Turned on my TB today and these lights are on in the dash , and the gauges are all staying down as in the pic. runs well and doesn't tap so its getting oil . The battery is older but holds a charge .and starts fast.any idea What could be wrong. No code set. View attachment 28886
dash gauges acting funny
- Thread starter lint
- Start date
Keep the troubleshooting simple if you can. Since it seems to be electrical related I would get your battery tested first.
CaptainXL said:Keep the troubleshooting simple if you can. Since it seems to be electrical related I would get your battery tested first.
What does that entail, hooking up a multimeter to the battery and checking that the voltage is in spec?
xtitan1 said:
The battery needs to be load tested at Auto zone, advance auto or other suitable shop. Its usually free. The meter they use also tests the alternator.
The gauges are run by data messages from the PCM, so if one works, they usually all work. Except for the incidents caused by aging bad design stepper motors (the items behind the plate that turn the needles). Those sometimes have to be replaced.
However, when you have erratic gauge indications, AND mysterious lights on at the same time, that proves you have some power to the dash unit, but your ground may be flaky.
Definitely check your battery voltage with a meter or by taking it to the parts store for a load test. But also check the tightness of this ground block at the bottom of the center dash stack, on the transmission hump near the passenger's left foot. You have to remove a wrap-around trim panel at the bottom of the dash in front of the console. Thanks to Blckshdw for these fresh pics.
View attachment 28888
View attachment 28889
However, when you have erratic gauge indications, AND mysterious lights on at the same time, that proves you have some power to the dash unit, but your ground may be flaky.
Definitely check your battery voltage with a meter or by taking it to the parts store for a load test. But also check the tightness of this ground block at the bottom of the center dash stack, on the transmission hump near the passenger's left foot. You have to remove a wrap-around trim panel at the bottom of the dash in front of the console. Thanks to Blckshdw for these fresh pics.
View attachment 28888
View attachment 28889
Attachments
Thank guys , headed to parts store first to check load and check the ground first,Hope its one of the easy things, If not on to the stepper. Hoping its not in the PCM .Not sure if that is possible, But PCM's in cars have left me behind
Another possibility, much more subtle, is that the data messages are sent on a shared bus that goes to all intelligent modules in the vehicle. Liftgate module, ABS, BCM, both front doors, radio, instrument cluster, SRS, Bose, aftermarket remote start or security systems, aftermarket radio head unit control harnesses, and so forth. Any one of those modules can "jabber" or send garbled data messages. Troubleshooting a shared data bus is so difficult that the designers put in two splice packs (a fruitful search phrase here and on trailvoy) so the technician can disconnect uninvolved modules to try to isolate the problem.
AtlWrk
Member
- Dec 6, 2011
- 674
There are also 2 fuses in the underhood fuse block: Fuse 24 "IPC/DIC" and Fuse 22 "IGN E" that supply the cluster. I don't know if this behavior would result from one of those blowing but it's a 30 second check.
That being said, it does look like a class2 communication problem. The cluster uses separate dedicated signals from the PCM for engine and vehicle speed so those would still work with a data bus failure (as yours are). Do other system function normally? Door locks, windows, wipers, 4wd etc? Can you scan for codes?
Edit: just read you scanned and found no codes.
That being said, it does look like a class2 communication problem. The cluster uses separate dedicated signals from the PCM for engine and vehicle speed so those would still work with a data bus failure (as yours are). Do other system function normally? Door locks, windows, wipers, 4wd etc? Can you scan for codes?
Edit: just read you scanned and found no codes.
Thanks everyone for the help,, Tried the ground on passenger side cleaned with sanded and CRC Contact Cleaner the CRC Dielectric Grease and oil. overkill I know , hooked battery back up still the same , checked all fuses , pulled and put back in , still no go , Then did all the grounds under the hood with cleaner and grease and the the two wires in the front of the fuse box ,positive and negative. after checking fuses and grounds, hooked the battery back up and back to normal , everything working , not sure if that is it , or its and intermittent problem . hopefully that was it,, Sorry I moved and sprayed all connections I could see too.
And good load test on battery , But its the original ,, 2004 I think its time for a new one , So not stranded on the side of the road .
And good load test on battery , But its the original ,, 2004 I think its time for a new one , So not stranded on the side of the road .
I spoke to soon , Back on again . I did hit the emergence brake and it went off but came back on again. Well time to do a search for'' two splice packs'' and let the fun begin .
When I turn the car on the 4 lights come on and the 4 gauges at the right stay at the position in the pics and do not move , and all at the same time ''Speed and rpm's work''Spalding1028 said:
Well it is intermittent ,On most of the time but does go off sometimes
I get all the gauges including tach and speedo quit at same time. When they do work, the display will flip between "unknown driver" and "driver 1". What I've done so far, disconnected neg battery cable and hooked up a test light between cablke and battery, Light on, disconnected two cables from PCM, when the following fuses are removed, the test light goes out; 10A HVAC B; 10A LGM/DSM; 10A DDM; 10A PDM; 15A Radio. Forgot to mention, when all these fuses are in, the battery drains overnight and will not start vehicle (Battery 3 months old)
Any ideas ?
Any ideas ?
chethro
Member
- Jun 15, 2013
- 33
I posted this in another gauge cluster thread and thought it might help here as well. Corrosion of the solder joints on the circuit board on the back of the gauge cluster is the only time I have found a problem that I could see. So far no whacky gauges...
"I've had this problem for 5 years. Unknown driver all cluster lights coming on and off and after a day the problem would go away and not appear again for months. In the past, I could jiggle the wires going to the tailgate or drivers seat and the problem would go away most of the time. Yesterday the problem was back so I decided to go after it. I checked every ground, cleaned it and put on no-ox grease. After each was checked I started the vehicle to see if the problem was still active. Next, I tore the tailgate and rear area panels apart and checked the wiring harness for rubbed wires/shorts. i installed more tape along the harness where ever possible. No problems were noticed. I even checked the rubber boot wiring that goes from the body to the gate. Next, I pulled the instrument cluster. I removed the rear cover to expose the circuit board and there were corroded solder points on various places on the circuit board. I cleaned these with alcohol and a q-tip and installed it. This time when I started the vehicle the problem was gone.
I've thought I solved this before only to be wrong, so I'm hoping this is it. Time will tell. At least I did see a problem this time."
"I've had this problem for 5 years. Unknown driver all cluster lights coming on and off and after a day the problem would go away and not appear again for months. In the past, I could jiggle the wires going to the tailgate or drivers seat and the problem would go away most of the time. Yesterday the problem was back so I decided to go after it. I checked every ground, cleaned it and put on no-ox grease. After each was checked I started the vehicle to see if the problem was still active. Next, I tore the tailgate and rear area panels apart and checked the wiring harness for rubbed wires/shorts. i installed more tape along the harness where ever possible. No problems were noticed. I even checked the rubber boot wiring that goes from the body to the gate. Next, I pulled the instrument cluster. I removed the rear cover to expose the circuit board and there were corroded solder points on various places on the circuit board. I cleaned these with alcohol and a q-tip and installed it. This time when I started the vehicle the problem was gone.
I've thought I solved this before only to be wrong, so I'm hoping this is it. Time will tell. At least I did see a problem this time."
Thanks Chethro I had problems with my tailgate and glass, had it painted and the guy put the wrong screws back in and broke the latches , so i had to fix them , now yesterday I was working on the gauges and lifted the glass to get a screwdriver ,and then shut it and in about a min. the gauges started working again ,not sure if thats it ,But going to clean first to see, I just dont want to get into this now , I dont have a garage now and along the street is a pain. If not back to trouble shooting as Roadie posted
chethro
Member
- Jun 15, 2013
- 33
It is an annoying problem. You never know if you did something to fix it or did it just go away.
Pulling the gauge cluster is fairly easy. Remove the two top Phillips screws in the gauge cluster surround. Then the two bottom panels under the steering wheel 7 mm I believe. This exposes the bottom gauge cluster screws. Remove 4 cluster screws and unhook the wiring harness. With the steering wheel at the lowest tilt position pull the cluster out. There is a black cover clipped to the cluster that needs pulled off to expose the circuit board. My board had multiple small areas of corrosion on pins and crossing circuit traces All these we're cleaned.
Good luck.
Pulling the gauge cluster is fairly easy. Remove the two top Phillips screws in the gauge cluster surround. Then the two bottom panels under the steering wheel 7 mm I believe. This exposes the bottom gauge cluster screws. Remove 4 cluster screws and unhook the wiring harness. With the steering wheel at the lowest tilt position pull the cluster out. There is a black cover clipped to the cluster that needs pulled off to expose the circuit board. My board had multiple small areas of corrosion on pins and crossing circuit traces All these we're cleaned.
Good luck.
'' That was it'' Thanks chethro, had to wait till I had time to work on it..Took some electrical contact cleaner and a toothbrush ,Cleaned all the areas that had corrosion, Then some electrical oil on the board ,and they have been working for a week, Hopefully that fixed it.. the corrosion came off ,just on the top across the pins ,not under the coating of the board. Thanks for all the help.chethro said:
ThanksYeah chethro, I was thinking Corrosion could be the problem because my air condition drain or heater core drain on the firewall was clogging up all the time and the carpet was always wet. All that moister had to go up when you turn on the heater. But never thought it could do that to the gauge cluster I thought it would be sealed better , But I have worked on gas station pumps that we had to spray them down with cleaner and coat them with oil to keep them working I guess they don't coat them like they did to keep the heat from building up. Just a guess ,Or just cheaper. and thanks again for bring it up . You saved me a lot of work.