop for a cheap front wheel drive car to toss on the dolly.
I forgot about surge breaks. Mrs. Roadie and I originally planned to cash in our house about now, retire, and run a MH around the country like everybody wanted to do in the 80's. I did a lot of planning, only to have her declare her annoyance with driving around, and then she found a partner and opened a brick and mortar quilting shop she has no exit strategy for and which ended up (darn) being profitable. So we're stuck.
What happens with the front driveshaft in neutral is an interesting question I'll have to research and do the experiment.
A cheap FWD toad is a better idea weight-wise anyway. My vision was to flat-tow a Jeep or Samurai, to preserve some offroading ability while forest camping with the MH.
What happens with the front driveshaft in neutral is an interesting question I'll have to research and do the experiment.
A cheap FWD toad is a better idea weight-wise anyway. My vision was to flat-tow a Jeep or Samurai, to preserve some offroading ability while forest camping with the MH.
Sparky
Member
- Dec 4, 2011
- 12,927
I can't imagine there really being much difference flat towing vs front wheels on a dolly when the transfer case is in neutral. The front disconnect is not engaged in either case, so the front driveshaft and rear will be at different speeds regardless. Sure a few things will spin, but inside the case F and R shafts are not connected and all clutches are released, so it won't make any difference. The fluid may get a little warmed up from it, but no worse than the differentials (probably less even).
I think we may just be over analyzing it for no real reason.
I think we may just be over analyzing it for no real reason.
The warning in the Owner's Manual is the thing giving us worry. If there wasn't some other technical reason, why would they forbid dolly towing?
Could the warning that the Envoy is not designed to be dolly towed be due to there being no steering lock?The_Roadie said:
I found these replies on the Woodall's site about if the steering needs to be locked when dolly towing:
"When on a dolly, the steering wheel MUST be locked, otherwise the dolly's swivel plate can turn 1 direction and the car's front wheels turn the other direction and you are pulling the car off center, possibly into the next lane."
"This is the reply I received from Forest River for their Car-Tow Dolly.
Quote: Always load the vehicle -in-tow facing forward. Making sure the steering wheel is immobilized by locking ignition switch or tying off steering wheel to seat frame or suitable point.. Towing a rearward-facing vehicle may cause swaying with towed combination."
Since the Envoy has no steering wheel lock maybe the lawyers at GMC decided to just blanket state "Not designed to be dolly towed" to cover GMC's butt.
As for pulling the weight my MH seems to handle it just fine. I towed a 20' trailer loaded with motorcycles (using a trailer toad to carry the tongue weight) back and forth from NY to FL (twice), VA, and SD and she performed flawlessly. Loaded the trailer (and toad) was about 6500 lbs. Tongue weight on the trailer toad a little over 1000 lbs., tongue weight carried by the MH less than 75 lbs. Only drawback was not really being able to back up with the trailer toad and trailer connected.
linneje
Member
- Apr 26, 2012
- 404
When my starter went, the tow truck operator told me the dolly tow was OK, but he had to lock the steering wheel. He seemed pretty knowledgeable about the Envoy, knew the differences between the 4.2 and 5.3, and knew where the starter was located without even looking. So I trusted his knowledge. He assured me the tow was OK as long as he properly locked the steering.
Sure and if I was only going to dolly tow it one time I might consider that. I want to be able to bring it along on a regular basis and constantly removing and reinstalling the driveshaft is not something I want to be doing every time I go RV'ing.KNBlazer said:
