Anybody got pointers on tearing down a 5.3 to fix a stuck lifter?

[HizAndHerz]

My 2006 9-7x has been down for 5 months due to cylinder 1 AFM lifter collapsing. I tried flushing the engine and squirting Berryman carb cleaner down the push rod, but the lifter is dead. So, I am seriously considering doing the work myself to replace all of the AFM lifters. Has anyone on the forum done this before or do does anyone have links, videos, etc. that shows details tearing down a 5.3 engine while it is in the truck? I consider myself an average shade tree mechanic. I own 6 vehicles and have performed all my own auto work for the last 25 years. I've rebuilt a couple of engines and automatic transmissions. So, I'm not an expert, but I haven't run into any repair situation I couldn't handle, knock wood.

I've put together a "possible" parts list. I may not have to replace everything below. For instance, the cam, pushrod and rocker arm may be fine. Everything comes up to around $1000.

Lifters AFM (8) (GM 12619820) $313.52
Camshaft (GM 12569525) $156.15
Oil pressure sensor (GM 12616646) $46.58
Timing chain (GM 12646386) $33.93
Camshaft sprocket (GM 12576407) $28.47
Crankshaft sprocket (GM 12556582) $21.02
Rocker arm (GM 10214664) $10.38
Push rod (GM 10238852) $14.12
Valve stem seal set (Fel-Pro SS71039) $25.00
Head gasket set (Fel-Pro HS26190PT2) $165.79
Head bolt set (Fel-Pro ES72220) $21.99
Timing Set (CLOYES C3220) $31.79
Camshaft bearing set (Clevite SH2125S) $24.79
VLOM (Valve lifter oil manifold) GM 12580901 $311.20 (already sourced NOS)
Driver side rocker cover to fix possible PCV issue

Any pointers would be greatly appreciated!

BTW, my engine sounds exactly like the 5.3 in this Sierra:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt4ZzbqtC3g

My #1 lifter is collapsed like in this video (not the same truck as the Sierra above), although there is less play in the rocker arm:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8BQ4kHA-wI

 

[jimmyjam]

are you going to keep AFM? considered ditching it? I don't know anything about AFM. do you think you really need to replace the valley cover? can you maybe just flush the passages?

the gasket set should include valve seals.

ARP head bolts are a little pricier, but you don't have to torque to yield. so you don't need the angle wrench. not a big deal when you've got it on an engine stand but when its in the engine bay getting x degrees of rotation may be an issue

pull the radiator, condenser, and ac hoses and there is plenty of room.

also, check out camaro, g8, fullsize truck etc sites for deals, plenty of people who delete AFM have parts to get rid of, for example that valley cover is available on a g8 site
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66446
its been on there for a while so you can probably lowball them

 

[HizAndHerz]

are you going to keep AFM? considered ditching it? I don't know anything about AFM. do you think you really need to replace the valley cover? can you maybe just flush the passages?

the gasket set should include valve seals.

ARP head bolts are a little pricier, but you don't have to torque to yield. so you don't need the angle wrench. not a big deal when you've got it on an engine stand but when its in the engine bay getting x degrees of rotation may be an issue

pull the radiator, condenser, and ac hoses and there is plenty of room.

also, check out camaro, g8, fullsize truck etc sites for deals, plenty of people who delete AFM have parts to get rid of, for example that valley cover is available on a g8 site
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66446
its been on there for a while so you can probably lowball them

Thanks for the pointers.

I looked the "hardware" AFM delete and got a little lost at the parts needed. The kits seem to cost $400 to $500 and they claim that another $400 camshaft is needed. So, I'd like to do it to avoid more AFM problems down the road, but I'm a little bewildered by the kits. I should contact BTR or one of the other kits suppliers to get more information before ruling it out.

BTW, I already have a brand new VLOM (valley cover) that I got in a parts swap.

Anymore pointers or teardown/assembly tutorials would be appreciated.

 

[jimmyjam]

Again I don't know a ton about AFM besides hearing about stuck lifters. I was under the impression that people would just swap lifters & trays (and pushrods maybe) with LS2 parts, as well as an LS2 valley cover, which has spots for orings that seal the afm oil passages. In the past I've seen people swap in stock ls2 cams. however I don't know how a larger cam (i assume it's larger) would affect your torque curve, and how it would feel on a stock torque converter. $400 is a custom grind, i'm sure there is something on a gm parts shelf that would fit the bill, but what, idk. Lastly you'd probably want to hook up HPTuners or the like to uncheck DOD so thats another $100 minimum. I don't know if it makes sense for you to go that route, just seems to me like one less thing to break (again).

I'm sure there are a ton of youtube videos on swapping heads, any LS engine will do, they all look alike. The hardest part will probably be removing the fan clutch from the waterpump. I forget if the alternator bracket screws into the head, you'll probably have to remove that. the ac comp can stay, you might get away with keeping the ac lines in place. personally, I'd pull as much stuff out of my way as possible.

 

[Sparky]

Early AFM systems had issues like this but they fixed it later, I wonder if you could just put in the updated parts and make it no longer an issue.

 

[HizAndHerz]

Well, I haven't made up my mind about the AFM delete kit. I'm exchanging emails with Brian Tooley Racing about their kit. What I still don't get is if I simply tune out AFM and just replace the AFM lifters with new ones, is their still more potential for the AFM parts to fail more than the non AFM parts. I believe the only differences are the lifters, the cam and the VLOM.

So, I'm heading to the garage right now to start pulling things apart. I am armed with the huge 3-volume GM shop manual and all the info I've been able to gather from the internet, such as the potential for broken head bolts. If the cam is in good shape, I'll probably just change the lifters and the VLOM and plan of disabling AFM through software, Those are my thoughts at the moment, anyway.

Thanks Jimmy and Sparky for your comments. I'd love to hear from anyone who has done this work themselves.

 

[jimmyjam]

i doubt you'd break a head bolt, they are huge. exhaust manifold bolts maybe, they are smaller.

theres not much to it, unplug the engine harness left to right, get it out of your way. disconnect the pcv hoses, brake booster hose, fuel hose from rail. unscrew the intake from the heads, take it off (no need to remove the injectors/fuel rail). then it is pretty cut and dry. take off valve covers, rockers, rocker pedestal, pushrods, exhaust manifold, head bolts, then you are in there like swim wear

 

[HizAndHerz]

The "easy" stuff is now off the engine engine. I'm down to the exhaust manifold bolts and the head bolts. Going to start there tomorrow. At least one exhaust manifold bolt is broken without me even touching it. The exhaust manifolds probably need to be checked to see if they are straight,

I took off the valley cover and can see the #1 cylinder cam intake lobe that has the stuck lifter. The surface looks okay. I'll give it a better inspection tomorrow. I've had health issues the last couple of years and I'm a bit of a lightweight when it comes to this kind of work so I have to take it slow

Hopefully I can figure out the parts I need and get them in this next week. Next weekend I'll have 4 days straight to put it back together.

 

[HizAndHerz]

No progress on father's day except for ordering parts. I found a a set of genuine GM new-in-the-box AFM lifters for $200 from someone who bought them and didn't use them. Then I ordered the gasket set, cylinder head bolts, spark plugs, and oil sender from RockAuto. Total cost in parts is around $500 including a new VLOM. That's a lot cheaper than I was anticipating. I'm just glad the cam looks good which saves a lot of cost and labor.

The right side head should be coming off tomorrow evening.

 

[Alexo1us]

Since we talking about lfters I have 1 or two in morning sound like piston slap. It goes away soon as I get revs up, then just the tick

Anyone have any luck cleaning them, hate like hell to remove heads.
one of the things left over from last owners maint plan,

 

[HizAndHerz]

Since we talking about lfters I have 1 or two in morning sound like piston slap. It goes away soon as I get revs up, then just the tick

Anyone have any luck cleaning them, hate like hell to remove heads.
one of the things left over from last owners maint plan,

Have a look at this video. It isn't clear to me if the Sierra in the video has AFM, but the lifter noise sounds very familiar.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RecrxxLT4s

My engine sounded like the one above. I tried the engine flush plus spraying the lifter down with Berryman B-12 Chemtool but it didn't help my lifter.
I hope you have better luck with yours.

 

[Alexo1us]

well second oil change seemed to help big knock in morning lifters still loud til warmed up then ticky thing going on.
worth try i guess if it doesn’t ill rip heads off or sell it if wanted to hear a oil burner id bought one...
but dam this thing is starting grow on me got lots of character.

why put holes in the head to small to remove lifters i miss my old SB

 

[HizAndHerz]

Still moving slowly on this project. Here's the final parts list (all have arrived) . All the parts were ordered from Rock Auto except the lifters and VLOM.

• ACDelco lifters (set of 8)
• VLOM (pulled from new crate motor)
• Fel-Pro head gasket set
• Fel-Pro head bolt set
• Oil pressure sender
• Spark plugs (ACDelco Platinum)
• Forward oxygen sensors
• Serpentine belt kit with idler pulley and tensioner

Total cost of the parts was about $675.

Here's the plan:

1. Remove the heads and exhaust manifolds and have a machine shop check them all for warping. Get a valve job if there would be any benefit.
2. Perform a piston soak to free up piston rings.
3. Replace forward oxygen sensors.
4. Replace oil pressure sensor (currently leaking).
5. Replace VLOM.
6. Clean cylinder block.
7. Replace all 8 AFM lifters.
8. Re-install heads.
9. Re-install exhaust manifolds.

I hope to get the heads and exhaust manifolds to the machine shop Saturday morning.

That's the plan anyway.

 

[Kelly@PCMofNC]

Good luck with your install! I thought I would chime in on a couple things in case people were looking for more info in the future.

pull the radiator, condenser, and ac hoses and there is plenty of room.

If you are just pulling the heads, I would leave the radiator and condensor (only really need to pull those if the cam is coming out).

Thanks for the pointers.

I looked the "hardware" AFM delete and got a little lost at the parts needed. The kits seem to cost $400 to $500 and they claim that another $400 camshaft is needed. So, I'd like to do it to avoid more AFM problems down the road, but I'm a little bewildered by the kits. I should contact BTR or one of the other kits suppliers to get more information before ruling it out.

Yes that's right. By the time you add up lifters, trays, valley cover, etc they end up around $400 (ours is $399). You would need a different cam if you delete AFM as well, as the lobes are slightly different. If you delete AFM and leave the stock cam you will be left with misfires on 1,4,6,7.

Again I don't know a ton about AFM besides hearing about stuck lifters. I was under the impression that people would just swap lifters & trays (and pushrods maybe) with LS2 parts, as well as an LS2 valley cover, which has spots for orings that seal the afm oil passages. In the past I've seen people swap in stock ls2 cams. however I don't know how a larger cam (i assume it's larger) would affect your torque curve, and how it would feel on a stock torque converter. $400 is a custom grind, i'm sure there is something on a gm parts shelf that would fit the bill, but what, idk. Lastly you'd probably want to hook up HPTuners or the like to uncheck DOD so thats another $100 minimum. I don't know if it makes sense for you to go that route, just seems to me like one less thing to break (again).

I'm sure there are a ton of youtube videos on swapping heads, any LS engine will do, they all look alike. The hardest part will probably be removing the fan clutch from the waterpump. I forget if the alternator bracket screws into the head, you'll probably have to remove that. the ac comp can stay, you might get away with keeping the ac lines in place. personally, I'd pull as much stuff out of my way as possible.

You could put an LS2 cam in without having to worry about changing the tune, or the converter. Stock LS1, 6, 2, etc cams are very, very mild and won't cause any driveability issues.

Well, I haven't made up my mind about the AFM delete kit. I'm exchanging emails with Brian Tooley Racing about their kit. What I still don't get is if I simply tune out AFM and just replace the AFM lifters with new ones, is their still more potential for the AFM parts to fail more than the non AFM parts. I believe the only differences are the lifters, the cam and the VLOM.

So, I'm heading to the garage right now to start pulling things apart. I am armed with the huge 3-volume GM shop manual and all the info I've been able to gather from the internet, such as the potential for broken head bolts. If the cam is in good shape, I'll probably just change the lifters and the VLOM and plan of disabling AFM through software, Those are my thoughts at the moment, anyway.

Thanks Jimmy and Sparky for your comments. I'd love to hear from anyone who has done this work themselves.

Yes, so long as the AFM lifters are in there, whether the ECM is engaging it or not, there will be a bigger chance of failure than with a non-AFM lifter like an LS7.

We do a lot of AFM/DOD deletes here at the shop during cam installs, let me know if you have any other questions.

 

[sarg]

Kelly on an 06 Denali is that a 3 bolt old style cam still or the newer style?

 

[HizAndHerz]

Kelly, thanks for popping in with all of that useful information.

I finally got the heads off and got a look at the lifter. Here's what a good AFM lifter and the collapsed lifter look like. No surprise.

[sharedmedia=gallery:images:392]

I was hoping that I would not have to pull the camshaft out based on what I can see of the lobe. But the roller on the collapsed lifter is not nice and shiny like the other lifters. That probably means the cam looks the same. My guess is that a less-than-perfect surface on the cam lobe is unacceptable.

[sharedmedia=gallery:images:393]

So, it's off to the machine shop in the morning with the heads for inspection and possible rebuild. I'm taking the bad lifter with me in hopes they can advise me about replacing the cam.

Man, I do not want to remove the cam. The service manual says that the condenser has to be removed and I do not want to discharge the AC. What a pain in the neck that would be.

 

[HizAndHerz]

I finally got the heads to a new machine shop close to me. The machinist says to inspecting the cam lobe while in the engine should be enough to tell whether it is damaged or not. He said that running a good cam with a bad lifter would be much worse than running a worn cam with a new lifter. I now have access to an awesome magnifying camera probe to have a really close look at the cam lobe.

The only other parts the machinist suggested were new lifter trays (aka camshaft follower guides) because they tend to get brittle and crack allowing the lifter to rotate and trash the cam.

I am starting to feel like I just may get my Saab back on the road again.

 

[C-ya]

Good luck! Keep us posted and post pics!!

 

[HizAndHerz]

I got the heads back from the machine shop. There's nothing like the shine of rebuilt heads. I ended up with all new pushrods because three of them showed signs of wear. I have to buy three rockers from the dealer because the sockets are worn. Total shop cost was $210 which I thought was excellent.

Cleaning the block took several hours with brake cleaner, razor blades, and plastic scrapers.

The reassembly process starts this coming weekend.

 

[RayGumm]

How was the cam lobe?

 

[HizAndHerz]

How was the cam lobe?

I never got the magnifying probe down to look at the cam. Eye balling it down the lifter bore it looked ok. obviously not as perfect and shiny as the other lobes, but not pitted or hammered.

BUT... The good news is that I finally got the engine back together and ... It sounds great! I'll post a little more about the experience tomorrow.