New ball joints top and bottom.

[coolride]

I put 2 sets of Moog ball joints on order, K6664 and K6663. Now after doing some research, and I'm wonder if Moog is better in quality than ACDelco. For both parts the MOOG brand is a little bit more expensive but there's lots of complaints about quality around the internet.

 

[TollKeeper]

It seems to be hit or miss with the MOOG parts. I have had better luck with the CarQuest/AdvanceAuto brands than I have any of the other brands out there.

 

[Mooseman]

Buy whatever good brand suspension parts. There is no definitive good brand over another. I've had fairly good service from a local parts store house brand. Just stay away from unknown CCC. Personally, Moog has been meh for me.

 

[hockeyman]

If and when I need new UBJ's and LBJ's for any of my current vehicles, I think I may stick with my local auto parts retailer. Simply because if they go bad, I won't have to deal with mailing/delivery. I do not do any offroading or anything else to put added stress on higher quality parts. Besides, the only potholes here in Florida are the ones on the faces of meth-heads and they probably won't do much suspension damage if you run one of them over...

 

[coolride]

I'm not into recreational off roading, but I do get off road as much as it takes to go fishing and hiking. My concern is that I don't have to re-do this job in a year.

 

[cornchip]

My MOOG outer tie rod ends have 20k more mileage than the factory units had when the drivers OEM side went. So far no discernible end play. I keep them greased when I rotate my tires in the fall. I think most any serviceable component will outlast OEM regardless of brand.

 

[Mounce]

Have had EXTREMELY bad luck with driveworks branded parts from advance. UBJ on TB were bad within 2 years, many inner tie rods on the Silverado plus an idler arm and idler arm bracket within 30k miles.

 

[Reprise]

(on edit: OP, I saw you mentioned off-road... Mevotech makes a 'TTX' line (green boot) that seems to be popular; I think some of the ORTB guys have them (as another brand, but they're the Mevotechs), and have posted about them on their forum. Might be more 'off-road' than you need, but I'd rather have 'too much' vs. 'fail', myself)


I tend to go with the Moog 'problem solver' line (the K6663 / K6664 fall in this line), for two reasons:

- The 'problem solver' part is that the ball shaft is limited in travel to one axis - inward / outward (they require installation with a reference mark on the ball joint aligned in the proper area on the arm.) They also have a pretty beefy shaft / ball, especially as compared to OEM.

- If one ever fails, I can go to any retail store that carries them and get a replacement (they're readily available at several different chains). The cheapest place to get them is Rock, btw (and I wouldn't hesitate to return them to a retail store I didn't buy them from; they get reimbursed by Moog, since the product has a lifetime warranty.) Note that the AC Delco 'professional' line is also warranted for life, but fewer retail shops carry them; some that do are by special (whse) order (most people don't spend the extra for the 'pro' lines, so the retail stores tend to stock only the 'advantage' line (which is NOT warranted for life).

(a third minor reason is that the Moogs have a relief outlet in the boot; should you get overzealous with the grease gun, you won't blow the boot (I've done this with other brands). The boot also seems to be (semi-)resistant to careless / rough treatment during press-in (I've done this, too, with other brands))

Does that mean that everyone that has complained their Moog products failed was mistaken? Nope. Not by a long shot. They're 'not what they used to be', as well as no longer made in N. American plants. But for the difference in price, as well as their ready availability, I'm still willing to take a chance with them, at this point.

Note that this only applies to Moog ball joints. For other suspension pieces, I'm not captive to that brand, and will buy others, depending on price / warranty / performance / difficulty to replace (again).

And it goes without saying... if you don't keep them lubed, they'll still fail (once a year is generally sufficient, unless you're doing hotshotting)

 

[Sparky]

FWIW I have been using Moog joints almost exclusively for years and only once had one fail early, and it could be attributed to a lack of fresh grease (stopped taking grease within the first year, and it lasted almost 2 more before it went bad). All others I have never replaced after doing it the first time, and most have had 100k+ put on them.

Just my experience. I had decent luck with a Duralast Gold joint also a while back.

Of course maybe I just have generally good seevice out of most parts. My old 98 Camaro had 160k on it at its end and the ball joints were factory original and still tight, somehow...

 

[coolride]

I'm breaking for lunch. This morning I was able to remove the ball joints, the tie rod end, and the knuckle. Pictured below is one of the tools included in the AutoZone 23 piece Powerbuilt kit. You have to use this tool to press out the bottom joint.


The tool works against these iron ears (left and right.) I watched a dozen videos and read plenty of threads and I failed to learn this important information. Wasted good time, and made way to much noise, using the wrong tool.

 

[coolride]

Picked up a grease gun at AutoZone. I moved recently from Florida to New York, and decided to leave the grease gun in FL. It was just way to stinky and greasy to travel with. After price comparing at Amazon and Walmart, I found that AutoZone's prices were competitive. (And they've been cracking me up lately.)

 

[coolride]

Check out this NAPA Chassis promo video. It's NAPA vs "the competitor" (Moog probably.)

 

[Mounce]

Mevotech makes a 'TTX' line (green boot)

Not trying to sway OP, just tossing in for future searchers and to say that these are what I use and trust now. I always speak on them when I can as there's not much searchable content out about them, at least I found very little when trying to decide between them and Moog. Have them on the TB and Silverado, also have their outer tierods on the Silverado, would've gotten inners too but they don't make them. They are pricey, few dollars more than Moog on rockauto. They are BEEFY and I've been impressed with their quality. Some even come with an install adapter for the press on certain ones like the uppers on the 360's.

 

[coolride]

Just back from a test drive (finished the driver's side.) It goes down the road fine, but there's a rapid ticking (pulsing) in the brake pedal that's intermittent. It happed while driving slow (with light braking) around a parking lot. Maybe something's wrong with the anti-lock brake sensor. What did I mess up?

 

[coolride]

Maybe that brake is slipping under light pressure and activating the system? (So the ABS might be working fine.)

 

[Mooseman]

Make sure the rotor is seated properly on the hub. I once had rust form in a specific hole but when I reinstalled the rotor, the rust on the hub face wasn't in the same position as the hole on the rotor. Be sure to clean off all the rust on both.

 

[coolride]

I see how an off center rotor would cause a pulse in the brake pedal. But I'm getting a buzz. When I hit the brakes for a light or an intersection, I get a "buzz" in the last 2 or 3 feet before the complete stop.

The only thing that I can think of that went wrong during reassembly is that the o-ring for the ABS sensor was junk, so I reinstalled it without the o-ring.

 

[TollKeeper]

I know what that is. My envoy used to do that when I bought it. One of the Front ABS Wheel Speed sensors either has some debri on it, grease, or rust. The easiest option is to just replace the wheel bearing (the sensor is inside it). But you could just take it all apart, and clean it out to.

 

[coolride]

The sensor bolts in the side of the hub with a torx srew. Is this what you mean? I don't see any other sensors. When I reinstalled the bearing (and knuckle) I greased it up with Mobil 1. I didn't think that grease would affected the sensor because it looks like a sealed magnetic type thing.

 

[TequilaWarrior]

The sensor bolts in the side of the hub with a torx srew. Is this what you mean? I don't see any other sensors. When I reinstalled the bearing (and knuckle) I greased it up with Mobil 1. I didn't think that grease would affected the sensor because it looks like a sealed magnetic type thing.

That sensor should be nearly surgically clean. Also, without an o-ring you ~will~ have problems with it eventually.
Typically, after removing the torx screw you can pull the sensor straight out of the hole. There should be a shim between the sensor body and the hub, sometimes more. On one of these that I did there were 2 o-rings and I removed the thinner one when I had to lightly sand the end of the sensor. There should also be a very small o-ring at the base of the sensor. That o-ring is to keep moisture out of the tone ring cavity. Clean the sensor very well - there should be zero rust, grease, or debris on the end of the sensor. I once lightly sanded (200 grit) the end of a sensor that had some very light rust. Make sure the flat spot on the hub where the sensor goes in is free of rust and debris. I've seen videos where people will shoot a light coat of paint on it (after plugging the hole). I typically don't do that but have applied battery terminal rust protector after installing the sensor, but I digress. If you're missing the o-ring (or discarded it) you should locate a replacement from an old sensor or perhaps if you're luck they'll have them at a hardware store, not sure. Reinstall the sensor and you should be good. I would check both sides - especially for rust on the end of the sensor and on the flat of the hub. Clean everything. I have been tempted to spray brake cleaner into the tone-ring cavity but have resisted that temptation as I don't know what sort of damage it would cause or if loosening any debris/rust on the tone ring would cause it to build up in one spot. Good luck.

 

[coolride]

Today, I finished the ball joints on the passenger side (had the day off.) The o-ring broke apart when I pulled the sensor. The same thing happened on the other sensor but today, I ran to the parts store and bought new o-rings. I'll have to take the driver's side apart again and have another look at that sensor. I remember that it had a glob of grease on it and a disintegrated o-ring that I didn't replace..

My small garage was a huge mess after finishing the driver's side (it's worse than it looks.) I cleaned up before starting on the passenger side. The second time around was easier going (thank God.)

 

[coolride]

Today I put the driver's side back up on a jack stand and had a look at the sensor that I messed up (I didn't know what I was dealing with.) I cleaned up the silicone mess that I made and scrapped clean the iron mating surface. Then I blew the debris out of the bore (and off of every vane on the rotor) with an air compressor. That method cleared lots of greasy rust off those "rotor" teeth (not sure what the correct name is.)


To replace the o-ring I first went to Advance Auto, where I bought a small assortment. Only 2 of the rings from this assortment will fit into the bore. I tore one and then went to Auto Zone, and bought again the exact same assortment, in order to get the one correct o-ring. The good news is that it's back together and the sensor is working normally.

 

[TequilaWarrior]

Today I put the driver's side back up on a jack stand and had a look at the sensor that I messed up (I didn't know what I was dealing with.) I cleaned up the silicone mess that I made and scrapped clean the iron mating surface. Then I blew the debris out of the bore (and off of every vane on the rotor) with an air compressor. That method moved cleared lots of greasy rust off of that "rotor" surface (not sure what the correct name is.)
View attachment 91393

To replace the o-ring I first went to Advance Auto, where I bought a small assortment. Only 2 of the o-rings out of the assortment will fit into the bore. I tore one and then went to Auto Zone, and bought the exact same assortment, in order to get the one right o-ring. The good news is that it's back together and the sensor is working normally.

"Tone Ring" is the word you're looking for.
That shim should be completely clean. There should be no grease whatsoever inside that hole or on the tone ring. The sensor should be "surgically" clean - I use electronics cleaner and wipe with a clean cloth to make sure I don't have any metal powder/rust on it before reinstalling it. The cavity that the tone ring rides in should be kept as clean as possible. If rust begins to form on the tone ring, your only course of action is to replace the hub. Good luck. Hope it stays fixed for you.

 

[Mooseman]

That cavity is normally full of grease so a little grease shouldn't bother anything as long as it doesn't have any metal or rust in it. Don't completely clean out the grease out of your bearings will fail.

I would just replace the hubs for all that trouble.

 

[coolride]

That cavity is normally full of grease so a little grease shouldn't bother anything as long as it doesn't have any metal or rust in it. Don't completely clean out the grease out of your bearings will fail.

I would just replace the hubs for all that trouble.

It wasn't much trouble. The compressed air blew some of the dirty grease out of the sensor bore. Enough so that the teeth on the tone ring looked free of grime. Over time a small amount of rust probably falls from the sensor bore and onto the teeth. It was nothing major. I want these hubs to last through the winter.

"Tone Ring" is the word you're looking for.
That shim should be completely clean. There should be no grease whatsoever inside that hole or on the tone ring. The sensor should be "surgically" clean - I use electronics cleaner and wipe with a clean cloth to make sure I don't have any metal powder/rust on it before reinstalling it. The cavity that the tone ring rides in should be kept as clean as possible. If rust begins to form on the tone ring, your only course of action is to replace the hub. Good luck. Hope it stays fixed for you.

I cleaned the shim (carefully) with brake cleaner and a brush. It did have a small break (visible in the picture) and a tiny sliver of the material folded over onto itself. So in one small spot, the sensor was double shimmed. I wiped off the sensor and gave it a shot of brake clean. A little silicone on the o-ring, and I carefully reinstalled it.

 

[Mooseman]

And the result?

 

[coolride]

Took it out for a test drive and it had no problems with the ABS.

 

[coolride]

When I was shopping for ball joints, I didn't notice that uppers could be bought for $6 dollars. And lowers for $7.03. I mean MAN! that's crazy cheap.
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog...r,4.2l+l6,1432188,suspension,ball+joint,10070

 

[Sparky]

Yeah, and I wouldn't trust those to last at all. I avoid anyone's "economy" line unless I just need something super temporary. And with the work required to change a ball joint I don't want to do it any more often than necessary. Plus, ever seen what happens when a ball joint catastrophically fails? Not pretty...

 

[Maverick6587]

I agree with Sparky! I would go with ACD, premium, probably heavy duty since they're cheaper than ACD.

At 1:20, "Did my tire just fall off?"

 

[coolride]

I would never trust a 6 dollar ball joint. But WTF!! 6 dollars!???

 

[Mooseman]

I'd use those only if selling the truck, and even then I'd probably feel guilty.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

I use the cheapest $5 ball joints n never had one fail randomly, but I do inspect my shit pretty often. I would take any cheap joint over anything with a moog brand.