03 Trailblazer will not crank or start

[budwich]

good testing... maybe

sorry if I appear hard on you, but when I am working with your hands and eyes, then my head sometimes forgets this... if it was all me, I would be swearing when either my head, hands or eyes are not "co-operating"...

Anyways, something still fishy, first now you can't cause a "start noise" with your wire jumping so that's annoying and certainly not predicable based on your number of previous attempts. Second, your observation and test of the pin 85 contact doesn't jive. I do believe if you watch the video (again), you will see / hear him asking the "helper" to turn the key to start... NOT "ON". Further, I don't believe there is a ground put on there otherwise as that would cause the relay to always be operated which it shant be.... so the light should not light when the key is OFF or ON but only at "start".... at least that's what the video shows, that's what the posted circuit diagram shows and that's what my head tells me...

Regardless, pin 85 only has "impact" if you are trying to get the "key" mode of operation working. It has NO impact if you do your wire jumper technique as you have found in the past. I would suggest that your wire jumper is either not making contact properly or the base of the fuse block has an issue... probably / maybe. When you are placing the wire jumper in the contact points, are you seeing any sparking as you did at the starter???? A fuse block issue could explain why some other things are not working also.

 

[asusma]

Budwich, with the wire jump, there is spark because i can see it and hear it when i plug the jump wire into 30 to 87, every time, so i know the wire connections on the back of the fuse box are ok.

Next, I am able to do the ground check for terminal 85 alone because what I do is I clip alligator clips to the + battery terminal and the other end onto the red lead of the multimeter, allowing me to place the multimeter on the hood facing the driver, so I can see it through the window while sitting in the drivers seat. The other lead is hooked up to terminal 85. I can then crank the car and see the voltage go up from 0 to 11.5v. ONLY when i crank, not in any other position.

I finally managed to get the car starter only after hitting the starter a few times with a hammer. I then tried jumping it again with the wire and I could hear the solenoid working and shooting out the starter shaft, but the starter does not spin the gear. I was able to do that several times over. I then hit the starter a few more times and after countless tries, the car eventually started. Is this a common behavior of faulty starters? I may have wrongly explained my procedure, but I followed it exactly as the video suggested and obtained the same results, WITHOUT having the starter engaging.

Let me know what you can make from this. Thanks for your patience.

 

[asusma]

I have been able to start it numerous times now without a problem. Im out of ideas and scared to drive anywhere with it because thats when it will go back to acting up. Is this a behavior of a working starter? Does a BAD starter work sometimes or once a starter goes bad does it not work at all?

 

[budwich]

IF you have to "hammer" to get the starter to turn, then it is likely that it is bad. Is that a sign of a faulty starter?... it can be BUT it may not be "absolute"... why? because banging on the case may be enough to "fix" a poor connection, either ground or power, such that the next attempt works. The only way to confirm the starter is to take it off, go to a bench and provide the appropriate battery and ground conditions and see what happens. As I mentioned, you need to observe a predictable outcome every time, then you have some degree of confidence. So if every time you put power to it and it turns, then it is likely good but if one time it works and then it does not the next, then it likely not good. NOTE: even though it may always turn on your bench, doesn't mean it is good because your test doesn't have any load on the motor so it may be that the motor is weak (windings shorting) such that it works without load but under load, doesn't have enough to turn the motor. IF successful at the bench test, I would try re-install the motor one more time and see if you get consistent results, either starting or not. However, if it is NOT, then I would redo your checks again to confirm that something else hasn't found its way into your setup (as you have disturb things in taking things off and on). Then you can be certain that the starter is your likely candidate. Other than that, getting another starter with perhaps a good return policy (or a parts store that can do the bench test for yours) might be a good bet after your good effort to narrow things down.

As part of the bench test, you could may be look at the solenoid separately.... as I mentioned, some starters are made so that the solenoid can be replaced without replacing the entire starter. I don't know about this particular starter but that might be an option for you.

 

[asusma]

Budwich, thank you for the help. I did end up removing the starter and testing it. It turned out to be the solenoid as at times, probably 1/10 of tries it got "stuck" and a light tap got it to function. The zone also confirmed it was shot. I also went ahead and replaced the battery since it was under warranty due to it not holding up to a load test. My new problem is my battery light is on and my cluster reads battery not charging. On to the next issue I guess . I will do a little search on that since I'm sure others have come across this before. Thanks again guys for everything! One step closer to being a TB expert

 

[budwich]

without looking at the actual circuit, alot charge the battery thru the starter connections cause that's where the largest current carrying wiring exists, so I would look there to ensure the connections are good. Glad to hear that you got thru that starter issue.

ps. just did a quick look, chev is different, good / bad news, it has a fuse link (that's the bad part) coming off the B+ terminal of the alternator. Use your meter to check the B+ terminal at the alternator and at / near the other end some near the battery terminal... or measure the resistance of the fuse link (disconnected at both ends... ie. from the alternator and battery). My guess, you have blown the fuse link some how during some of your "jumper wiring"... maybe.

 

[asusma]

To sum up my issues, the no start no crank was due to a faulty solenoid that did not engage the starter. Replaced the starter and the issue was resolved. next the battery did not hold a load so that was replaced and as either a coincidence or cause of the bad battery, the alternator went out. I removed, tested and confirmed its fault unless along with its replacement. Thanks again for all the insight. Gmtnation rocks!

 

[ShawnH199]

I appear to be having a variation of the issue. I can turn the key and hear a single click of the solenoid trying to engage but will not turn over. I took off the ignition relay and did try to jump past it. Each time I would get a click coming from the solenoid but no cranking. It happened all of a sudden. I even took the battery out of my truck and connected it but nothing would make it crank. I am buying a new AC Delco starter in the morning either way. Everything else comes on, just no cranking.

 

[ShawnH199]

Just wanted to update. The starter was the culprit. I changed it in about an hour and if there isn't a comment on it, the top nut that holds it on there is a real pain to get to. I suggest a lot of patience, a regular 15mm socket and a 6" extension to get into it and steady hands. Once I got it out I could hear the guts of the starter rumbling around in the casing. I can only guess that the starter has been going bad for a while. The new one sounds completely different even though they are both AC Delcos.