NEED HELP No shifting/engaging. no codes.

TJBaker57

Well-Known Member
Hi. Its envoy xl 2005.tran is not engaging. No codes. No sel. Fluids are ok. The rubber thing attached to the cable is ok.
There is sound when shifting from r to p. Only.
No engaging at all to all positions.

Any help is deeply appreciated.
When you move the shifter does the indicator on the dash cluster move?
 

gmcman

Well-Known Member
Any symptoms prior to this? Delayed shifts, did the tach needle rise during shifts?

Any odd sounds ccoming from the trans?

Seems to be a trending topic lately, I would start with replacing the filter.

Are you checking the fluid with the engine running, level surface? You can check it with a cold trans, (hot preferred) but the fluid level will read slightly low when cold but the dipstick usually has a cold and hot range.
 
OP
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yazan

Well-Known Member
Any symptoms prior to this? Delayed shifts, did the tach needle rise during shifts?

Any odd sounds ccoming from the trans?

Seems to be a trending topic lately, I would start with replacing the filter.

Are you checking the fluid with the engine running, level surface? You can check it with a cold trans, (hot preferred) but the fluid level will read slightly low when cold but the dipstick usually has a cold and hot range.
No. It was good before this. No sounds from trany. The fluid is ok . but tomorrow I will check again before and after starting the engine. To check the fluid level changes or no..the to know if the pump is working or not.

I moved manually the shifter arm next to the neutral switch. And the problem is same as using the shifter.
Replaced the neutral switch also. But no change.
 

budwich

Well-Known Member
Another test that you could try is removing a line going into the radiator (transmission cooler area)... start the vehicle and shift thru some gears to see if there is a "noticeable pumping" action of the fluid as opposed to just draining. Of course, catch the fluid so you can tell how much to put back with a new jug. Basically, the test might cost you a few quarts of fluid.

Another question... how did it arrive in this state? You were driving and it stop moving? Next day nothing? what?
 
OP
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yazan

Well-Known Member
Another test that you could try is removing a line going into the radiator (transmission cooler area)... start the vehicle and shift thru some gears to see if there is a "noticeable pumping" action of the fluid as opposed to just draining. Of course, catch the fluid so you can tell how much to put back with a new jug. Basically, the test might cost you a few quarts of fluid.

Another question... how did it arrive in this state? You were driving and it stop moving? Next day nothing? what?
Thanks. Nice idea. Thanks
It was good at the wnd of the day. Then tomorrow Just happened like this.

Can it be related to transfer case? My voy have 4*4 but removed. (Disabled)
 

gmcman

Well-Known Member
Can it be related to transfer case? My voy have 4*4 but removed. (Disabled)


If the transfer case went into neutral it could.

Does the shifter make the same clicking sounds when selecting each gear? You are certain the cable is attached to the trans?

Are you parked on a hill?

I believe if the transfer case was in neutral, you would not have a Park-hold....it would roll.

You can try this, but be careful, raise the RPM to about 800 and try to engage the gear. Just don't rev the engine wildy while in a gear in case it does engage.
 

budwich

Well-Known Member
Thanks. Nice idea. Thanks
It was good at the wnd of the day. Then tomorrow Just happened like this.

Can it be related to transfer case? My voy have 4*4 but removed. (Disabled)
ah... now we are getting some info. who or what was removed and how?
 

MRRSM

Lifetime VIP Supporter
Check out the Chapter in this ATSG 4L60E Service and Rebuild PDF on "How to Install a Transmission Fluid Line Pressure Gauge" at the Built-In Port on the Driver Side Upper Center portion of the 4L60E Transmission Case.

This Book covers ALL of the Diagnostics necessary for investigating Modes of Failure by their Symptoms, by their Specific Components involved and by the Reasons for any Malfunctions in ALL operational aspects of the 4L60E Transmissions:

ATSG4L60EBIBLEMANUAL.jpg
 

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Mooseman

Moderator
OP
Y

yazan

Well-Known Member
It was the transfer case in neutral .
I pushed the voy while parking in p .engine off. So the car moved. No gear lock.
So I installed the 4wd module and fuse .and connected the transfer case harness and start the engine. The 4wd switch indicators was blinking crazy and moving .so I swithed it to N position and then returned it to 2wd and the gear engaging good and car moved and drive .
While testing the 4wd positions I can feel the gear engaging is hard and the car is jumping when shifting to D.
I can't understand why its in N !

Iam still feeling some shifting spinning between p.r.n.d.
I think the shifting cable is suspected 😀
I will drive tomorrow after rechcking the fluids
Thanks everyone. Thanks a lot. I will keep posting any updates.
 

gmcman

Well-Known Member
@yazan I edited that post as we responded at the same time.

Good to hear it's working.

Not sure why it ended up in Neutral unless the transfer case actuator is possibly going bad or a failing 4WD switch.
 

Mooseman

Moderator
He had taken out the TCCM and the fuse so it shouldn't have moved but maybe over time it did.

It's not necessary to do that and will avoid this problem in the future as well as keeping the Service 4x4 light off. Leave the fuse in place so if it does this again, it can correct itself on the next start. Just leave it in 2hi and be happy.

BTW, have you changed the transfer case fluid within the required 50k mile interval? Even if you don't use it in 4x4, it still needs this service as stuff is still spinning inside.
 
OP
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yazan

Well-Known Member
He had taken out the TCCM and the fuse so it shouldn't have moved but maybe over time it did.

It's not necessary to do that and will avoid this problem in the future as well as keeping the Service 4x4 light off. Leave the fuse in place so if it does this again, it can correct itself on the next start. Just leave it in 2hi and be happy.

BTW, have you changed the transfer case fluid within the required 50k mile interval? Even if you don't use it in 4x4, it still needs this service as stuff is still spinning inside.
I take your advise to keep the fuse. But it happened again many times. Even while shifting from r to d.
So I disconnected the transfer case socket. And its ok now.
Any better solution? Like removing the encoder motor?
Should I disconnect the tccm?
 

TJBaker57

Well-Known Member
I take your advise to keep the fuse. But it happened again many times. Even while shifting from r to d.
So I disconnected the transfer case socket. And its ok now.
Any better solution? Like removing the encoder motor?
Should I disconnect the tccm?

DO NOT remove the encoder motor. It contains the brake that holds the transfer case in a given range selection.
 

TJBaker57

Well-Known Member
I take your advise to keep the fuse

Which fuse do you refer to here? You know there are two fuses for the 4WD system, right? The one under the rear seat labelled 4WD is for the front axle disconnect. The fuse for the transfer case shift motor and TCCM is labelled ATC and is in the underhood fuseblock.
 
OP
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yazan

Well-Known Member
Which fuse do you refer to here? You know there are two fuses for the 4WD system, right? The one under the rear seat labelled 4WD is for the front axle disconnect. The fuse for the transfer case shift motor and TCCM is labelled ATC and is in the underhood fuseblock.
Ok. Thanks. Good info
I removed the 4wd in the rear fuse box.
Should I remove the atc also?
 

TJBaker57

Well-Known Member
Ok. Thanks. Good info
I removed the 4wd in the rear fuse box.
Should I remove the atc also?

If you wish the transfer case shift motor to NOT move, then yes, you must remove the ATC fuse. Removing the fuse labeled "4WD" will (most likely) not stop the transfer case shift motor from operating. This may be allowing the intermittent trouble with slipping into neutral. The neutral position in the transfer case is right next to the 2WD position so if the encoder sensor is failing the TCCM may be getting bad position information and misplacing the shift motor too far towards neutral.

Removing the fuse(s) may result in a "service 4wd" light but that's better than slipping into neutral I would imagine. If this is to be a long term situation as I imagine it will be I would say the best approach would be to remove the transfer case shift motor (encoder/motor), position both the transfer case shift shaft AND the shift motor in the 2WD position, then reassemble and not connect the wire harness. That would secure the transfer case in the desired 2WD position, and with the harness disconnected there is no possibility of energizing the shift motor accidentally.
 
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TJBaker57

Well-Known Member
Iam really thankful for the helpful reply.
I. Believe your advise about removing the motor to manually shift to 2wd is the best.
But is the 2wd position is the first from right to left? I will try moving the shaft with piller and see what will happen.
I will attach a photo grabbed from the linked pdf that shows the reference points for aligning the encoder motor to 2WD position.

Screenshot_20210115-192941.png

Image from...

 

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