They were both clear no oil or anything in them also level was the same.Mounce said:Looks like water in the oil to me.. Have you looked at the coolant in the radiator to see if anything is in there? Look at the radiator cap too like you did the oil cap.
I checked under the cap of my envoy and there was nothing so it seems that the moisture is more specific to his. The dipstick only had oil, no signs of moisture. also no we were wiring in his emergency lights and it was cold So we will do it next Sunday .littleblazer said:It only takes a little water to do that, I'd say pull the oil and send it to a lab and have them check for coolant in it, I had a oil cooler on a boat fail and it looked about like that. Does it look the same on the dip stick? It is possible it is just condensation, mine gets that a little in the winter, but not that bad... You ever get around to the compression check?
5w-30 valvoline part-synthetic high mileagelittleblazer said:Still suspicious, what kind of oil was used for the change?
i doubt its the head gasket since it runs fine and coolant isnt affected at all also wouldn't carbon build up cause this too, with too much carbon it could make the rings stick and burn alot more oil right?Mounce said:Piston rings won't let water into the oil because there's no water in the cylinders.. If compression tests fail to meet specs, its either unrelated or your head gasket is leaking which then you'd be losing oil most likely.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, that's just how I see it.
ive heard of piston rings sticking in place and not being able to move on the piston which would cause it to burn an excess of oil but idk, we never had a problem of burning oil especially like this before.Mounce said:Make the rings stick to what? They're stationary on the piston and are constantly moving while the engine is running. I always understood that only wore out rings would make it burn oil and they shouldn't be wore out at 135k miles.
You're good.Mounce said:Piston rings won't let water into the oil because there's no water in the cylinders.. If compression tests fail to meet specs, its either unrelated or your head gasket is leaking which then you'd be losing oil most likely.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, that's just how I see it.
-I'll correct myself I think lol. After a quick look at things, it is losing oil? (I have a habit of reading a thread one day and forgetting half of the issues the next day)
once again this sunday pulling all the plugs and checking the compression should paint a clear picture of any problem in the engine, before i got the 05 envoy i had a 99 blazer that a mechanic messed up and it blew the head gasket i know what its like and yes it does smell sweet and it also ran like crap, it also used dex cool.littleblazer said:You're good.
Could the water in the oil be a fluke? Maybe, but it would take a bit to make it that noticeable on the cap. Since the coolant system is pressurized from what I can understand, coolant will leak out, but oil won't leak in. But if the oil level isn't changing then in theory coolant isn't leaking out, and thus it is only losing oil. an eighth of a quart of coolant missing wont make a difference as far as level, you won't notice it really, but on the dipstick you should. There are too many unknowns in play right now to draw a conclusion though. Some things need to be eliminated from play before diagnosis can proceed. Generally a blown head gasket/ coolant leak will produce a sweet smell, I don't know if that's the case with dex cool though. On another note, my boat had an exhaust leak (watercooled) that allowed water into the 4th cylinder. There were no drivability issues unless extremely long periods of time were spent at idle, it felt like it was flooding. an increase in rpm would cause a rough running motor for about 10 seconds then clear up, the increased air flow was enough to dispel any further ingestion. Things aren't always by the book diagnosis's, motors can be tricky beasts and there could be an entire variable we are missing currently. I just don't want to make any wrong assessments and end up running around in circles when simple things are missed, sorry.
Exactly. I don't think it's a head gasket, but it could be excess condensation from letting it idle, the oil will take a very long time to warm up, so if there is moisture it will take longer to boil out... loose rings plus pressurized crank equals blow by which equals oil consumption. That's the way I see the oil leaving if it's not leaking out underneath it... I wonder if it's leaking into the bell housing, but I would think it would still be able to leak on the ground from there...Gerbil21 said:once again this sunday pulling all the plugs and checking the compression should paint a clear picture of any problem in the engine, before i got the 05 envoy i had a 99 blazer that a mechanic messed up and it blew the head gasket i know what its like and yes it does smell sweet and it also ran like crap, it also used dex cool.
iirc i did post that my brother usually lets it idle for a while, he usually lets it idle for more that 12 minutes since the remote start timer shuts it off and he would start it again so it would be ready to go when he leaves, i have told him a few times that its completely unnecessary and if anything would be worse to do than driving cold but he still does.
when he first told me about seeing a cloud of smoke he said that was usually after it idled a bit and he drove away.
also i know the exhaust manifold bolts on these engine usually break but its usually the last cylinder it could be causing a problem but i really don't think its that
by now there would be 7 quarts in there lol, im going to check the pcv hose on top of the engine to see of there is any oil smoke coming from there also installing a catch can between the pcv hose between the intake manifold and engine would be a good idea to stop filling the exhaust with oil.littleblazer said:Exactly. I don't think it's a head gasket, but it could be excess condensation from letting it idle, the oil will take a very long time to warm up, so if there is moisture it will take longer to boil out... loose rings plus pressurized crank equals blow by which equals oil consumption. That's the way I see the oil leaving if it's not leaking out underneath it... I wonder if it's leaking into the bell housing, but I would think it would still be able to leak on the ground from there...
No I actually never wrote it, its only been like 300-450 miles but it may be a bit lower or a bit higher I'll check tomorrow. Also there is no visual smoke while idling and usually no smoke while driving except for times that my brother says that he can see a smoke cloud behind him while driving or after driving away after a few minutes of idling.littleblazer said:I don't know if I'm dumb or just missed it, but how many miles were there for the loss? If it's doing this in only a few hundred miles, it has to be leaking, you would know if it were burning that much I would think. The cpas is the one right behind the power steering pump correct? If you have access to it, an air hammer on low on the little mounting tab could vibrate it loose or make it spin, like an impact on a rusty bolt. [emoji1]
We talked about it and figured it would probably be more work pulling just the head dealing with the timing chain, head bolts, and also if we do it we still have an engine with oil burning problems. An engine swap would be in and out.littleblazer said:It could still be a head gasket, drain the oil, pull the head replace the gasket, then change the oil like 10 times. look back to see if it gets back in the oil again, it can still be saved. As far as engine swapping though, I guess get everything out you can, take your time document everything stay organized. Replace the motor mounts while you have it out as well, service anything that may be questionable? Thats what I would do.
Right now were planning on removing the head and replacing the head gasket if it looks all good and we can see that the gasket was the problem if not then a swap would be the only choice but we would already have the engine bare so it would be easier to remove.smokey262 said:If your brother is going to change the engine and keep the truck for awhile, the good news is that while it is out you will have outstanding access to a few of the things that suck to change with the engine in place. Thinking of the trans cooler tubes, power steering tubes, valve cover gasket, thermostat, etc.
I think hitting them with a Punch and using an impact should be good and hey maybe well be the firstMooseman said:Breaking them free by hand is what breaks them. GM suggests to tap them with a punch I guess to break them loose first. An impact might have the same effect. Or maybe using an air chisel with a point on it to hit the bolt head might work. I still think that some bolts will break. So far, haven't heard of anybody not breaking a head bolt.
well we started and gave up we also changed our mind to change the engine instead we are still going to tear this one down still and see what exactly happened, but the crazy high wind gust and its 20 degrees with a low of 1 so were not going to be doing this were going to see how much a shop can do it for.Mooseman said:Good luck bro.
Well tomorrow we'll found out but if we do it then its just 750 and the price for motor mounts and fluidsMooseman said:It's a lot of hours so it can't be cheap. I hear ya on doing it outside. I just swapped my rear diff and it wasn't pleasant. Who knows how much a rebuild costs. Got to be at least double the price of a used engine.