Replacing air springs with coil springs, and add a bit of lift.

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
Hello,

So the air spring suspension on my 2003 Voy is leaking. If left for more than about 3 days, it starts dropping, and within a week it's down on the axle. The compressor has no trouble filling it back up though. It also seems to droop towards the passenger side, I measured once, I think it was about an inch lower at the wheel well on the passenger side, front and rear.

I've been planning to replace the air springs with coils, and since I use my voy to go fishing a lot on old potholed logging roads, and take it out on the river bank (I scraped the oil drain plug once last year on a rock), I thought it would be a good opportunity to add some lift as well. I also use it to tow a 1965 airstream at 3300lbs, and about 300lbs tongue weight. The air springs have been nice for that, so I need springs that can handle the load. In 2010 when I first got this truck I replaced the shocks and struts with Sensa-Tracs at 120,000kms. It currently has 165,000kms (100,000 miles) on it. Feels crappy to be swapping them out after only 45,000km. In the summer I am running Firestone Transforce AT LT245/70/R17 tires. Winter I use stock size tires with studs.

I've done a fair bit of reading, so I understand I can use Z71 springs from a 2007+ Avalanche or Tahoe. I'm not as clear if I can use standard shocks then, like the Bilsteins, or if I have to go with something else like Skyjackers or BDS in the rear. I'd also like to get a bit of lift in the front, so upgrade to the XL springs, and maybe add a 2.5" lift from Liftmeister.

Looking on Rockauto and places I found some variable rate springs from Raybestos that look good. Has anyone tried them? I'm curious if the HD Raybestos springs would be as stiff as the GM Z71 springs? Comparing them to the Raybestos springs for the Envoy XL, they have an additional load capacity of 330lbs, and a spring rate of 229 vs 210 for the XL springs, as well as slightly longer free height. Below is the setup I was thinking of going with.

Rear - Raybestos HD springs for Avalanche
Front - Raybestos springs for Envoy XL

Bilstein shocks all around.

Potentially add the 2.5" lift from LiftMeister.

I may go in stages, replace the air springs with coils and new shocks and see how it looks. If needed add new springs, shocks, and lift to the front.

Does this seem like a reasonable set-up? Or would you recommend going with the true Z71 springs, different rear shocks, the 88 or 87 springs in the front (haven't found the full part numbers for those yet)?
 

djthumper

Administrator
Nov 20, 2011
14,956
North Las Vegas

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
Those are great. Thank you.

I'll keep doing some more reading, and searching sources. I am in Northern BC, Canada. So sometimes getting parts up here can be a bit costly.

The reason I was looking into the Raybestos springs from Rockauto is that they will ship to here for a somewhat reasonable cost.
 

djthumper

Administrator
Nov 20, 2011
14,956
North Las Vegas
Honestly if you are not having any issues with your front springs don't replace them, just put the spacers onto them and roll with it. For the rear I would probably go with the Raybestos and see how they run. Don't forget you could always put bags inside of the springs if they don't handle the weight well. Personally I haven't had an issue with the Z71s hauling a 5K trailer.
 

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
I agree with you. I don't want to get too carried away yet. Just looking to get a bit more clearance above the rocks.

With the Raybestos HD springs for an Avalanche, will the Bilstein shocks designed for the Envoy with coils be long enough then? Or will the extra height require some other shock for the rear?
 

The_Roadie

Lifetime VIP Donor
Member
Nov 19, 2011
9,957
Portland, OR
Longer shocks will help articulation in the back to get the maximum extension. Not mandatory, but useful. Discussed in the ORTB thread referenced in post #2.
 

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
After reading through the Complete Lift and Suspension Accessories thread, I think I am now leaning towards the BDS kit that comes with the shocks. There is a Canadian supplier for it. All I need to figure out is what springs to get, and where to get them. I might check out some local parts stores and see what they can do for avalanche springs.

Thanks for the help guys. When I get around to this project, I'll post some pictures.
 

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
Went to the local NAPA shop. Their HD springs for the Avalanche have the exact same specs as the Raybestos springs (maybe they are the same?). The parts guy couldn't confirm if they were variable rate or constant rate, the Raybestos ones say they are variable.

I think I'll go with the NAPA springs so I won't have to wait for the shipping from the US. After shipping from Rockauto, the price is the same as at NAPA.

I can see where this is going. Avalanche springs, so need longer shocks. Order BDS kit to get the shocks and 2" lift. Might as well replace the Monroe Reflex struts with Bilstein HD while I'm doing it, right? So then might as well upgrade to XL or #88 springs up front! $$$$$$

I was trying to stay tame, LOL.

How can I tell if the front springs are sagging at all? take measurements of the springs on the struts? I know my truck is about 1" lower at the wheel wells on the passenger side, both front and back.
 

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
These measurements are on my stock Envoy, with the air springs, no load in the back. Checked all tire pressures first and let it run a bit to make sure the bags were properly inflated.

Wheel well measurements:
FL - 32 1/2" FR - 31 3/4"
RL - 34 1/8" RR - 33 3/8"

Spring lengths on the front struts (top coil to bottom of coil, measured from the front of the vehicle):
FL - 10 7/8" FR - 10 3/8"

I checked my RPO codes and compared them to the list from ORTB for the front springs, but I can't find a code that matches my Envoy. The codes I have are 6SP 62U 7SN.

On the plus side, it appears I have a G80! Didn't know that before. (GT4, G67, G80) I knew I had the 3.73 gears from the factory window sticker.
 

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
Rear springs are in the mail from RockAuto.

In the end, I decided on Raybestos Envoy XL springs. Higher load rating and spring rate than the SWB springs, but not as stiff as Avalanche springs. If I need additional load capacity for towing I'll get AirLift air bags.

Still planning a lift when I can, but now I am thinking I'll go with the MarkMC Liftmeister 2.5" kit, and stock size Bilstein HD shocks.

In my research of front springs, I have come to the belief that springs from most companies are the same. NAPA, Raybestos, and the Moog springs all have the exact same specs for springs rates, load capacity, wire thickness, free length, etc.

Also, for the front springs, they are all the same except in free length. So an XL/EXT spring is the same rate and wire diameter as a 2WD front spring, just made longer to keep the front end up more. Obviously the OEM GM springs have a lot of variations for the fronts.
 

CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
So last night I completed the replacement of my air suspension with coil springs. The springs I used are listed in my last post.

Everything went pretty well. At first I didn't disconnect the upper control arms and was going to pry the springs into place, but then I noticed the UCA was resting on the sway bar end links and I didn't want to put more pressure on them. After disconnecting the UCAs I had lots of room to just put the springs in.

I still have the shocks designed for the air springs and it is obvious they are not long enough. The coil springs sit 1 1/2" higher than the air springs did, as you can see by the tape mark on the shocks. That was where they sitting with the air springs. I checked the shocks, and from full extension to where they sit at rest there is only 1.5" of travel. It wouldn't take much of a bump for them to top out.

New shocks will be ordered once I figure out what, if any lift I end up doing.

Pictures!
 

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CarbEnvoy

Original poster
Member
Sep 29, 2012
38
With LT245/70/R17 Tires, and the coil springs. The voy is now sitting at 36" to the wheel well on each side in the rear, and 33" on both sides in the front.

Getting rid of the leaky bags has fixed the droop to the passenger side that was there.
 

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