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Waterpump Replacement - 2004 I6 Trailblazer LT - Plus Transmission Cooler at Same Time

Discussion in 'Vortec 4.2L I-6' started by webdawg, Dec 6, 2016.

  1. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    So I have some decent links showing some info about replacing the waterpump in the trailblazer.

    http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?t=71429
    http://gmtnation.com/forums/threads/replacing-water-pump.3851/

    I wanted to do it this weekend but after looking at the service manual it looks like I need Torque To Yield bolts?

    The only info I can find online about a part number for them is here: http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?t=77998

    Can someone help me in locating the proper part number for the TTY bolts for the water pump AND pully?
     
  2. HARDTRAILZ

    HARDTRAILZ Moderator

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    Honestly I just reused everything about 4 years ago and still am good to go.
     
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  3. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    I am sorry HARDTRAILZ I hear you but I really do not want to go off of that information. I really do value your input and I will not disregard it. I mean, I get that you did that, and everything is great but I was reading this:

    http://sandyblogs.com/techlink/?p=791

    I know that it does not mention the 4.2, but I am wondering if they changed the procedure later on for the 4.2?

    I am also seeing a few posts like this: http://forums.trailvoy.com/archive/index.php/t-77998.html

    Where people put the pump on and then the seal/bolts fail.

    Actually the service manual actually has BOTH procedures. One w/ TTY bolts and one without. I have attached the service procedures and it does say use torque to yield in one of them.

    The dealer is listing the bolts as this:

    *5x for Waterpump
    **pn: 11505032

    *4x for pully
    **pn: 24576757

    On that old trailvoy post it does say that 11505032 IS torque to yield. I found a picture of 11505032 and it is attached too. I cannot find a picture of 24576757.

    What do you guys think on this?
     

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  4. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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  5. Sparky

    Sparky Moderator

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    TTY on a water pump seems awful weird to me, I would never have guessed that.
     
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  6. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    I hear you. I know a mechanic w/ one of those expensive shop manuals and they see nothing about TTY bolts in their procedures for this model. Just the standard 89 inch pounds torque.
     
  7. Mooseman

    Mooseman Moderator

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    I also reused them, no issues. I just looked up the instructions for 2002 I6 in GM-SI, which is the holy grail for GM Techs, and it mentions nothing about replacing the bolts or if they are TTY.

    As far as the bolts loosening, just put some blue Loctite on the threads.
     
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  8. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    Can you please check for 2004? I know it is basically the same...but.
     
  9. Blckshdw

    Blckshdw Moderator

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    When we changed the water pump on another member's Envoy this past summer, we also reused all of the same bolts. No issues with them failing, or any leaks. :twocents:
     
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  10. Mooseman

    Mooseman Moderator

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    Yep, they're the exact same. Also checked for 2006, ditto.

    Also checked AllData, same for 2004.
     
  11. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    Allright man. Sorry to keep asking, I just really wanted to know. I have a really long trip to do a week after I do this and I really did not want to mess this up.
     
  12. Mooseman

    Mooseman Moderator

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    No worries. We all want to do it right :thumbsup:
     
  13. xavierny25

    xavierny25 Platinum Supporter

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    I'm another +1 for reusing the same bolts. As a matter of fact my pulley been running fine with only 2 bolts since I busted 2 removing the fan clutch (long story there). Im waiting for the day to get all four and now that I have a part # is a great time. Lol. Or I can wait till my fan blade shoot threw the hood which would be ever so funny.:rotfl:
     
  14. djthumper

    djthumper Administrator

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    Admin Post
    I have had to replace my pump twice and reused the bolts with no issues.
     
  15. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    I ordered the bolts just in case before I made this post because I need to get this done, this weekend.

    About $80 for 9 bolts. They want $35 to 'restock'.

    Anyone need any bolts?.....if I do not mess up the ones I have now while taking them out, these bolts are useless to me.
     
  16. xavierny25

    xavierny25 Platinum Supporter

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    I'd want them but $80 for bolts no thank you. I'll keep my $80 in my $550 Louis Vuitton wallet.:biggrin:
     
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  17. hockeyman

    hockeyman Silver Supporter

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    As with the consensus here, I think you've wasted the money on buying them, but it's your pocket. I too have used the same bolts when replacing my water pump and (knock on wood) have not had any issues.

    I can see if you wanted new TTY bolts for the internals of an engine, but not for a water pump. Seems a bit of overkill to me. Again, it's your money though.
     
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  18. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    No I agree I wasted the money. I bought the bolts BEFORE this post and they want $35 to restock.
     
  19. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    I am taking this vehicle for a Firestone coolant flush after I do this work, any reason I should not just fill the system back up w/ water and let them handle the coolant?
     
  20. Nexus1155

    Nexus1155 Well-Known Member

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    Hey. Listen to Hardtrailz. They are not TTY, but you will have a bitch of a time getting the fan off. Goodntight always does the trick.

    You should drain the system before you do it from the lower rad hose as its going to gush out of the waterpump for the most part. Grab a bottle of 50/50 dexcool. Maybe 2? Don't get a shite waterpump either. Your coolant should be pretty well refreshed after water pump install. Never green coolant either and make sure you burp it properly.

    NEVER fill the system with water unless its in a pinch and its somewhere perfect temperature outside. It could boil or freeze too easily and overheat and blow stuff off very quickly or freeze and youll have some MAJOR problems...
     
  21. hockeyman

    hockeyman Silver Supporter

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    If you're anywhere in the deep-south, I would put at least some antifreeze in it for the fact that you may need to drive it up in a colder climate at some point.

    When I flushed/filled mine back in February of this year, I went with about 25% antifreeze and 75% distilled water since I do not have to worry too much of a hardcore freeze here in SWFL.
     
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  22. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    You guys do not understand. I only want to fill it back up w/ water because the next morning I am taking it to firestone for a complete flush and refill.
     
  23. Mooseman

    Mooseman Moderator

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    Depends on where you are (your profile just says Anywhere USA). If you are anywhere that goes below freezing, I wouldn't do it.

    Another idea would be to refill it with the old coolant if it's not too skanky.
     
  24. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    Refill w/ old is smart! Will do that.
     
  25. hockeyman

    hockeyman Silver Supporter

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    As long as it's not sitting overnight in a cold climate where it has a change to freeze, then filling with "distilled water" shouldn't be an issue -until it gets a flush/fill the next day. I would not re-use any coolant that's already been flushed out, unless it's within the mileage of an oil change from being new.
     
  26. Mooseman

    Mooseman Moderator

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    It's just for a day. It's not like he's putting in old oil. And he getting a flush regardless.
     
  27. 07TrailyLS

    07TrailyLS Well-Known Member

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    @Mooseman is that a website or a manual?
     
  28. Blckshdw

    Blckshdw Moderator

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    It's a torrent download, of a windows 98 virtual machine, that runs an older version of GM service information software. If you're not familiar with torrents or virtual machines, it will likely be more trouble than it's worth to you.
     
  29. 07TrailyLS

    07TrailyLS Well-Known Member

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    The Pirate Bay is my friend. I don't know what a VM is though. At least I don't think I do lol
     
  30. Mooseman

    Mooseman Moderator

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    VM=Virtual Machine. And it's actually an XP virtual machine.
     
  31. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    IT IS DONE!!!!

    Kind of a pain. I usually wind up to a job like this w/ little jobs before because I get back into maintenance mode. This time it was a budget issue, once the budjet (which I blew past w/ the support fluids and some little parts) was available, I purchased the parts. Starting this job on Saturday I had not done any major auto-work in a few months at least so it was hard to get back into the swing of things.

    Taking everything apart was not bad. I had purchased the fan clutch removal tool off of eBay but I had also purchased the PCM of NC, Inc. fan clutch tool. I initially used the fan clutch tool to try and remove with no luck. I was using manual pulling and push w/ arms and I bent the wrench and holder tool. The tools were really easy to bend, both the holder w/ the pins and the wrench itself. I did not even put much pressure on it. I am kind of disappointed w/ the tool.

    After fixing the tool, I tried again w/ the same set, while someone else held the holder tool I taped on the wrench w/ a hammer. The person could not hold the holder tool solid enough and the pins were bending so on to the other solution.

    I then attached my eBay tool and the breaker bar and zip tied it to the AC bracket above the alternator. About 10 taps of a hammer and the nut was loose.

    After that everything went as planned. It was kind of difficult to get the fan shroud out around the upper radiator hose spout (but when putting it back in, it was very easily put in? I must have been pulling it out at a bad angle). The only other difference I would like to note is that the new water pump came w/ a metal gasket instead of a paper it looks like w/ the old one. After calling a garage owner I was told that no RTV/sealent was to be put on the new metal gasket and the mount surface on the engine had to be entirely clean of old material and any oil/coolant residue. If there was any pitting (which their was not) on the aluminum surface, I could 'fill' the holes and scrape off any excess.

    I made sure that the internal passage was free of anything also, that is I soaked up anything that was inside the engine so no coolant would come out when working w/ the mount surface. I spent about 45 mins w/ a toothbrush cut into a chisel, a plastic scraper, heavy duty paper towls, and brake clean getting the surface perfectly clean and free of old gasket. I was also told to put a very small amount of GM Grey sealant on the bolts also, which I did and torqued the bolts down in a crisscross pattern.

    I now replaced the fan clutch on the fan that was out of the car already.

    After I got the pump in I decided to start on the PCM of NC, Inc. transmission cooler. Overall I am impressed w/ the parts used in the cooler. I did opt for the rubber push lock lines to save some cash. I was initially hesitant to put any faith in the rubber push lock system but after messing up and having to remove a line from a push lock fitting (hint, it is impossible, I had to very carefully cut down the side of the fitting until I cut the thread and use vice grips to remove the excess rubber) I know they will work. The adapters and kit are all as advertised. The quick connect fittings are very nice, and everything torqued and went together very well.

    The only disappointment I have w/ the cooler are the instructions. I have never installed a cooler before and seeing that the kit was 'designed' for my vehicle I was looking for specifics in the instructions. They mention about rerouting the hood latch cable, and that I should have looked at the final assembly picture for where it goes, but I could not see it in the picture at all.

    They also do not offer any information about routing the new rubber cooling lines. I really needed this, it took me a few hours of messing around thinking about where the lines should go. At first I had them routed around the side of the radiator to the front of the condenser but it would bend one of the lines a bit too much when it had to curve around to go down and then up to the cooler on the front of the condenser.

    I wanted to run it under the radiator and I ended up taking the front bumper cover off, and looking under the power steering cooler. Under the power steering cooler there is a black plastic baffle that directs air into the power steering cooler. It extends all the way back to the bottom of the condenser. I wanted to run the lines under the radiator and between the condenser and the power steering cooler. If I cut the back edge off of the plastic baffle it would allow me to do that. I initially tried to take the baffle off, but it is clipped into the inside of the bumper.

    I just pulled on the baffle until I could get to the middle of it and cut a line w/ a dremel (careful not to touch the power steering cooler, etc) tool across the front of the car and then towards the back of the car until I had cut a small rectangle out and now could route the lines as previously mentioned.

    I now had a massive excess of line length (as I had it already installed w/ the lines routed around the drivers side of the radiator) but instead of trimming it was very easy to push the lines inside of the hollow metal bumper. I figured that it would be best to be able to pull the cooler out and have some slack if I needed to do something w/ it later. Also no hard bends of the rubber lines right now and nothing that would resemble a kink.

    Ohh yeh. My assistant accidentally stepped on the fan shroud, so the night before (my only break from this, this weekend) I used industrial epoxy and JB Weld to heal the cracks. I was hoping that it would not be a problem getting the shroud and fan back in around the top of the radiator and it was not. It slipped right in and I was surprised. I do not even remember having to move it around to get it past the top of the radiator spout.

    I used the PCM of NC, Inc. and a torque wrench to torque the fan clutch bolt to 41 ft lbs. I did my initial torque, and then went to do it one more time and the metal wrench bent again. I did not really care too much about the torque here as the direction the fan spins would tighten the bolt. The metal the PCM of NC, Inc. wrench is made out of just bends for some reason. I just wanted to try the tool and next time I think I will look for a big torque extender solid steel open wrench type, or I will just use a normal wrench.

    I also ended up having to replace the coolant reservoir. I was taking it out to clean it all the way (see my previous posts for when I broke my old internal radiator transmission cooler, filled up the cooling system w/ tranny fluid, and then later on caught the car on fire) and it was dry rotted. It looks like someone spilt some type of acid on it at some point because the rot was not uniform and more of a spill pattern.

    I was surprised that O'reilly auto parts carries the reservoir (alas not the fan shroud) and the new one was a welcome replacement.

    During all of this I managed to brake a fog light light bulb ($$$ get two new so they look the same $$$), the slide clip that holds the passenger side of the bumper on (thanks industrial super glue), the black front grill/headlight support in two places (more super glue), the fan shroud (not entirely my fault, it should have been somewhere better though, and thanks industrial epoxy and JB weld), one transmission quick connect clip (they have these at the auto parts store), and a few metal clips on the back of the grill.

    When i first took the vehicle for a drive I thought it may be leaking tranny fluid as there was some on the frame below the radiator, but instead I figured it was from the excess that pooled in the frame support under the radiator. I took it to the car wash and cleaned under the radiator and no more drips.

    Everything is running great. Thanks for all the help.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2016
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  32. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    xavierny25, do you want some of the old bolts?
     
  33. triz

    triz Well-Known Member

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    Air hammer is the way to go when you pull the fan clutch off.
     
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  34. webdawg

    webdawg Well-Known Member

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    I was having issues with the image uploader so I posted images of my use of the ebay tool here in case anyone is interested: http://imgur.com/a/LRhtC
     
  35. Blckshdw

    Blckshdw Moderator

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    You can right-click on the web hosted images, and copy link address. Then place the URL between image tags, to have an in-line image in your post. :twocents:

    Code:
    example: [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/8q21Qyx.jpg[/IMG]
    
     

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