NEED HELP Hi,I can't get the exhaust flange nuts to budge!

moneypit

Original poster
Member
Dec 7, 2011
214
I'm replacing trans & it seems the cat has to come out. Map gas gets the studs glowing but not nut/won't budge & these were new with manifold years ago but its been sitting outdoors for a few.....I borrowed acetylene torch today but still not yet able to get it to budge? WTF!
 

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Mooseman

Moderator
Dec 4, 2011
25,260
Ottawa, ON
At least it doesn't look like you've rounded the nuts yet. I'm surprised the oxy/ace torch didn't work. Maybe try heating the manifold around the studs to red and try turning the whole stud out. Another thing you could try is getting the nuts red again and squirting them with ice cold water. The thermal shock might shake them loose.

I don't want to suggest cutting them with the torches, which will mean trying to get the studs out of the manifold with vice-grips and there isn't a lot of room to work in. That could likely mean pulling the entire manifold, which also sucks with broken bolts too.
 
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Drec

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Jan 29, 2018
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Yakima, Washington
Could you get a small cutoff wheel in there a partially cut through, then finish it with a chisel? If not try to split the nut with a sharp chisel.
 
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mrrsm

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Oct 22, 2015
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The principles still remain true, as I used the CRC Chemical Spray in 10 Second Bursts specifically on THOSE Three Positions presently puzzling the OP ... and had the personal anecdotal experience with actually being able to spin off those Flange Nuts once the CRC did its Magic... with my Bare fingers. So if NOT Heat... Then...Why not Concentrated , Chemically Penetrating Fluid that is DEEPLY Cold?

One other thing worth mentioning is that when using an Acetylene Torch to Heat UP those Bolts ... Duane and his his assistant from "RealFixesrealFast" demonstrate in this Video... that the Studs and Bolts being heated need to have White Paraffin Candle (Wax) applied directly to the Bolt-Stud to provide lubrication that will follow the Thread Lines and separate the Stud from whatever is holding it fast; be it a Flange or a Nut and allow them to more easily unwind.


It is also worth bringing up this other Thread concerning the Real Danger of using any Spray Brake Cleaner or any other solvent including CRC "Freeze-Off" in combination with an Open Flame or Incandescently HOT Metal... as the Smoke and fumes getting created ... can Injure or Kill anyone Inhaling that Deadly Phosgene Gas Smoke:

 
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budwich

Member
Jun 16, 2013
2,027
kanata
My current "best method" is a heat cold combo. Heat the flange area in and around the bolt as hot as you can (reddish or otherwise). Before you do that... :smile: take the right size socket and put it in the freeze (along with any extension). Once you have the thing hot (speed isn't necessarily that important), take the frozen socket and put it on the nut and give it a "tap" then try wrenching the nut off. NOTE: you are trying to take the nut off and not trying to unscrew the stud itself with the "little nut end".

With the above technique, you will likely either get the nut off or the stuff will come out. You can also do this technique with a box end wrench (has good thermal capacity) if there is enough room.
 
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Maverick6587

Member
Dec 16, 2018
730
Sterling Heights, Michigan
With that torch make sure you are getting just the nut red hot first. I understand that the stud will eventually get red hot as well, but try to focus on getting the nut red hot first.

As soon as you see the stud turning red, try and loosen the nut. You don't want the stud and the nut to expand together with the heat. If you started heating just the stud, that might be your issue. You then have the stud tightening against the nut as it expands.

I'm betting red Loctite was used.
Are you using a long breaker bar?
 

Mooseman

Moderator
Dec 4, 2011
25,260
Ottawa, ON
Wouldn't have red loctite burned off by now? It's likely just stubborn rust that develops with the heat, cold and water hitting it.
 

cornchip

Member
Jan 6, 2013
637
These are the 3 tightest bolts I have ever come across on the TB. A very strong 1/2 or 3/4 impact gun will make easy work of them. Have your warranty for your impact sockets or extensions handy in case you split one of them. Real nasty.
 

Maverick6587

Member
Dec 16, 2018
730
Sterling Heights, Michigan
Wouldn't have red loctite burned off by now? It's likely just stubborn rust that develops with the heat, cold and water hitting it.
In my experience with the red, I've seen it turn into a red/white powder even after two-four attempts with an acetylene torch and getting the nut red hot. I'm sure at that point the stickiness of it is gone, but it has always hung around in the reds for me.
 

budwich

Member
Jun 16, 2013
2,027
kanata
at the "temperature rating" for the "red thread lock", the removal method is to heat to that rating which causes the substance to soften the "plastic set" and allow for removal.

The problem with the exhaust joint is that the cat gets in the way so the socket can't get nicely seated as is. An extension is then needed which reduces the effectness of an impact gun as some of the impact is "eaten" by the "slop" of the extension to socket connection.

I would also make sure that you are heating the "far end" ie. the other end of the stud (at the manifold side. Then you may either budge the nut or the stud itself.
 
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DocBrown

Member
Dec 8, 2011
501
There's nothing particularly special about the studs. I break them, drill them out, and replace them with standard bolts & nuts. Usually I've been able to all this without removing the CAT and crossover pipe.
 

moneypit

Original poster
Member
Dec 7, 2011
214
quick update, heated nuts red hot & eventually got them off! threads were unusable as were the nuts so I got a 10x1.5 hex die to clean up & some new ss flange nuts from mcmaster/carr for peanuts verses dealer wanted $46.xx for 3!!!!! unbelievable lol
 

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