Opportunity for me to grab a TBSS intake

[Reprise]

For whatever reason, speed parts are on my brain lately (probably because I'm also in the market for a travel trailer, so I want to get the Voy ready as best I can.)

Yesterday, I ordered a set of headers, and picked out a cam grind.
Today I found a guy on CL selling a TBSS intake manifold (cathedral port, just like I have). Figure it's the best, easiest option, without cutting the hood.

Got him down to $150; I go to pick it up tomorrow. He says no issues; uses an 87mm throttle body (I'll have to look and see what my stocker is).

Not looking to do a CAI or gut my stock air box. Anything else to worry about? Or am I wasting time / $ here?

Appreciate all replies

PS: No, I don't know if he has the 'beauty cover' for it...LOL

 

[Mooseman]

Fuel injectors? Might need extra go juice. You'll need a tune for sure.

Is it a 4x4? Might be an issue with the headers.

And is there any difference between the two? They migration share the same intake.

 

[Reprise]

Some more info...
No, he doesn't have the beauty cover...lol.
Yep - I'm 4x4

I know the SS was basically the Vette engine (LS2?) , so I doubt it had the same intake as my truck-based LM4 - IIRC (?), ours were a bit restrictive; the pickups had a higher rise b/c they had the extra hood clearance.

But since you mention that, I should look up the part interchange #s - and I'll do that, as soon as I grab a nap.

BTW, I didn't read the ad carefully - besides the intake, he's also throwing in the SS 87mm throttle body, the fuel rail and the injectors.
Guessing I should buy some lottery tickets.

You think Jeremy could do an 'approximate' tune, while I'm putting all this stuff in? I just need something that would let me drive to a local place for fine-tuning (I don't want to have to flat-bed it to the tuner).

Here's a pic, if it helps at all. Like I said - I'll do my homework in a bit. At this point, I figure even if it doesn't work w/ mine, I can make the $150 back w/o any trouble.

 

[northcreek]

Did you know that you can buy a new AC Delco manifold from RA for a buck and a quarter?
http://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=2678054&cc=1442942&jsn=494&jsn=494&jsn=494

 

[Mooseman]

The intake used on the SS is not the same one as the Vette. It is tall, like on the 5.3, for more torque which the heavy truck needs. It might be the same but if it comes with the throttle, injectors and rails, heck, it's worth it.

With all the new parts, it might be difficult for him to come up with a tune out of the air unless he can find a file somewhere that someone used with the same combo. But then, I'm just talking out of my a** because I have never tuned anything or really know how this stuff works. Best thing would be to ask him directly.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

Nice find and with the extras it seems like a deal.

The LS2 was introduced as the Corvette's new base engine for the 2005 model year. It also appeared as the standard powerplant for the 2005–2006 GTO. It produces 400 bhp (300 kW) at 6000 rpm and 400 lb⋅ft (542 N⋅m) at 4400 rpm from a slightly larger displacement of 5,967 cc (5.967 L; 364.1 cu in). It is similar to the high-performance LS6, but with improved torque throughout the rpm range. The LS2 uses the "243" casting heads used on the LS6 (although without the sodium filled valves), a smaller camshaft, and an additional 18 cubic inches. The compression of the LS2 was also raised to 10.9:1 compared to the LS1s' 10.25:1 and the LS6s' 10.5:1. The LS2 in the E-series HSVs are modified in Australia to produce 412 bhp (307 kW) and 412 lbft . The LS2 in the Chevrolet Trailblazer SS and the Saab 9-7X Aero are rated at 395 bhp (295 kW) (2006–2007) or 390 bhp (290 kW) (2008–2009) and 400 lb⋅ft (542 N⋅m) of torque due to a different (sometimes referred to as a "truck") intake manifold that produces more torque at lower RPMs.

 

[Reprise]

So I picked it up tonight. The guy I picked it up from had stated about 30hp increase, and pointed me here - where one of the enthusiast mags tested 20 different LS intakes (both factory & aftermarket.)

The TL; DR version: It came out on top of all the factory intakes they tested, including the LS6 version.

The guy mentioned that he thought *all* 5.3L Envoys & TBs got the TBSS intake starting in 2006 - we surmised that the advertised HP increase between the LM4 and LH6 versions might have been (at least partly) due to this update, if GM actually did give all the later 5.3L V8s the TBSS intake.

It'll be a little while before I put it on, b/c I want to eliminate taking the top half of the engine apart twice (if I put the cam in I've been looking at, a new set of lifters are going in, to - and the heads have to come off for those. The headers will go on at the end, after I put the heads back on)

The article I linked to above has pics of the 'stock truck' intake (which I have), and the TBSS intake - you can see the difference there, if you're curious.

(For 2006-2009 Denali owners who want to see if they've got the TBSS intake - I'm sure we'd all be interested if you did. Would be a great way to be able to source one, via the pick-n-pulls.)

BTW - I did check Rock just now, and indeed, at least for 2006 GMC 5.3L, the part # ( 12580420 ) and pic matches the TBSS (see @northcreek post above.) So that could apply for non-Denali models as well, since that was the last year for the LWB.

If true, it would be a pretty cheap upgrade for '03-'05 5.3L owners.

My thanks to everyone who supplied input on this. And of course, when I do put this in, there'll be pics and a write-up. But it's going to be a bit of time until then, as I mentioned above.

 

[Mooseman]

Good info. But damn, I have the stock one. No TBSS intake for me.

 

[aaserv]

Did you ever get around to doing this? I picked up an intake at the junkyard awhile back and would like to swap it 1 day. Im mostly interested in what will be involved going from the 3 bolt 78mm TB to a 4 bolt 87mm and just not finding a lot of info on the net. I know it has to have a heavily over priced wire adapter but other than that Im lost as to what else is involved..

 

[Mooseman]

I've started watching this guy on YT who dyno's LS engines constantly. This is probably where that +30HP number came from however, this was with a built 6.0.

Here's another one on a 5.3 where he compares the Dorman repro TBSS intake to the factory one:

If you go through his channel, there's a bunch of comparisons like these. I was surprised for the later square port LS engines that there is no difference between the car and truck intakes.

 

[aaserv]

Yea Ive seen theres not much difference in intakes. Where the difference is in using a bigger throttle body and the bigger injectors that go with them. I know there is an adaptor to use a 4 bolt on my 3 bolt but that just seems kinda half assed to me. im thinking about later anyway when ill be wanting to change intake gaskets and all anyway maybe even a cam if i end up just keeping this motor.

 

[TollKeeper]

Good info. But damn, I have the stock one. No TBSS intake for me.

I still dont see a diference inbetween my 04 intake and an intake from a later Denali. Am I missing something?

 

[aaserv]

From my research which is amateur hour at best.....03-04 all came with a 3 bolt 78mm Throttle body. In 05 they went to an 87mm 4 bolt throttle body and just kept getting bigger from there. I dont think as Mooseman pointed out there is a huge difference in intake alone. However once you start looking for more HP the 78 is very limiting. They use a lower flow injector that just doesnt allow for much of an increase in air flow that you need when trying to make more HP. I would think its safe to assume the 295/310 hp that 78mm equipped motors run is about the top of its range and when trying to go over that you need more breathing capacity. Which is why GM has increased the size of the throttle body as their HP numbers have increased. The 1 Im looking to use appears to have been used starting around 2009 and its 90mm. It was used on 425hp 6.0/6.2's . Maybe another reason they went bigger was to keep the usable torque numbers lower also. Even if it's possible to use the 78mm on a 400hp motor it would seem logical that the peak torque and HP numbers would have to come at a much higher RPM.....
It would also seem like an easier route would be for someone to make a 3 bolt throttle body bigger that 78mm........but I havent found 1 anywhere...

 

[Reprise]

Did you ever get around to doing this? I picked up an intake at the junkyard awhile back and would like to swap it 1 day. Im mostly interested in what will be involved going from the 3 bolt 78mm TB to a 4 bolt 87mm and just not finding a lot of info on the net. I know it has to have a heavily over priced wire adapter but other than that Im lost as to what else is involved..

Hi. Sorry I didn't see this before today. I'm actually doing this now, as part of my Sierra build. But since I'm doing other things first, here's some info for you...

Here's what you'll need to account for (short version):
- The throttle body (I got the TBSS one with mine, so I'm set)

- Air ducting to the larger TB (various options)

- TBSS fuel rail (you can't swap the one from your 360). Get, make, or modify yours.

- Injectors, and connectors. (adapters are available to connect our harness leads to the TBSS 'USCAR' type injectors. Or you can splice the TBSS ones in)

- (The big one... ) You need to account for the TBSS being a 'returnless' system. Our '03s have a return line for the fuel, and our stock intake has a fuel pressure regulator system attached. If you get a fuel filter from a C5 Vette, it can attach to the return line, and will regulate at 58 lb.

- There are some plumbing issues to work out, like for the purge solenoid, but those are minor, and you can use the TBSS setup, IMHO.

Here's a link that will show what I'm talking about, with pics:

TBSS intake install on NBS - PerformanceTrucks.net Forums

GM Engine & Exhaust Performance - TBSS intake install on NBS - hey guys ive been studying the posts about the TBSS intake manifolds...i started a thread a while ago and due to funds i wasnt able to go through with it, i figured id get some idea's since i found how to do this on a budget now that...

www.performancetrucks.net

There are others, but this is about the best one I've found.