Your thoughts on DIY A/C repairs

[MAY03LT]

As our Trailblazers/Envoys and their cousins are getting older, we're seeing a lot more A/C threads pop up. I have a feeling that this trend will only get bigger as time goes on.

I've made a few posts about the CONTROL side of A/C diagnostics, but not the CHARGE side. I'm hesitant to post anything that involves charging the A/C systems for several reasons:

1) Most DIYers don't have A/C gauges. The cans with a built in gauge that you can find in every auto parts store aren't reliable, and don't tell you the whole picture as to what's going on with an A/C system. When I read posts that state "the gauge is in the yellow", I don't know what that means. Is it 60psi or 160psi? Outside of an A/C machine, an A/C manifold gauge set is the correct way to read the A/C head pressures and is crucial for DIY A/C diagnosis and repairs.

2) R134A can hurt you. Maybe your cousin told you about the time that he got it in his face and he wasn't phased, but the reality is that stuff is dangerous. And your cousin is stupid for suggesting that it's not a big deal. It is. Ask me why I wear welding gloves when I charge A/C systems at home. Yeah.

3) Auto parts stores push r134a cans with stop leak. Some manufacturers list the "stop leak" in super small print and sometimes on the back of the can. Stop leak does more harm then good. If you've ever cut up a condenser from a modern vehicle, you know the passages are as small a decimal. This can lead to poor A/C performance as the passages clog up. And that's just the condenser. The evaporator has them too. At my work, I have to test for stop leak. If a vehicle is found to have stop leak, my work won't touch it.

4) More tools. For my at home "DIY" setup, I also have a tool to inject UV dye into an A/C system, an A/C sniffer, a vacuum pump, and other odds and ends necessities and there are still some things that I can't do, the biggest being recycle/weigh evacuated r134a.

I'm a DIY advocate, but this is a gray area for me. Especially when scumbags like my work charge $139.95 just to hook up gauges and stick a thermometer in the dash. Yeah, no diagnosis. That costs more. That $139.95 can buy a set of gauges that can last you years.

So, I'm interested in hearing fellow members thoughts about DIY A/C repairs related to charging A/C systems. Good idea? Bad idea? Leave it to the pros? Throw it out there. Also no A/C questions, we're in the SUV/Truck chat section. Thanks!

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

I like they DIY. Worked great in my Eclipse. I have a leak in my truck and plan to DIY or actually get Regulator to help since he has gauges once I fix it.

 

[tbyoda]

I like the idea.

 

[jimmyjam]

well, refrigerant recovery is an issue... unless ninjas secretly break in to your garage and loosen your condenser lines while no one is looking. its been known to happen. also, no one rents vacuum pumps anymore... the used to. why don't they anymore? is it to deter people from illegally dumping r134a? or other reasons? I have no idea.

I've got a set of harbor freight gauges and a vacuum pump, as I do a lot of DIY AC repair, and I've installed probably 10 ductless split units last year. It's not rocket surgery. Mounting the unit out of the reach of drug addicts is the hardest part. I've been meaning to get an EPA cert primarily because HVAC supply houses won't even sell you a thermostat without one, which is ridiculous. why do i need an epa cert to buy a condenser fan motor??? [/rant]

Anyway, I guess as long as you make sure to note that people comply with local, state, and federal laws regarding refrigerant recovery, then DIY r134a is legal. plenty of writeups out there, its not like a gmt360 is a magical unicorn, all you really need to know is oil type/amount and #s of refrigerant to charge.

 

[IllogicTC]

I appreciate the open information. Information wants to be free and all that!

Personally, though, I'd leave mine to a pro. I just don't trust myself with something that one slip could mean violating the law, but others may have more confidence in this than myself.

 

[Ghoster]

For me it depends on what is being done. If you are considering charging the system at home, I think it is a bad idea. These systems are sealed. SEALED. So if it is suddenly low then where the hell did the refrigerant go? You need a lot of tools to figure this out properly. This said, I think sometimes you can do some of the work. I replaced all the A/C components on my old Chevy truck. All the refrigerant had leaked out and the 10 year old compressor had locked up. Ebay had a kit that included all the parts needed to replace everything in the system. It was fairly simple and straight forward. I did the wrenching, then took the truck to a local mechanic who did the proper tests and charged the sytem for me. Worked great for the five years or so until I sold the truck.

 

[BlazingTrails]

I don't think that A/C repair is really any more difficult than any other repairs, and it is something that will cost you BIG at the shop. if you take the time to learn everything that needs to be done and why, you too can be an a/c pro.

Personally I have a manifold gauge set, vaccuum pump, (from Harbor freight) and a freon recovery unit i picked up at a pawn shop several years ago. just learn the procedures, it's not difficult just very important to be thorough. If you don't want to spend the money on the tools then have it done at the shop.

I figured I could buy the tools for the same price as having it done at the shop, so if i ever need to do it again cost would be minimal, or i could help my friends.

-Brandon

 

[MAY03LT]

well, refrigerant recovery is an issue... unless ninjas secretly break in to your garage and loosen your condenser lines while no one is looking. its been known to happen. also, no one rents vacuum pumps anymore... the used to. why don't they anymore? is it to deter people from illegally dumping r134a? or other reasons? I have no idea.

I've got a set of harbor freight gauges and a vacuum pump, as I do a lot of DIY AC repair, and I've installed probably 10 ductless split units last year. It's not rocket surgery. Mounting the unit out of the reach of drug addicts is the hardest part. I've been meaning to get an EPA cert primarily because HVAC supply houses won't even sell you a thermostat without one, which is ridiculous. why do i need an epa cert to buy a condenser fan motor??? [/rant]

Anyway, I guess as long as you make sure to note that people comply with local, state, and federal laws regarding refrigerant recovery, then DIY r134a is legal. plenty of writeups out there, its not like a gmt360 is a magical unicorn, all you really need to know is oil type/amount and #s of refrigerant to charge.

Well said. A few years back they were pushing to ban the sale of r134a here unless you were certified. $15 and an open book test later - yeah whoopty doo. Thanks for the input boss!

For me it depends on what is being done. If you are considering charging the system at home, I think it is a bad idea. These systems are sealed. SEALED. So if it is suddenly low then where the hell did the refrigerant go? You need a lot of tools to figure this out properly. This said, I think sometimes you can do some of the work. I replaced all the A/C components on my old Chevy truck. All the refrigerant had leaked out and the 10 year old compressor had locked up. Ebay had a kit that included all the parts needed to replace everything in the system. It was fairly simple and straight forward. I did the wrenching, then took the truck to a local mechanic who did the proper tests and charged the sytem for me. Worked great for the five years or so until I sold the truck.

Exactly. There is a difference between "it's not blowing as cold as last year" type of diag/repair and a "I had to replace the condenser because a branch went through it" type of repair. Or bullets. I had two of those last summer at work. Sussex County gangsters yo.

I don't think that A/C repair is really any more difficult than any other repairs, and it is something that will cost you BIG at the shop. if you take the time to learn everything that needs to be done and why, you too can be an a/c pro.

Personally I have a manifold gauge set, vaccuum pump, (from Harbor freight) and a freon recovery unit i picked up at a pawn shop several years ago. just learn the procedures, it's not difficult just very important to be thorough. If you don't want to spend the money on the tools then have it done at the shop.

I figured I could buy the tools for the same price as having it done at the shop, so if i ever need to do it again cost would be minimal, or i could help my friends.

-Brandon

Nice! You got it right - there's no magic or mystery to it. And like you said, the price of the tools in some cases can pay for themselves compared to one visit to a shop. And you keep the tools.

Here's an example of a common A/C rip off - Toyota Siennas with A/C inop. Hook gauges up - mandatory $139.95. Smack the MAG CLUTCH relay with a small hammer. A/C works. Replace relay. A touch over 3 bills. Unreal.

Thanks for the replies and votes so far. I'll be honest, sometimes I forget what it's like to be a noob when it comes to A/C work. Does anyone with little to no A/C experience want to chime in? You can PM me if you want and I'll post your thoughts as anonymous.

 

[Mounce]

Here's some complete, never messed with an AC system, noob input.

I think that it's a good idea and if you understand the system and have the tools and know-how to do the job, diy all day. If you don't have the knowledge or don't have tools or just simply don't feel safe doing it, then take it to a pro or school yourself then diy.

 

[jsomething]

Ill chime in too. Ive never had reason to work on an ac system myself. However i work in a field that allows me to work with refrigeration techs alot in supermarkets. So i know how dangerous it can be. Ive also personally had refrigerant poisoning before due to a leak in a compressor room (not too bad just had to chill for a day or so, could have been alot worse). But i wouldnt hesitate to attempt a fix on my own. Infact the ac in my truck atm doesnt work and ive already been looking into fixing it myself.
Figure as long as you do the proper research you minimize the risk. And tbh people who dont do the proper research are just as likly to injure themself by opening a hot radiator or dropping a transfer case on theyr chest.
Theres also something to be said for "any excuse to buy more tools"

 

[DocBrown]

I have fixed my own AC in the past, and as long as the tools and refrigerent are available, I will again if need be. As already stated, this isn't rocket science. However this is certainly isn't on the low end of the 1-5 scale of DIY. This is right up there with pulling down your valve body and putting in your own shift kit. You best be very comfortable with complicated systems.

 

[Mooseman]

I've done my own repairs but did a LOT of research before going into it. I have a set of gauges and bought a 30Lbs can of R134 years ago. I would buy another except it's no longer affordable so I just buy the small cans for now. I even made my own vacuum by using an old window A/C compressor and bought a leak detector from HF. Just need to have the right info before going into it and know when to go to a pro. I replaced my evaporator two summers ago and it hasn't lost refrigerant since. One mistake I did was not replacing my orifice tube when I blocked off the rear system. It works but not quite as good as it should. As for evacuating the system instead of venting, some shops do it for free since they are getting some free refrigerant and expect that you would be coming back to refill, charging you full price to give you back what was yours to begin with.

BTW, in Canada, I can't buy R134a without a license. Only thing available are the substitutes, which I trust as much as politicians. I buy R134a when I cross over the border. Funny though that our border services don't check for that.

Here's an idea, how about an HVAC section of the forum since we do get a lot of questions just on that.