Reset camshaft crankshaft thingy? I think....

[gmcman]

gmcman- Where can I find the additive? And what tests can we perform to test the fuel system? Fuel filter looks to be in great shape but I know looks can be deceiving.

Have you changed it since you have owned it? Outside tells nothing about the inside. If not......

I would put a fuel filter in tomorrow. To change the fuel filter, you need to remove the screw, probably a phillips head, on the strap holding the filter. Pull the fuel pump relay fuse #41 and crank the engine and it may start then stall, then crank it again for about 4-5 sec to purge the fuel pressure. There is a schrader valve under a black cap that you need to depress to drain the fuel out if the line. You can pull the lines by using a pair of needle-nose pliers and lightly squeeze the two tabs on each line and pull them from the filter.

TIP: When you start to pull the line out, pull it part way on both then move yourself out of the way and then pull the lines to avoid spillage on yourself.

To reinstall the filter, just push the lines on until the plastic tab pops into place. There are two sizes of lines so it only goes on one way.

BG44K can be had at some service stations and most dealerships. I would change the filter first.

 

[Voymom]

For the fuel filter, does it have to be a delco one or can I get parts store brand?

No, I have not changed it under the assumption that it wasn't the issue...no more assumptions for this little lady.

Oreilly's has a microgard brand for $16.99 where the Delco one is $40.00

 

[gmcman]

Then it's anyones guess how long it has been in there. I use either Purolator or AC, doesn't really matter but the price difference is not that much.

Absolutely change it ASAP. You definately need to address the filter as it's a regular maintenance item, I aim for yearly or 15K miles.

Just one more thing to remove from the equation.

 

[Voymom]

Then it's anyones guess how long it has been in there. I use either Purolator or AC, doesn't really matter but the price difference is not that much.

Absolutely change it ASAP. You definately need to address the filter as it's a regular maintenance item, I aim for yearly or 15K miles.

Just one more thing to remove from the equation.

I think I will go with the parts store filter for now, at this point in time any brand filter that is new will be better than whats in it now. Once I hit the 10k-15k mile mark or a year later I will put a delco in it. Right now with Christmas around the corner I need to pinch pennies.

Thanks again for all the help!

 

[Wooluf1952]

Edit- I am sitting here doing a bit of reading on the fuel system...I found this "If your fuel pump makes unusual noises when you turn the key on". I know this is probably a stupid question, but I'm still new at this. How exactly is the fuel pump supposed to sound? I do hear a noise(hard to explain) when I turn the key on but not completely start the truck.

Do you have the air suspension? When you first start the truck the compressor kicks in as a test. The fuel pump sounds like the compressor, but not nearly that loud. More of a low hum.

 

[CaptainXL]

i aim for yearly or 15K miles.

Just one more thing to remove from the equation.

IMHO that's way overkill. I'm guessing the factory one is still on her truck and its lasted this long. Every 50k is plenty fine between changes. We all know gmcman is pretty anal about maintenance. I am too coming from the military... but not this much

 

[WarGawd]

.... This time it's sunny out, partially warm (Low 50's) and no moisture in the air at all.

Ok, before I read the rest, I just GOTTA:

Spoiler

Sounds like excuses about weather being too cool for pics are gone! heheheh

Ok, now I've read it, I guess we can let you off the hook because you have bigger issues...

We are running 5w 30 Mobile 1 full synthetic to be exact. Just did our oil change early last month when the OLM told me to do it. I have noticed that the OLM is showing that the quality or percentage of the oil is dropping much faster than it did with it's first oil change. It's at about 60% already. We have never used any other oil in the truck, except cheap dino I believe same weight to do the flush when Mat put the engine restore in, and the problems existed before we did the oil change IIRC. I actually think that the whole stalling and stuttering started after Mat put the engine restore in, but he seems to think it started doing that before hand and that's why he used the snake oil additive to begin with.

I'm honestly at my wits end with this issue, how would you feel a proper diagnostic be done? Because I know of no other way.

60% on the OLM already seems a bit odd, I don't get the impression you put anywhere near the miles on yours as I do mine. I changed my oil a while back (Quaker State full syn, changed Sep 17th), and at the point where it hit 3100 miles (5000km) my OLM was showing 67% - I seem to on pace for right around 9300 miles (15k km). How many miles have you put on since the change? Has the level dropped any in that time?

Yep. When you stop spinning the noisey part, the noise stops. Then, you are checking one at a time , alternator, water pump , fan clutch, power steering and idlers. If the noise is still there with the belt off then it is something else. If the pulley you had off is noisey, change it. It will only get worse if you don't. You could swap similar parts from the other vehicle for cheap testing.

Voymom's mention of a noisy pulley that Mat already had off the block once is almost surely the idler (simple single bolt removal) but from the videos the noise seems more prominent to me on the passenger side, ie the tensioner (alt, pwr steering and A/C would not likely be the pulleys he removed before). From description and from hearing the metallic noise, and knowing your water pump was previously done, and knowing some of the history now, it may be BOTH the idler and tensioner pulley. Easy removal after verifying noise goes away with belt off, if they make any noise when you spin them by hand, they're done, but even if they just feel a little grindy without noise, just change it because it's pretty cheap replacement too.

Something else from the OS is ringing in the back of my head in regards to a connection between A/C cycling and idle speed, but I'll have to go and look for it...later on that.

Lastly, do you have any steering issues like maybe a short (<1s) chatter/vibe feedback in the steering wheel when making turns?

Let us know what happens when you get the belt off again, belt tension may be keeping you from noticing play in one or more pulleys...

 

[gmcman]

IMHO that's way overkill. I'm guessing the factory one is still on her truck and its lasted this long. Every 50k is plenty fine between changes. We all know gmcman is pretty anal about maintenance. I am too coming from the military... but not this much

Yeah it really is overkill, I agree. I think I was going every 2 years and about 25K but I guess just seeing what this fuel does in the small engine float bowls I figured what the heck, and they are quick to change out. I just wait to find one cheap and pick up a couple.

 

[Voymom]

Do you have the air suspension? When you first start the truck the compressor kicks in as a test. The fuel pump sounds like the compressor, but not nearly that loud. More of a low hum.

Nope no air suspension. But I do know what they sound like as my Buick had it. That's what it sounds like. Even though it appears to sound normal I will still get it checked out. I know there is something going on now with the fuel system so I'm going to focus on that. Once I wake up fully and have my coffee I'm going to head over to Oreilly's and pick up a filter and see if they either rent out or sell the fuel pressure gauge. I can most likely change out the filter this afternoon/evening. But the fuel pressure test will have to wait until tomorrow most likely.

Yeah it really is overkill, I agree. I think I was going every 2 years and about 25K but I guess just seeing what this fuel does in the small engine float bowls I figured what the heck, and they are quick to change out. I just wait to find one cheap and pick up a couple.

lol okay....I will erase the over kill in the maintenance app I just got to keep up on these things for now on. With the cheap filter i'm going with, should I change that one out at like 20k or 30k miles? Or do you guys think it can make it the whole 50k? Is there anything else I need to check and look at on the truck that is considered regular maintenance? I think I'm at 123600 right now or close to it. I may just change the fuel filter out once a year, I won't put that many miles on the truck in a year. I put about 7k miles on it in 10 months.

 

[bravad'oh]

Many people never touch their fuel filters until there is a real problem. Newer vehicles don't even come with one you can change. It should be fine left 1 to 2 years as long as you are getting clean fuel and nothing leaks into your tank. When you remove it, try keep as much fuel the old filter as possible. Then shake the contents out into a paper coffee cup and you will see some of the dirt that the filter caught. There isn't usually very much to look at, but if there is alot of dirt or some water then you know you have done something helpful.

 

[Voymom]

Okay so I was looking at FPR's at oreilly's and im confused. One says ignition fpr for $233.00 and the other is just fpr for $84.00. The expensive one is gold and the cheaper one is black. Both fit the truck both are different brands. Which one would I get? The ignition one or the one that just says fpr? I havent checked rockauto yet but thats next. No fuel filter today, im sicker than a dog and we have church. Tomorrow will likely be when we do it.

This is confusing.....on rockauto for the fpr why would I need to show proof of an a/c flush for the warranty?

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=1111438&cc=1415269

 

[CaptainXL]

Okay so I was looking at FPR's at oreilly's and im confused. One says ignition fpr for $233.00 and the other is just fpr for $84.00. The expensive one is gold and the cheaper one is black. Both fit the truck both are different brands. Which one would I get? The ignition one or the one that just says fpr? I havent checked rockauto yet but thats next. No fuel filter today, im sicker than a dog and we have church. Tomorrow will likely be when we do it.

This is confusing.....on rockauto for the fpr why would I need to show proof of an a/c flush for the warranty?

More Information for DELPHI FP10299

Just get the Delphi fpr at advance auto. $85 before using visa or retailmenot123 code. Should save you about $15 dollars.

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...25986682-p?searchTerm=fuel+pressure+regulator

 

[Voymom]

Just get the Delphi fpr at advance auto. $85 before using visa or retailmenot123 code. Should save you about $15 dollars.

Buy Delphi Fuel Press Regulator FP10299 at Advance Auto Parts

Okay, i'll just do that then lol

Forgot to ask, but does the fuel tank need to be dropped? And is there a write up or video how to? Its not in my manual.

 

[CaptainXL]

Okay, i'll just do that then lol

Forgot to ask, but does the fuel tank need to be dropped? And is there a write up or video how to? Its not in my manual.

Nope, its under the hood. Havent seen any writeups probably because there are no parts in the way except resonator. But I strongly recommend Before working on anything on your car you should get a Chiltons manual #28880. On page 4-12 there are clear instructions how to removeand replace. Not trying to be a pest but it really seems like your hoping this gets fixed from the couch using jedi force tricks or something. Only jedis arent going in blind. Lol. Just tryingto help.

 

[Voymom]

Nope, its under the hood. Havent seen any writeups probably because there are no parts in the way except resonator. But I strongly recommend Before working on anything on your car you should get a Chiltons manual #28880. On page 4-12 there are clear instructions how to removeand replace. Not trying to be a pest but it really seems like your hoping this gets fixed from the couch using jedi force tricks or something. Only jedis arent going in blind. Lol. Just tryingto help.

Well apparently we have a chiltons manual which I didnt know about lol I bought a different one when we got the truck which was the one I was using. Thats the thing though, before I try to tackle something I know nothing about I try to read as much as I can so im not just flying by the seat of my pants lol. The truck is driven very minimally from thursday through sunday so its okay for it to sit for a day. Church is first on my list then cold medicine lol. We live in a tiny town so its only driven 6 miles total 4 days out of the week. I will be picking up supplies and parts tomorrow morning before my grocery run.

 

[Voymom]

Well we got the fuel filter an air filter as ours was dirty and got the fuel pressure gauge. Going to go get the additive at the dealership afterwards. And apparently there is no gas smell in the oil per Mat. But I may have someone else sniff it to make sure lol

Edit- The first attempt to do the fuel pressure test was unsuccessful as the tester was broken. Oreilly's can't get another one in until tomorrow.

Picture of the fuel that came out of the old fuel filter

View attachment 23970

View attachment 23971


Edit again- Found the valve needed to do the fuel pressure test...fuel pressure checked normal at 57 PSI. I'm now beginning to think injectors...and pulling my hair out.

Another video showing the drop in RPM's and towards the end of the video you can hear the drop from the engine bay. No change in symptoms, and as I stated the fuel pressure test was a pass at 57.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zR9XVz25lLw&feature=youtu.be

 

[CaptainXL]

I wouldnt be making any jump to conclusions just yet. Getting at the injectors is a lot of work and probably in your case left to a shop. So dont even contemplate it just yet.

A few observations about your tests.

1. Did you test the pump pressure with the key on and engine off?

2. When the pressure got up to 57 psi did you hold it for 5 minutes and see if the pressure drop? This is important to see if any injectors are stuck open.

3. You said the air filter was dirty? How dirty?

There is no reason to get worried about anything at this point. All the stuff your doing is just basic maintennance and should have been done at some point in the past. Just keep pressing forward doing all this stuff. We arent going to tell you to do anything thats not unusual for the vehicle considering the mileage you have.

If the the fuel pressure is holding. I would get a vacuum gauge on the truck and see if it holds steady at about 18 in hg. This will tell you for the most part if the engine is in good mechanical repair or not. Keep up the good work!

 

[Voymom]

I wouldnt be making any jump to conclusions just yet. Getting at the injectors is a lot of work and probably in your case left to a shop. So dont even contemplate it just yet.

A few observations about your tests.

1. Did you test the pump pressure with the key on and engine off?

2. When the pressure got up to 57 psi did you hold it for 5 minutes and see if the pressure drop? This is important to see if any injectors are stuck open.

3. You said the air filter was dirty? How dirty?

There is no reason to get worried about anything at this point. All the stuff your doing is just basic maintennance and should have been done at some point in the past. Just keep pressing forward doing all this stuff. We arent going to tell you to do anything thats not unusual for the vehicle considering the mileage you have.

If the the fuel pressure is holding. I would get a vacuum gauge on the truck and see if it holds steady at about 18 in hg. This will tell you for the most part if the engine is in good mechanical repair or not. Keep up the good work!

1. Yes

2. Yes

3. I can show you as I'm not sure what is considered really dirty.

We followed all the instructions in our chilton manual. As of right now, we are nursing a gashed forehead and a headache.

I wouldn't be interested in changing any injectors without trying the BG 44k first. Mat has done injectors before, he knows how much of a pain in the ass it is to do them, and is trying his best to NOT have to replace them lol. We will hook up a vacuum gauge if we can find one, and figure out how to do that. Then tomorrow we will test the FPR...as of now my honey's head hurts

Air filter

View attachment 23972

Edit- If this is the correct hose to test fpr then we tested it. There was no change at all, and it was bone dry inside. If its the wrong hose, we will try again lol. What would have been the symptoms of it unhooked if it were bad?

View attachment 23974

I'm starting to wonder if my running rich problem may be a failed sensor some where? 02 sensor? Map sensor? I'm just pulling at strings here.

 

[Voymom]

I wanted to mention, as I just noticed it. But when the sputtering/stalling issue happens ALL my lights in the truck dim including my headlights. The only lights that don't dim are on my radar detector which is plugged into the accessory port, and the part of the radio that shows the time, station etc...I was able to catch a video of it too. I never seen this before because I don't drive it at night, and Mat put the new end links on and had me take it for a spin, and that's when I noticed the lights dim when the truck sputters. We had the alt checked today and it was fine, and we also had the battery checked and that was okay too. The only electrical mods we have done are the quad beam, HID's and DRL kill. Plus the wiring harness for my HAM radio.

I'm uploading the video to youtube, but because my PC is a POS it will take it a while to load.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tX8_1sDu-I&feature=youtu.be

 

[Hypnotoad]

Back to the original post, did he perform a CASE relearn?

My truck does the same thing you describe with everything dimming, but mine isn't as bad and has never shut off on me. Best of luck to you and I hope you figure it out.

I think mine might have something to do with when the truck tests the secondary air injection system. Mine is throwing me a code though for the past year, unlike yours.

 

[Voymom]

Back to the original post, did he perform a CASE relearn?

My truck does the same thing you describe with everything dimming, but mine isn't as bad and has never shut off on me. Best of luck to you and I hope you figure it out.

I think mine might have something to do with when the truck tests the secondary air injection system. Mine is throwing me a code though for the past year, unlike yours.

Nope not a case relearn....

 

[Denali n DOO]

I wanted to mention, as I just noticed it. But when the sputtering/stalling issue happens ALL my lights in the truck dim including my headlights. The only lights that don't dim are on my radar detector which is plugged into the accessory port, and the part of the radio that shows the time, station etc...I was able to catch a video of it too. I never seen this before because I don't drive it at night, and Mat put the new end links on and had me take it for a spin, and that's when I noticed the lights dim when the truck sputters. We had the alt checked today and it was fine, and we also had the battery checked and that was okay too. The only electrical mods we have done are the quad beam, HID's and DRL kill. Plus the wiring harness for my HAM radio.

I'm uploading the video to youtube, but because my PC is a POS it will take it a while to load.

VID 20121116 171652 - YouTube

12.1 MPG? That doesn't seem very good at all, I get better than that with an oil burning V8 pulling a trailer at -20c at 140km/h. Has your MPG gone down with this issue?

 

[gmcman]

The lights are likely dimming from the drop in RPM, haven't seen the video yet so not certain. Your electrical system is solely powered by the alternator when the engine is running and the battery is backup if you lose the alt.

Air filter looks good for now.

If you can hook a live data scanner to the voy then observe the two O2 sensors. They will fluctuate about every second when cold and the #2 sensor will tend to follow the first one about a half second after the #1 and be close to the value given.....ie .7, .4, .1, .8, .5, .2 and so on. Granted this is rounded off but is displayed to 3 decimal places.

When the cat gets hot the #2 sensor will not vary as much and will keep a much narrower range while #1 keeps fluctuating. When it's real hot you should see #1 changing about every second over almost a 1V range and #2 will prob stay between .500-.700 but that's not a set number, just an example.


I will try to get a vid on this to show you.

Not something you need to do at the moment, just throwing ideas and projects out for you.

If you see the #2 sensor jumping all over when hot then either the cat is bad or the sensor is bad.

 

[Phantom]

12.1 MPG? That doesn't seem very good at all, I get better than that with an oil burning V8 pulling a trailer at -20c at 140km/h. Has your MPG gone down with this issue?

I reset the avg mpg on the way home from the parts store, one of the three that i made. and i will admit i wasn't feathering the gas lol. that and the parts store is less than a mile down the road. so it is pretty much all throttle and no cruise. there is only one little strip that you do 45 and the dic was reading 24-25 mpg. the next fill up i will do a mpg calculation.

 

[jrSS]

That's awesome. I get 14.5 mpg's on avg. 16 hiway.
;whispering; "I love the skinny pedal."

 

[Voymom]

The lights are likely dimming from the drop in RPM, haven't seen the video yet so not certain. Your electrical system is solely powered by the alternator when the engine is running and the battery is backup if you lose the alt.

Air filter looks good for now.

If you can hook a live data scanner to the voy then observe the two O2 sensors. They will fluctuate about every second when cold and the #2 sensor will tend to follow the first one about a half second after the #1 and be close to the value given.....ie .7, .4, .1, .8, .5, .2 and so on. Granted this is rounded off but is displayed to 3 decimal places.

When the cat gets hot the #2 sensor will not vary as much and will keep a much narrower range while #1 keeps fluctuating. When it's real hot you should see #1 changing about every second over almost a 1V range and #2 will prob stay between .500-.700 but that's not a set number, just an example.


I will try to get a vid on this to show you.

Not something you need to do at the moment, just throwing ideas and projects out for you.

If you see the #2 sensor jumping all over when hot then either the cat is bad or the sensor is bad.

Those are A LOT of numbers lol I don't do numbers But luckily my husband does so I can leave this all to him. As far as the air filter, the picture I posted was the old one and we already replaced it this morning, so that's nice and clean. I think Mat and I need to do a compression/combustion test to make sure it's not the rings or a valve. I know it's not a piston because I'd hear it. I want to do more testing and less fixing right now lol. I don't want to keep throwing money at it left and right hoping whatever we do to it fixes our issue. Tests are free lol I can handle free.

So I think I need a list of tests that I can perform and what tools/gauges I will need for the tests. I'm not ruling anything in or anything out just yet....I'm still new at this so whenever I notice something related to the issue I try to relay it back to provide more information. As far as running lean or rich, I guess I am assuming that we are, without any hard core evidence. Mat can fill it up and hand calculate it this time.

I know that the truck isn't lacking power...in fact it has more power or so it seems since we changed the spark plugs. If it's not electrical, I really think it is an air/fuel issue...but their can be 10 different reasons as to why the air/fuel ratio's are off. I don't (knock on wood) think it's anything thats going to cause my engine to take a shit on me anytime soon, and if it does....I'll throw a crate motor in it

Oh...and that noise I was hearing...it's gone down quite a bit after Mat pulled one of the pulley's off and put it back on lol. We'll replace that soon too. I'm more worried about the bigger issue at hand.

 

[gmcman]

Do you have a vacuum tester? If not, add this to the list for tomorrow.

Vacuum tester Autozone

Vacuum tester Walmart

Vacuum connectors

I would also get a foot of hose of 1/8", 1/4", 5/32" Inside diameter

These are almost a necessity and are fairly cheap. When you test vacuum you are not only testing the amount of vacuum, but if the needle fluctuates or not. Steady needle shows the valves are seating properly and a fluctuating needle can indicate a valve not fully closing, among other things.

So many variables to look at but always good to start with the basics and go from there.

Does it always stall when in gear?

Does it always stumble when you step on the gas?

Could the ignition switch cause these symptoms, mainly stalling?

What about the accel pedal or would this throw a code?


Why is it stalling? Loss of fuel, Loss of air, loss of spark, loss of compression, torque converter locking up.

Compression could be from a valve hanging open but I would suspect a hard stumble then it would vibrate.

Loss of air.....not sure how.

Loss of fuel or way too much. Injectors obviously don't show leakage or at least all the time.

Time to pull both the battery terminals, (Neg first)

Check all your ground connections, and even the positive terminals. Check the strap going to the transmission, I believe it has one. Take some sandpaper and clean both sides of the terminals you pull and the metal it contacts.

Anywhere you see a black wire attached to the metal around the engine bay, remove it and clean it.

Spark could be from a crank sensor, perhaps not having the CASE relearn....dunno. I don't know where the sensor is but I would find it and spray some electronics cleaner on the terminals.....allow to dry, dries fairly quickly.

I would pull the coil leads and clean all the terminals with the spray.

I would pull the TB harness and clean the terminals.



This is alot to do, trying to help diagnose this blindly this is exactly what I would do if it were mine, would cover alot of bases. Most of this you don't need to do, but I would do it anyway.

After pulling all my hair out trying to figure out why a TB would not readapt on our previous jetta, I have alot more respect for clean terminals.

Dealer couldn't find it, kept telling me I needed a new TB but I kindly declined. I pulled the battery and cleaned all the grounds under the battery tray (4). tried another TB, no dice. A buddy of mine used to be a VW tech and attached a small 16 ga wire from the ground terminal to the chassis totaling 5 now and it worked. Those electronics were extremely sensitive to current flow and voltage.

Edited to add: When you step on the gas, it takes alot more current (spark) to light the mixture, even more under higher loads. Could be an electrical issue and the coils aren't getting all the current they need, just a guess.

Fuel economy is dismal so could be the injectors.

Don't forget the 44K.

 

[Voymom]

Does it always stall when in gear?

No, it has only stalled on me 6 times, mainly when backing out of the driveway. I will tap the gas lightly to get a bit of umph as I back out. Then I will put it in drive and slowly go. It has only stalled on me 3 times when actually in gear. The other 3 were in park and I was hitting the gas a bit to warm up the truck.

Does it always stumble when you step on the gas?

No, once the truck warm and reaches 1000 RPM's all symptoms go away completely...if I stop at the drive thru at burger king, keep the truck in gear and hold the brakes, if the RPM's drop to normal 500-600 RPM you will hear and see the slight surge.

Could the ignition switch cause these symptoms, mainly stalling?

Possibly, but I have no other "quirky" issues that usually arise with the ignition switch, but won't rule it out.

What about the accel pedal or would this throw a code?

Don't know....

Compression could be from a valve hanging open but I would suspect a hard stumble then it would vibrate.

Can you elaborate? When the stuttering happens I do feel the truck shaking when the RPM's drop. "First RPM's drop..then truck shakes" but could be just from loss of power as well.

Fuel economy is dismal so could be the injectors.

Fuel economy is unknown as far as a hardcore answer. We plan on hand calculating it at next fill up as the DIC is not always reliable.

Don't forget the 44K.

We won't...it's a dealer only thing here. I will be taking a trip to see them on Monday to pick some up!

It's definitely a lot to do...but we will do it! We appreciate all the help we are getting here! Thank you all very much!

It all seems to be at low RPM's only. Once the tach reaches 1000 RPM's it's perfectly fine. I can stop at a red light, and take off without any of the symptoms being present. I could drive in stop and go traffic all day long and none of the symptoms would show up. Even with the burger king drive thru example, with the surging...but can pull up to the next window with no issues. But if we park the truck, turn it off....go inside the store for 20 minutes, and start the truck up...the symptoms rear their ugly faces.

 

[CaptainXL]

Fuel economy is unknown as far as a hardcore answer. We plan on hand calculating it at next fill up as the DIC is not always reliable.

What brand and octane fuel do you normally use?

Do you usually go to the same station or chain?

We won't...it's a dealer only thing here. I will be taking a trip to see them on Monday to pick some up!

In the mean time what you could do is pickup some mineral spirits and naptha from a hardware store and dump that in your tank. They are two of the main ingredients found in BG 44K and Techron Concentrate. About a half quart of each should be fine. You won't get the added benefit of the PolyetherAmine (PEA) to remove deposits from valves and combustion chambers but it will be better than nothing and you should notice at least something.

PEA can also be found in Techron Concentrate and Gumout Regane just to name a few. Both available from Walmart. However I am pretty much sold on the BG 44K because it is purported to have the highest level of PEA available. They also have a second key ingredient that further reduces combustion chamber deposits by an additional 18%.

 

[gmcman]

PEA can also be found in Techron Concentrate and Gumout Regane just to name a few. Both available from Walmart.

This is true, and because of the price difference over the 44K maybe try some Techron first. I was just able to get a great price on the 44k which is why I generally use it but I do hear many good things about Techron.

 

[Voymom]

What brand and octane fuel do you normally use?

We have always used the BP gas station, I think we have used Casey's a few times but that was when we were limping it on the gas(almost empty). We were using 89 for a while, probably half the time we have owned the truck, so 5 months now. But Mat switched it back to 87 because it's supposed to be lower in Ethanol. But IIRC reading the literature on the gas tanks at the station, all the octane's use the same 10% Ethanol. I could be mistaken though as it has been a while since I read it.

Do you usually go to the same station or chain?

Yes...We like to use BP here in town. As far as brand they use I have no Idea. We have used casey's a handful of times, and I have used Z's here in town as well, but not so much as their kind of buttholes and expensive lol.



In the mean time what you could do is pickup some mineral spirits and naptha from a hardware store and dump that in your tank. They are two of the main ingredients found in BG 44K and Techron Concentrate. About a half quart of each should be fine. You won't get the added benefit of the PolyetherAmine (PEA) to remove deposits from valves and combustion chambers but it will be better than nothing and you should notice at least something.

PEA can also be found in Techron Concentrate and Gumout Regane just to name a few. Both available from Walmart. However I am pretty much sold on the BG 44K because it is purported to have the highest level of PEA available. They also have a second key ingredient that further reduces combustion chamber deposits by an additional 18%.[/QUOTE]

I'm going to call the dealership just to see if parts and service happens to be open today. If someone actually gets off their ass and answers the phone, then maybe I can see if they carry it. If not...I may have to revert to using the Techron.

Well after calling ALL the dealerships and getting the ring around with them (will explain later) I finally found someone in town that has the 44k for $20. I'm heading out the door now to pick me up a can!!

 

[Voymom]

So I got the 44K, finally! The stupid dealerships here won't sell it to you without you sticking your vehicle in their service garage for an injector cleaning/flush. Something I wasn't going to do. So Mat found a seller that was actually closer to us and I picked it up there for $20.

Now, I did get a VERY long video of my entire drive home. It basically shows that I can drive through town, hit 4 way stops and red lights, along with a few idiots who ride their brakes, and not have a single issue...even if the RPM's drop below 1000 while sitting at a 4 way, when I go to take off....no sputter no drop in RPM's.

I drove regularly through town to show this, and then the other part of town which is just a straight shot without lights or stop signs, I dropped the truck down to 25 MPH and put it on cruise control hoping to get the RPM's under 1000 but of course it stayed right at 1000RPM. But regardless I stuck it on cruise control and drove it like that to show that my needle on the tach does not move at all. It is dead cold at 1100 RPM and no surging, no sputtering and no threats of stalling. But if I were to pull over on the side of the road and put it in park, hit the gas...the RPM's will drop, it will sputter and threaten to stall out.

I'm completely mystified at these symptoms and I'm just trying to narrow down specifics to see if it helps diagnose the issue. I won't post the video unless you all want to see it, because it is a long(about 8 minutes) video. Anyways....hope this helps!

Thanks again everyone!!

 

[Voymom]

Update- Well Mat and I have been outside for the last 2-3 hours looking and checking all our wires and grounds. I had him pull the coil packs to check the spark plugs, and we found that #4 is slightly wet with oil. We also noticed the back of the engine where the valve cover connects was wet, so we went to tighten the bolts and they were fairly loose. So we tightened what we could. The oil seemed to be coming from where the black part meets the block...hard to explain, but the oil does not appear to be coming from under the spark plug. The coil pack wasn't wet, it has some old spots on it which are dry, but it isn't recently wet. Mind you any oil around #4 isn't a significant amount...maybe a drop or 2. But around the edges of the black area(valve cover?) and the block is a bit wet.

Here are some pictures I took. Sorry if they are crappy pictures.....it's a tight fit with a huge ass phone lol.

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Pulled plug #4 and it's completely dry

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[CaptainXL]

Use shell or mobile stations for a few tanks. Gas is much better. BP is not a top tier station. Stay away from infrequently visited stations. Could have water or sediment in tanks. Mobile 1 stations next to the highway would be a good bet.

Above all don't use 89 or 93 octane. Especially from an infrequently visited station. Your just asking for carbon buildup issues. 87 is the proper octane.

 

[Voymom]

Use shell or mobile stations for a few trips. Gas is much better. BP is not a top tier station.,

We don't have any of those any where close to town. We would likely have to drive between 30-60 minutes to find a shell or Mobile, we don't even have a mobile station here. We have 5 choices in our town...BP, Z's but not sure what they use as we don't use their gas(heard about water in the fuel from them) Casey's, again not sure what they use, UB which is pure ethanol and we won't go there for gas, and Walmart gas station.

BP here is the busiest gas station in town, again as I said in order to reach a shell gas station, we would have to travel quite a bit, and it wouldn't be worth it as we would need to put at least a half tank of gas in the truck when we got back into town. I live in the middle of no where....literally lol

 

[CaptainXL]

So I'm betting the gas is at least part of the problem.

The Walmart gas would probably be best cause its popular.

 

[Voymom]

So I'm betting the gas is at least part of the problem.

The Walmart gas would probably be best cause its popular.

Z's is Conoco-Phillips, just drove past them and seen it. Walmart is actually least popular here, along with Casey's. BP is always busy and the most popular in town.

 

[CaptainXL]

Z's is Conoco-Phillips, just drove past them and seen it. Walmart is actually least popular here, along with Casey's. BP is always busy and the most popular in town.

Conoco and Phillips is one of the best brands and is top tier. Very high quality stuff. Phillips is used a lot for aviation blends like 100 low lead and jet b.

They may have found water in their tanks but only because Phillips is really strict about any amount.

 

[gmcman]

The plug wells don't look too bad, oil is likely from the O-rings or donuts around the plug wells...not really an "O" shape.

Are the plugs still out, if so now would be a great time for a compression test. Just something to do when you change the plugs to note any possible cause for concern. Not really associated with your current problem but you never know, if the plugs are back in don't sweat it.

 

[Voymom]

The plug wells don't look too bad, oil is likely from the O-rings or donuts around the plug wells...not really an "O" shape.

Are the plugs still out, if so now would be a great time for a compression test. Just something to do when you change the plugs to note any possible cause for concern. Not really associated with your current problem but you never know, if the plugs are back in don't sweat it.

Plugs went back in soon after. No noticeable difference in the truck since tightening the bolts down.

I'm not panicking yet lol, would just be nice to know what the problem is, I don't know if it will cause further damage the longer it stays like this. I could leave it and ignore it, but I would rather not.

Mat was wondering if maybe the TB is getting stuck closed? Maybe need to get a new one to replace the Throttle body position sensor? I don't have any highway surging though. I did notice however...when the A/C or heat is on the needle moves around quite a bit, and I think that's what is causing the surging. But not what's causing the engine to bog down like it does. Who knows...