Looking at a 9-7X 5.3i having rear end issues

[SaabScott]

I'm going to describe what I found today. This may be a common issue, but I am completely new to the AWD world.

Started the truck, put it in reverse, foot off the brake, all good ...
Started to turn the steering wheel and after hitting about 1/2 turn, I found the inside rear wheel seemed to be braking all on its own.

Upon discovering this, I tried to replicate it ... and succeeded.

Regardless of forward or reverse, turning either left or right, from about 1/2 turn to full lock, the inside rear wheel would grab as if the system was engaging the one brake.


Any thoughts? If I decide to go ahead and purchase this Saab, the dealer will need to know where to look for a fix.

 

[Wooluf1952]

Welcome


In case you haven't heard:
http://gmtnation.com/forums/topic/218-welcome-to-gmtnationcom-heres-the-story/



Are you sure it is a rear wheel? That sounds like a bad transfer case. Or front differential.
Do you know the maintenance history? The t-case fluid should've been changed every 50k miles.

 

[SaabScott]

No maintenance history.

Definitely the rear ... on gravel, I could hear the tires grabbing at the back.

 

[Wooluf1952]

Have them check the rear diff. How many miles on the truck? Could be low/old/no fluid. Do you know if it has the G80 locking diff?

 

[Ryda55555]

Btw welcome to the forums, where in canada are you located? If your anywhere near toronto you should come out to a meet one day
But Its probably the transfer case, supposedly with the AWDs you're supposed to change the fluid every 50,000 miles
My dads truck was doing the same thing until one day there was too much pressure on the transfer case so it blew
So its definitely an issue that should be looked after asap

 

[SaabScott]

Thanks for all of the responses so far and the warm welcome.

I'm in Mississauga, so sure, once I get my hands on this (or another 9-7X), meeting up would be good.

The Saab 9-7X has a rear LSD, I read somewhere it is the G86. Other threads I have read also suggests fluids ...

The truck has 162,000 kms, but I have no history on it.


I am actually hoping to get my hands on a 2006 9-7X 4.2i where I have a much better sense it has been well maintained (it is still with its current owner). He's told me of a number of things he has done to maintain the truck and even has 2 sets of tires for it.

The bottom line ... I want a 9-7X (sorry, it HAS to be a Saab ... I'm the President of The Saab Club of Canada and have been for about 8 years). I want that 4.2i, but if I can't have it, I need a back up. Hence the 5.3i I am asking about.

 

[Ryda55555]

Thanks for all of the responses so far and the warm welcome.

I'm in Mississauga, so sure, once I get my hands on this (or another 9-7X), meeting up would be good.

The Saab 9-7X has a rear LSD, I read somewhere it is the G86. Other threads I have read also suggests fluids ...

The truck has 162,000 kms, but I have no history on it.


I am actually hoping to get my hands on a 2006 9-7X 4.2i where I have a much better sense it has been well maintained (it is still with its current owner). He's told me of a number of things he has done to maintain the truck and even has 2 sets of tires for it.

The bottom line ... I want a 9-7X (sorry, it HAS to be a Saab ... I'm the President of The Saab Club of Canada and have been for about 8 years). I want that 4.2i, but if I can't have it, I need a back up. Hence the 5.3i I am asking about.

Wow, president of the saab club of canada, sounds like a big deal lool but yea looking forward to seeing you, theres a bunch of us ontarioans

 

[SaabScott]

Wow, president of the saab club of canada, sounds like a big deal lool but yea looking forward to seeing you, theres a bunch of us ontarioans

No big deal really ... just means I've been willing to do the most work!

 

[The_Roadie]

Classic case of non-serviced transfer case with grabby clutches. The AWD system using the NP126 transfer case is not like the normal AWD systems with viscous transfer cases. Drain it, measure what comes out and check the quality, and refill. May have to do this process twice to clean out clutch fragments if it's gone too long without being changed.

Since you haven't bought it, that's a relief. Could cost you a new transfer case.

Any dealer who didn't know the symptoms of a bad NP126 transfer case is highly suspect in my mind. Is this a GM dealer or a used car schlock lot?

 

[BRomanJr]

Thanks for all of the responses so far and the warm welcome.

I'm in Mississauga, so sure, once I get my hands on this (or another 9-7X), meeting up would be good.

The Saab 9-7X has a rear LSD, I read somewhere it is the G86. Other threads I have read also suggests fluids ...

The truck has 162,000 kms, but I have no history on it.


I am actually hoping to get my hands on a 2006 9-7X 4.2i where I have a much better sense it has been well maintained (it is still with its current owner). He's told me of a number of things he has done to maintain the truck and even has 2 sets of tires for it.

The bottom line ... I want a 9-7X (sorry, it HAS to be a Saab ... I'm the President of The Saab Club of Canada and have been for about 8 years). I want that 4.2i, but if I can't have it, I need a back up. Hence the 5.3i I am asking about.

Please check the glove box sticker for either G80 or G86, they are very different and have different diagnostics.


If it is a G86, it is probably the rear diff binding, usually this indicates the LSD gear oil needs replacing. Worst case diff is bad.

If it is a G80, it may be the rear diff but that is not very common. Check that when both rears are off the ground, one rear wheel can be spun and the other spins opposite.

Either way start at the rear diff, then move to the TC, the RPO code (glovebox sticker) is probably an NP4, once you confirm the RPO codes the info will help to go further.

 

[jimmyjam]

Guess I'm not following the logic how a bad xfer case affects one rear wheel... if figure it would more likely be a sticky lsd

 

[BRomanJr]

Guess I'm not following the logic how a bad xfer case affects one rear wheel... if figure it would more likely be a sticky lsd

When in 4WD or when a TC is sticky (sticking in 4WD), the tire with the least traction will slip.

 

[SaabScott]

The 9-7's have LSD's and full time AWD.

 

[jimmyjam]

Regardless of forward or reverse, turning either left or right, from about 1/2 turn to full lock, the inside rear wheel would grab as if the system was engaging the one brake.

When in 4WD or when a TC is sticky (sticking in 4WD), the tire with the least traction will slip.

Not trying to be argumentative but I still don't see the connection between that and the OP's issue

 

[SaabScott]

Guys, I have to say ... I also joined the Trailvoy forum ... and you guys have been MUCH more helpful (not a single response to my post over there after 25 views).


I'm going to make one more attempt to get the 4.2i.
Failing that, I am going to (conditional on them correcting and warranting the rear end problem), buy the 5.3i.

Other than this issue, the tailgate is not opening (which they said they would address and fix for sure), it needs 2 tires (they will replace them with a better set of used).

Yes, it is a used car lot, not a GM/Saab dealer. They sell a lot of cars and have very low mark up, which means the price is very attractive.

If I do get this Saab, I will have to eventually put a new set of rubber on it (maybe sooner than later, depending on what they install).
I like the write ups on the General Grabber HTS ... any other thoughts for a reasonably priced, quality tire?

 

[Ryda55555]

Guys, I have to say ... I also joined the Trailvoy forum ... and you guys have been MUCH more helpful (not a single response to my post over there after 25 views).


I'm going to make one more attempt to get the 4.2i.
Failing that, I am going to (conditional on them correcting and warranting the rear end problem), buy the 5.3i.

Other than this issue, the tailgate is not opening (which they said they would address and fix for sure), it needs 2 tires (they will replace them with a better set of used).

Yes, it is a used car lot, not a GM/Saab dealer. They sell a lot of cars and have very low mark up, which means the price is very attractive.

If I do get this Saab, I will have to eventually put a new set of rubber on it (maybe sooner than later, depending on what they install).
I like the write ups on the General Grabber HTS ... any other thoughts for a reasonably priced, quality tire?

I bought a set of sailun tires for $500 a set,
Heres the link
Sailun Tires Canada
They're actually pretty good tires and if you want i can give you the address for the shop i got mine from

 

[SaabScott]

I bought a set of sailun tires for $500 a set,
Heres the link
Sailun Tires Canada
They're actually pretty good tires and if you want i can give you the address for the shop i got mine from

The specs on them look pretty good.
Terramax CVR
255/55-18 109V XL 420AA, rated for 80,000kms!

For sure, hook me up with your shop, I'll check them out. Maybe even see if the place I am getting the truck from can get them at cost (they offered to do that for me).

 

[Ryda55555]

Wheels for less
130 oakdale road
m3n 1v9
- ask for mp @ 416-749-tire (8473)

monday to friday 8:30am - 6:30pm
saturday 9:00am - 4:00pm
sundays closed

 

[Ryda55555]

2005 Saab 9-7X AWD LEATHER/TV-DVD PKG/LOADED on Kijiji 2005 Saab 9-7X AWD LEATHER/TV-DVD PKG/LOADED - City of Toronto Cars For Sale - Kijiji City of Toronto Canada.

You should check kijiji, theres a couple 9-7Xs with low kms for relatively cheap

 

[SaabScott]

2005 Saab 9-7X AWD LEATHER/TV-DVD PKG/LOADED on Kijiji 2005 Saab 9-7X AWD LEATHER/TV-DVD PKG/LOADED - City of Toronto Cars For Sale - Kijiji City of Toronto Canada.

You should check kijiji, theres a couple 9-7Xs with low kms for relatively cheap

Believe me, I check there and Autotrader several times a day.

I've seen that Saab ... wouldn't even ask for the keys to test drive it. In really bad shape.


I've decided to go with the 5.3i described in the OP. Based on what everyone seems to think, I'm OK with working through those issues. The overall condition of the truck is very good, inside and out.
Hoping to get it sometime next week!


Now I'll just need to learn how to change out all of the fluids (drain, fill, run, drain, fill) so that I can start with clean and fresh ... then keep the fluids that way for the rest of its life.

 

[The_Roadie]

Guys, I have to say ... I also joined the Trailvoy forum ... and you guys have been MUCH more helpful (not a single response to my post over there after 25 views).

The folks now here BUILT UP Trailvoy, then they were sold to a Toronto-based corporate raider named Vertical Scope. We all left and started GMTN. All active admins AND mods all left in Dec 2011. The place is a great archives (that most of us wrote) but no *community* anymore. A ghost town that has seen many better days.

 

[SaabScott]

The folks now here BUILT UP Trailvoy, then they were sold to a Toronto-based corporate raider named Vertical Scope. We all left and started GMTN. All active admins AND mods all left in Dec 2011. The place is a great archives (that most of us wrote) but no *community* anymore. A ghost town that has seen many better days.

That sounds very much like the story over at Saab Central ... Vertical Scope came in there a couple of years back and while the site has continued, it just isn't the same.

 

[The_Roadie]

That sounds very much like the story over at Saab Central ... Vertical Scope came in there a couple of years back and while the site has continued, it just isn't the same.

Did you run a jailbreak? What's the new site?

 

[SaabScott]

Did you run a jailbreak? What's the new site?

I didn't, but I did help start up another site.

SaabWorld

Saab Central still gets a lot of traffic and has some great people hanging around.

The problem with Saab being a dead brand (at least for now) is there are fewer and fewer people interested in them.

 

[SaabScott]

So, I took delivery of the truck yesterday.

They changed fluid in both front and rear diffs, all 4 front ball joints, and replaced all 4 tires with Michelin Latitude HP Tour (in really good condition).

However, the rear end is still doing its thing ...
I called this morning and let them know and they asked me to call back Monday afternoon to give them some time to look into it.

Just wondering if anyone has any further suggestions ... or does a fluid change take time to correct things?

All in all, I am very happy so far (and so is the family!!! :wootwoot: ).

 

[BRomanJr]

So, I took delivery of the truck yesterday.

They changed fluid in both front and rear diffs, all 4 front ball joints, and replaced all 4 tires with Michelin Latitude HP Tour (in really good condition).

However, the rear end is still doing its thing ...
I called this morning and let them know and they asked me to call back Monday afternoon to give them some time to look into it.

Just wondering if anyone has any further suggestions ... or does a fluid change take time to correct things?

All in all, I am very happy so far (and so is the family!!! :wootwoot: ).

What are the RPO codes in the Glove box? The advice still hinges on knowing the exact options.

Rear Diff should all be all Gxx codes.

Transfer Case should be NPx code.

On LSD differentials some time may be required to distribute the Friction Modifier based on how long it has been binding, but are you sure they put the proper LSD oil in the back?

Sounds like a nice Truck, great choice.

 

[Ryda55555]

So, I took delivery of the truck yesterday.

They changed fluid in both front and rear diffs, all 4 front ball joints, and replaced all 4 tires with Michelin Latitude HP Tour (in really good condition).

However, the rear end is still doing its thing ...
I called this morning and let them know and they asked me to call back Monday afternoon to give them some time to look into it.

Just wondering if anyone has any further suggestions ... or does a fluid change take time to correct things?

All in all, I am very happy so far (and so is the family!!! :wootwoot: ).

Wow! Nice color choice, congrats
Hopefully they get everything sorted out for you

 

[SaabScott]

What are the RPO codes in the Glove box? The advice still hinges on knowing the exact options.

Rear Diff should all be all Gxx codes.

Transfer Case should be NPx code.

On LSD differentials some time may be required to distribute the Friction Modifier based on how long it has been binding, but are you sure they put the proper LSD oil in the back?

Sounds like a nice Truck, great choice.

I thought it would be easier to take a photo ... it seemed me that there was more than 1 of the Gxx codes ....

View attachment 29731

 

[BRomanJr]

I thought it would be easier to take a photo ... it seemed me that there was more than 1 of the Gxx codes ....

GT4 - 3.73 Rear differential ratio
G67 - Auto Rear Level control
G86 - Rear Limited Slip differential

NP4 - Single Speed Transfer Case, AutoTrac/On-Demand AWD (not full-time AWD)


If you can confirm that LSD Gear Oil was used in the rear diff, then just give it a little time (1,000 miles or so) and see if it improves.

If you can't confirm that LSD Gear Oil was used, have it changed again and confirm it.

If the rear is still binding, The problem is probably inside the rear diff, that will take a repair to fix.

 

[strat81]

Classic case of non-serviced transfer case with grabby clutches. The AWD system using the NP126 transfer case is not like the normal AWD systems with viscous transfer cases. Drain it, measure what comes out and check the quality, and refill. May have to do this process twice to clean out clutch fragments if it's gone too long without being changed.

Roadie's post seems to be getting overlooked, so I'll quote it.

Use only GM Auto-Trak II fluid in there, which is available at any GM dealer. If necessary, buy it yourself and bring it to the mechanic for him to put in for you, although it's an easy job. I change mine every 25k miles, although I think the manual says every 50k. Even if this isn't the source of the problem, it's good maintenance for a truck of unknown provenance.

Also, make sure the gear oil they put in the rear end is rated for use with a LSD. Mobil 1 is, and so are many of the other synthetics, but make sure the bottle says so. Otherwise, you need the LSD additive ("grape juice") from a GM dealer.

 

[BRomanJr]

Roadie's post seems to be getting overlooked, so I'll quote it.

Use only GM Auto-Trak II fluid in there, which is available at any GM dealer. If necessary, buy it yourself and bring it to the mechanic for him to put in for you, although it's an easy job. I change mine every 25k miles, although I think the manual says every 50k. Even if this isn't the source of the problem, it's good maintenance for a truck of unknown provenance.

Also, make sure the gear oil they put in the rear end is rated for use with a LSD. Mobil 1 is, and so are many of the other synthetics, but make sure the bottle says so. Otherwise, you need the LSD additive ("grape juice") from a GM dealer.

You are right about the TC Fluid change needs to be done next (may need to be done twice with a few miles in between), I thought I read the OP changed it, but re-reading the thread and I don't see that it was done yet.

 

[SaabScott]

Roadie's post seems to be getting overlooked, so I'll quote it.

Use only GM Auto-Trak II fluid in there, which is available at any GM dealer. If necessary, buy it yourself and bring it to the mechanic for him to put in for you, although it's an easy job. I change mine every 25k miles, although I think the manual says every 50k. Even if this isn't the source of the problem, it's good maintenance for a truck of unknown provenance.

Also, make sure the gear oil they put in the rear end is rated for use with a LSD. Mobil 1 is, and so are many of the other synthetics, but make sure the bottle says so. Otherwise, you need the LSD additive ("grape juice") from a GM dealer.

I'd be interested in hooking up with a GM truck tech out this way if someone knows of a good one.

Otherwise, I will get the necessary fluids and take them into my Saab Master Tech buddy and do it there. I worked there for 3 years, so I'm not uncomfortable working on Saabs, but I've never done anything with a 9-7X or any AWD/4WD systems ...
I'll spend some time digging through the tutorials and get prepped ...

 

[strat81]

Replacing transfer case fluid is easy. Remove the fill plug. Remove the drain plug. Drain fluid. Replace drain plug. Add fluid until overflow (should take between 1 and 2 quarts). Replace fill plug. Crack beer and enjoy.

There's little room to tip a bottle under there, so you may want to use a hand pump of some type, or a funnel with several feet of vinyl tubing on it. Oh, the drain plug is relatively short and the fluid SHOOTS OUT the moment it's loose, so be prepared, lest you get a shower. You'll need a 3/8" hex bit to remove the plugs.