bypassing tranny cooler in Radiator for an external, ok for winter?

[bspurloc]

So the tranny shop says the radiator internal transmission cooler was clogged and I guess they could not unclog it.
They offered to bypass it and add an external which I said ok to. seemed logical and I made sure they knew I knew how much they cost and would do it myself if they detoured away from that price.
My friend declares GM transmission need to get to 160F+ asap and if I leave this as an external only the transmission will never or take too long to get up to temp in winter.
So any experience with using an external only? the shop gave me a 3 year warranty so I am not really concerned but would like to know the answer.
thanks

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

I run both internal and external. Dont often see 160 in the winter, but it doesnt hurt it as long as occasionally it gets up there. I would think worst case is you wrap the external or cover it from direct air flow if temps seem too cool to you.

 

[bspurloc]

true! I have the twin electric fan setup BTW.
Speaking of temps, is the transmission temperature readable via ODB on this vehicle? I know on my friends Vette its displayed in the dash readout.
I am thinking of getting a cheap digital readout for this car so my daughter has actual numbers to look at instead of needles and her telling me the cars rpm jumped to 4! and me thinking 4? lol

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

I use a Scanguage II that is velcro'ed above radio for trans temp, mpg and such

 

[Matt]

Torque will read the trans temp.

 

[C-ya]

Did they install an external cooler that has the temp bypass feature? The cooler won't flow fluid into the coils unless it is a certain viscosity (as a function of temp). Once that temp is hit, the thinner/hotter fluid is able to access the coils to get cooled. No covering necessary. See Link for an example.

 

[coolasice]

Torque will read the trans temp.

That doesnt work on my 08..

 

[Mooseman]

I had bypassed the rad cooler in my previous two trucks, no issues here, and I don't think they were even temperature controlled neither like the B&M.

That doesnt work on my 08..

Doesn't work on my '06 neither. Probably changed the PID at some point.

 

[bspurloc]

not sure what they installed yet...
I have a scangauge II for my car! in I think another car forum someone showed me one half the price of the scangauge and had more readouts 6 or 8.

Oh this one!
http://ultra-gauge.com/ultragauge/ultragauge_wired.htm

 

[Matt]

That doesnt work on my 08..

There's a PID you have to enter, did you do that?

 

[C-ya]

Both Method 1 and 2 work on Torque for my '05.

Here is what goes in Torque. They were both there when I set it to use the expanded PIDs for GM.

OBD2 Mode and PID: 221940
Long Name: Transmission Fluid Temp (GM Method 1 or 2) <- this is in the name
Short Name: Trans.Fl.Tmp
Minimum value: 0.0
Maximum value: 200.0
Scale factor: x1
Unit type: °C (but it displays °F since I have my units set to standard)
Equation: A-40
OBD Header: Auto (Method 1) or 7E2 (Method 2) - do not enter anything other than Auto or 7E2. The notes in parentheses are just for you.

 

[coolasice]

There's a PID you have to enter, did you do that?

I've tried it all, nothing worked

 

[Matt]

That's strange, works just fine in my 02 and obviously in C-ya's 05. Maybe it's another 06+ weirdness.

 

[Mooseman]

Same here on my 06. I get nothing on either. GM can't leave well enough alone!

 

[bspurloc]

What are you entering this into?

Both Method 1 and 2 work on Torque for my '05.

Here is what goes in Torque. They were both there when I set it to use the expanded PIDs for GM.

OBD2 Mode and PID: 221940
Long Name: Transmission Fluid Temp (GM Method 1 or 2) <- this is in the name
Short Name: Trans.Fl.Tmp
Minimum value: 0.0
Maximum value: 200.0
Scale factor: x1
Unit type: °C (but it displays °F since I have my units set to standard)
Equation: A-40
OBD Header: Auto (Method 1) or 7E2 (Method 2) - do not enter anything other than Auto or 7E2. The notes in parentheses are just for you.

 

[C-ya]

@bspurloc , mine was there when I added the expanded PIDs. If you want to add it manually, click Settings on the main page, then scroll down to Manage extra PIDs/Sensors. If that doesn't allow you to add the GM/Opel settings (I can't remember, and since I have them active, I can't find them to "activate" them), click the menu button on your Android device and click Add custom PID.

 

[AtlWrk]

Same here on my 06. I get nothing on either. GM can't leave well enough alone!

Weird, it works fine on my '06.

I was under the impression that the switch to the CAN-bus and separate ECM and TCM ('08?) is what broke it.

Just my two cents regarding the OP: your transmission does not "get to 160F+ asap" anyway. Normal driving can take anywhere from 20-30 minutes for the transmission to get that warm. Modern ATFs are designed specifically to perform well at low temperatures.

 

[bspurloc]

I guess I am asking... what is Torque? an odb2 device?

@bspurloc , mine was there when I added the expanded PIDs. If you want to add it manually, click Settings on the main page, then scroll down to Manage extra PIDs/Sensors. If that doesn't allow you to add the GM/Opel settings (I can't remember, and since I have them active, I can't find them to "activate" them), click the menu button on your Android device and click Add custom PID.

 

[Mooseman]

Torque is an Android app that can communicate with a Bluetooth OBD interface to read codes and show most live data.

 

[C-ya]

I guess I am asking... what is Torque? an odb2 device?

Torque is an Android app that can communicate with a Bluetooth OBD interface to read codes and show most live data.

Sorry, @bspurloc ! I didn't get that you didn't know what Torque was/is. Like @Mooseman said, it is an Android-based app that uses a cheapish Bluetooth dongle to communicate with the vehicle through the OBDII port. There is a lite version of Torque that is free to test. If it works and you want the full app, it is only a whopping $5 - unless the price has gone up since I got it. The dongles are in the $10-25 range. They are available on ebay and Amazon. Some are better than others, but there is no real consensus on what to look for to guarantee that it will work. Check out this section to do some reading about it.

 

[Sparky]

Not sure why the trans "has" to be 160 F. The 4L60E in my Silverado doesn't usually get that warm (has a readout on the DIC). Typically gets around 140F but that's about it, summer a bit warmer but winter nope.

 

[bspurloc]

Ok cool on Torque makes sense now lol.
yeah my friend gets a little overboard with stuff, I mean we just put a secondary transmission cooler on his vette and drove it around to test it. It took just over 20minutes to get to 160 even though the radiator was at 180 pretty fast. so if someone takes a lot of 15 minute drives the tranny is never going to get to 160 anyway. and a lot of people do that so transmissions would be dead all over.
Got the car back from the transmission shop, he said the internal cooler was totally plugged and could not flush it. ah well the owner seems like a good guy didn't try to push anything or charge too much for things. very honest.

Weird, it works fine on my '06.

I was under the impression that the switch to the CAN-bus and separate ECM and TCM ('08?) is what broke it.

Just my two cents regarding the OP: your transmission does not "get to 160F+ asap" anyway. Normal driving can take anywhere from 20-30 minutes for the transmission to get that warm. Modern ATFs are designed specifically to perform well at low temperatures.

Not sure why the trans "has" to be 160 F. The 4L60E in my Silverado doesn't usually get that warm (has a readout on the DIC). Typically gets around 140F but that's about it, summer a bit warmer but winter nope.

 

[AtlWrk]

Just to further muddy the waters:
Perusing around the interwebs I came across a quote from an official GM transmission manual regarding aftermarket coolers that says to put it before the in-radiator cooler to avoid overcooling the fluid and that 150F is the "minimum for continuous duty" (doesn't say why).

BUT...the same post then goes on to say that a later version of the manual says the exact opposite: put it after the stock cooler

In the absence of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, do what you're comfortable with. I personally wouldn't lose sleep over having an external-only setup

 

[bspurloc]

lol... well the only place it could go is in front of the radiator since I have twin electric fans at the back. I can't see what kind they installed its pretty tight in there. I would have to pull the front grill to get a good look, but I am not really worried.
He gave me a 3 year 50,000 warranty, so he is pretty confident it will be good.
They seemed to take their time to clean the external of the transmission and TC. The black cylinder is actually shiny chrome like.

Just to further muddy the waters:
Perusing around the interwebs I came across a quote from an official GM transmission manual regarding aftermarket coolers that says to put it before the in-radiator cooler to avoid overcooling the fluid and that 150F is the "minimum for continuous duty" (doesn't say why).

BUT...the same post then goes on to say that a later version of the manual says the exact opposite: put it after the stock cooler

In the absence of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, do what you're comfortable with. I personally wouldn't lose sleep over having an external-only setup

 

[Sparky]

I was on the road for an hour yesterday and my trans never broke 145F on the Silverado.

 

[C-ya]

@bspurloc , he meant routing the lines to cool the tranny fluid in one cooler first and then the other.

Checked my stock setup driving home from K-zoo (45 minute drive) and my trans was 199°F and my oil was 234°F. May be (past) time to get a cooler...

 

[Sparky]

According to Torque my trans temp was the same as my coolant temp on the Trailblazer, so either it was just reading coolant temp or the setup in the TB makes the transmission run warm.

Either way, got 215k out of it, and when I sold the rust heap this weekend it still ran great and the trans fluid while due for a change was still looking decent.

 

[bspurloc]

thanks for all the info. I gotta figure out a monitor that wont annoy her. lol.
maybe scanguage is the best cuz its small and not bright.

 

[bspurloc]

I was thumbing through the scangauge on my ford and didn't see Transmission Temp. I haven't touched my scangauge config in years. do you remember if you had to program that to see the transmission temp?
I would never remember you could program new gauges if I didn't have one on the main screen lol

I use a Scanguage II that is velcro'ed above radio for trans temp, mpg and such

 

[Blckshdw]

I had to add the transmission temp on my SGII.

 

[bspurloc]

I had to add the transmission temp on my SGII.

Ok I have to figure out how to mount that wont annoy my daughter.
I put an after market radio in so there is no more room there.

 

[Blckshdw]

Ok I have to figure out how to mount that wont annoy my daughter.
I put an after market radio in so there is no more room there.

Since it's wired, I kept it in the little coin tray below the radio stack, just in front of the gear shift handle. Have the cable routed behind that carpet flap, and then up over the knee bolster panel, so everything is out of the way. Since the gauges I have displayed aren't necessary very often, it doesn't bother me having them that low.

 

[DocBrown]

Not sure why the trans "has" to be 160 F. The 4L60E in my Silverado doesn't usually get that warm (has a readout on the DIC). Typically gets around 140F but that's about it, summer a bit warmer but winter nope.

Same here. The only times I see temps above 160 is when towing my travel trailer.