Transmission Fluid Leak

[{tpc}]

To go along with my other thread, this one seemed to deserve its own. So I have a leak that produces about a drop or so a day. I thought it to be fairly small, however, the pics make it look worse. A guy at work think its the front input shaft seal, I think that is what he called it. But he also thinks that maybe some "seal sweller" added to it might help. We did find one pan bolt in the front that was a little loose, but I haven't actually put a torque wrench on all of them yet.

I don't want to mess it up, but I am afraid of the costs of fixing it, as I am sure its way above my own ability (mainly because I just don't have the time to dedicate to it). Anyways, here are the pics, any thoughts on it are greatly appreciated.

Edit: Guy at work said he used this stuff called LubeGuard. Said it can't hurt to add it and try it. Sadly I am at a loss on what to do.

View attachment 33887

View attachment 33888

View attachment 33889

View attachment 33890

 

[AtlWrk]

You need to determine if it's coming from inside the bellhousing area (input seal) or outside (pan seal). Clean off the entire area with a through soaking of brake cleaner (including inside the bell housing) and check back in a day or two. Also make sure your pan bolts are torqued to specification--they're not as tight as you might think and over-doing it can warp the flange and cause leaks.

If it does turn out to be the input seal then personally I would just live with it. Keep a close eye on your fluid level and signs that it's worsening. If it's coming from the pan flange then you might have already bent it (or just been the loose bolt you found). I would be hesitant to add anything not recommended by GM to the trans fluid. Sometimes they work, sometimes they make things much worse. The trans isn't something I'd gamble with over a manageable leak.

 

[{tpc}]

You need to determine if it's coming from inside the bellhousing area (input seal) or outside (pan seal). Clean off the entire area with a through soaking of brake cleaner (including inside the bell housing) and check back in a day or two. Also make sure your pan bolts are torqued to specification--they're not as tight as you might think and over-doing it can warp the flange and cause leaks.

If it does turn out to be the input seal then personally I would just live with it. Keep a close eye on your fluid level and signs that it's worsening. If it's coming from the pan flange then you might have already bent it (or just been the loose bolt you found). I would be hesitant to add anything not recommended by GM to the trans fluid. Sometimes they work, sometimes they make things much worse. The trans isn't something I'd gamble with over a manageable leak.

I've been searching for the torque spec but I can't seem to find it anywhere. I've seen 97 inch lbs, 120 inch lbs, 10-12 ft lbs. Which is the correct value?

 

[{tpc}]

Well I went with torqueing the bolts to 97 in lbs, which in the case of the loose one, it was way way loose. I also torqued the rest down as well. Cleaned everything off as well as I could with brakleen on a rag, and added some fluid. So when I get home I will check levels again and add what is necessary if any and go from there.

I doubt if I am lucky enough that it is just a pan gasket. For as loose as the one bolt was, and the fact there was more fluid in that area, I hold out hope. At this point, its probably the best I can do. I just don't see the dealer or a shop saying "oh its just this little thing over here, we we replace and torque it down" and send me on my way for cheap. Its a rare occasion I am lucky enough for that.

 

[Texan]

I agree with what AtlWrk said and would live with it for the time being. It has been a long time
since I have had this type of problem, and it could be a front seal. One temporary solution for
me was a piece of cardboard on the garage floor. Hopefully, the tighten pan bolts will fix it.

 

[{tpc}]

Thanks for the help everyone. Going to put it back on the lift at lunch to look for leaks again, and to try and wipe off whatever I might have not got yesterday. Hopefully its better, only time will tell at this point.

 

[strat81]

I use Lubegard Red in my 4L60 along with Maxlife ATF. The esters in Lubegard may help recondition/restore/"fix" the seals in your transmission, or they may not. However, I have noticed improved shifting with Lubegard. I started using it on the recommendation of a friend who rebuilds transmissions for a living. He uses it in his own vehicles as well as customers' vehicles.

Another option is this, but I have not used it personally on a transmission:
Amazon.com: ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle: Automotive

Amazon also sells Lubegard Red. Lubegard makes a few different transmission additives. Assuming you are using DexIII or DexVI, the Red product is what you want.

 

[{tpc}]

Ok, so I ended up doing a couple more things. One, I added some lubeguard red. Two, I had to add some more fluid after I got home last night. I may have gone just a touch high, but after a proper check its at the top of the hot mark, maybe a hair over. Not a big deal, as I'm going to lose some when I add the cooler this weekend.

So far on the second inspection I found some more fluid. I am unsure if this is residual fluid from before, or there is still a small leak. It wasn't nearly close to as bad as before though. I checked the large port on the housing, no fluid on the inside, but some collected on its outer edge. The little port had some on the inside as well as around it but its possible (crossing fingers lol) that because of its proximity to where the majority of the fluid was (near the one really loose pan bolt), that it is residual. I took a clean white cloth, rolled it up and snaked it up as far upwards as I could in the small port and fished it around. I didn't get any fluid or dirt or anything on it when I pulled it back out.

The large black plug in the front still had fluid on it though less. I didn't spend as much time cleaning it yesterday as it could, so it might have been leftover. I would have pulled it out, but I am unsure of how exactly it comes in and out, and was afraid I couldn't get it back in without a bunch more work. Otherwise it would have been spotless.

So I cleaned yet again with the brakleen and towels inside the two ports, around the entire pan, pan bolts, everywhere. All the way around the black plug in the front and in all its little nooks and crannys. I spent a lot more time on it today, trying to get every little bit of fluid I could. I had a co-worker come by and ask me if I had painted the pan or if it was new, it was so clean looking lol.

So back to the waiting game. It continues to run fine, probably even better now that the fluid isn't low. Pretty much all a waiting game now.

Thank you all for the help and guidance on this, I do appreciate it.

 

[nodogs027]

My '03 TB leaked a whole bunch of tranny fluid once and I took it into the shop. They wanted $500 to take it apart & look it over then whatever they want to fix it or more $$ to put it back together. Long story short, I took it back home and found out a ground wire on the chassis had come off and triggered something. After reconnecting the wire & filling fluid, the problem was fixed.

 

[IllogicTC]

Oil Pan-To-Case Bolts: 124 inch-lbs. From the 01-03 4L60E book. There's two sections of torque specs, the ft-lb section has varying numbers but literally EVERYTHING that takes an in-lb spec is 124. At least that's easy to remember

 

[{tpc}]

Oil Pan-To-Case Bolts: 124 inch-lbs. From the 01-03 4L60E book. There's two sections of torque specs, the ft-lb section has varying numbers but literally EVERYTHING that takes an in-lb spec is 124. At least that's easy to remember

So your saying they are too loose still?

I'm going to leave it for now and see how it goes. Every one of them was loose, but one of them, even after just torquing it a little without a torque was only at 24 inch lbs when I started with the wrench. They all felt significantly tighter at the 97 in lb mark. In reality, 124 in lbs isn't much more, only 2 ft lbs, but I rather not bend the flange or snap a bolt off. I've made it this far without creating a major problem for myself and I feel good about that, no need to press my luck.

 

[glfredrick]

I use Lubegard Red in my 4L60 along with Maxlife ATF. The esters in Lubegard may help recondition/restore/"fix" the seals in your transmission, or they may not. However, I have noticed improved shifting with Lubegard. I started using it on the recommendation of a friend who rebuilds transmissions for a living. He uses it in his own vehicles as well as customers' vehicles.

Another option is this, but I have not used it personally on a transmission:
Amazon.com: ATP AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle: Automotive

Amazon also sells Lubegard Red. Lubegard makes a few different transmission additives. Assuming you are using DexIII or DexVI, the Red product is what you want.

Lubegard is the only transmission product that I would recommend. All the others tend to swell and SOFTEN the seals so much that they end up going away rather quickly. Yes, they may be an instant fix while one is on the road traveling or something, with the EXPECTATION that a transmission rebuild awaits upon arrival at home, but they are not good for daily use.

The leak you show is most likely the front seal and there is no way to re-torque it as it is a static seal where the torque converter enters the front pump. It CAN be changed without re-building the entire transmission (still have to pull the transmission and remove and replace the torque converter) but it often is not worth the hassle and it is easier to just check and add fluid once in a while and live with the drip. The reason I do not think it is the pan seal is that oil coming off a leaky pan seal often blows to the rear of the transmission, not forward into that area as the most wind while the vehicle is moving is in a rearward direction.

Rock Auto shows that seal for under $3.00. It will take an entire day to pull the transmission and re-install.

TIMKEN Part # 3227 {Click Info Link for Alternate/OEM Part Numbers24202535, 8628054, 8630921, 8648394, 8654491} Trailblazer Base Model; 4 speed trans.; Trans. code 4L60-E

$2.66