Engine swap for 07 saab97x 5.3i need advice on used engine please

[Sprung Monkey]

Engine swap for 07 saab97x 5.3i I believe the rear end gear ratio is GU80 3.73 need advice on used engine please

1.What year & model vehicle can be a donor for engine for the 07 97x?I know trucks & tahoes come w/ 5.3 but don’t they have larger 4L80e transmissions and the 97x has a smaller 4L60e trans?

2.can a impala front wheel drive engine be used?

3.can a older 06 or 05 LM7 be used, w/ like swapping the original engine relucktor wheel?

I see a lot of used engines older than 07 not seeing many 07 and newer.

4.how much newer than 07 engine would be a direct swap using same computer?

5.I rarely look at fakebook but see engines advertised there all the time however the seller lists engine for sale in Montgomery,ALabama however they live in some forien country plus I'm leary of clicking anything on FB.
6.please recommend a place I can obtain a engine in Alabama area preferablly delivered.

Thanks for any tips on swapping engine.

 

[TollKeeper]

Depending on the 8th digit of your VIN, this will tell you what you need..

https://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/05/LS-LT-Reference-Guide-Summit-Racing.pdf

I think you have the L33 if its a 24x, but not positive on that.
I think you have the LC9 or LH6 if its a 58x, again not positive on that.

The LS4 (FWD) will not work.

 

[Mooseman]

1.What year & model vehicle can be a donor for engine for the 07 97x?I know trucks & tahoes come w/ 5.3 but don’t they have larger 4L80e transmissions and the 97x has a smaller 4L60e trans?

Not sure what years are compatible but there was a change at some point to the 58x crank sensor reluctor. Could be the same as the 4.2 in '08 when it went to 58x. Maybe somebody more versed in the LS engines can confirm. I know my '08 Avalanche with the 6.0 has variable cam timing so I would think it's a 58x.

AFAIK, they all come with the same trannies with the 5.3, the 4L60E. The 4L70E and 4L80E were reserved for the bigger engines and I think the 80's were more in the HD2500+ trucks.

2.can a impala front wheel drive engine be used?

No. Crank snout is different

3.can a older 06 or 05 LM7 be used, w/ like swapping the original engine relucktor wheel?

Should work if it's the same reluctor wheel. And you can't just swap out a reluctor wheel. It's part of the crankshaft.

4.how much newer than 07 engine would be a direct swap using same computer?

Will not work if it's a 58x

5.I rarely look at fakebook but see engines advertised there all the time however the seller lists engine for sale in Montgomery,ALabama however they live in some forien country plus I'm leary of clicking anything on FB.

In a foreign country? Smells like a scam.

6.please recommend a place I can obtain a engine in Alabama area preferablly delivered.

Check Craigslist (watch for scams) or Car-part.com. There's also eBay and they usually deliver there however find they are overpriced.

I think if you get a 5.3 from an 05-07 truck, you should be fine (verify first). If it happens to be an iron block, it will work but you will have some extra weight (100 lbs) with it. And you will also get no DOD so you will need to get a tune to turn that off. You may also need to swap the intake and injectors to stay compatible with your PCM.

So what happened? Did yours blow up?

 

[Sprung Monkey]

I read on your stickie thread compatiable afm/dod engine range from 05-07.I believe the lh6 aluminium changed to 58 teeth in 07. I would like to confirm.

w/ the older 05 or 06 I was hoping to reuse the intire crank w/ it's 58 tooth wheel.

tollkeeper the eight digit of vin# is a M
I'm having PC browser issues when I click on the summit site I get a message your connect isn't secure I know summit isn't a compromised site but I'll have to sort out the browser issue to continue w/ your link.

truck engine sounds good w/out the dod. add the tune of PC. does these truck engines w/out dod also don't have afm or is afm part of dod? like this can be verified by observing wires sticking out the front engine cover correct?
don't mind the extra weight of an iron block do those come w/ 799 or 243 heads?

not exactly sure if this engine is blown up, there's just way to many mosketoes to be outside working on her right now even fully clothed they bite the face eyelids,wrists fingers any skin. been thinking of setting up some fans to blow them away.

I actually cruised by 2 mechanics shops w/ my video. first man didn't think it was rod knock he did know about the famous Oring on the pickup tube however he gave me this story about small metal particals being pumped thoughout engine and a engine replacement would be the smart thing to do.
I asked #1 for a price on used engine haven't heard back for 1 1/2 weeks.

2nd shop the man wasn't there I left him a link to the y-boob video his assitant said he said time for a motor.waiting on prices.

I told both #1 & 2 it was a envoy never mentioned AWD (they must already know it's awd but it they don't they'll proballey use that to jack up the price) so I maybe removing the hubcaps and tape over the rear hatch where the saab emblem is.do envoys have console ignitions?.

mean while I missed my desired van 05 chevy1500 yf7 upfitter (from a none rust area only 100miles from me) explorer hightop conversion van in like new condition I've been looking for this unicorn for around 7 years it had almost everything I wanted including my choice of paint kindof like ordering a new van. not sure how it flew under my van lookout radar it sold in 4 days of advertising even w/ an inflated price.

 

[Mooseman]

does these truck engines w/out dod also don't have afm or is afm part of dod? like this can be verified by observing wires sticking out the front engine cover correct?

AFM is DOD. GM just changed the name from DOD to AFM but the DOD name stuck.

like this can be verified by observing wires sticking out the front engine cover correct?

It's the valley cover that's different. DOD/AFM engines have a Valve Lifter Oil Manifold, or VLOM, instead of a regular flat cover. Your current engine has it.

I actually cruised by 2 mechanics shops w/ my video.

You have a link to that video? If it's just on your phone, upload it to YT and post the link. Can't remember if you already did this.

 

[TollKeeper]

For an 07, with a M as the 8th digit, you have the 58x LH6.

A LH8 VIN L would give you an engine that does not have the VVT of DOD/AFM. You would still have to get your PCM reprogrammed for it thou. But I cant verify any changes that might need to be done to get it to work on your rig, if any..

 

[Sprung Monkey]

notice zero oil preasure at ignition then it builds w/ this type lack of preasure I assume the engine will sieze up in a few miles correct?

tollkeeper I think you are correct on L33 I read somewhere on net about the progression of the 5.3 07 is Lh6 . L33 is aluminum block version.
thanks Guys for info.

 

[TollKeeper]

L33 wont work, thats a 24x. You are a 58x.. Read my post above.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

LH8 VIN Ler the LH8 VIN L sounds good what vehcles has this engine?

the L76 engine has been recommended it's like 375HP and even more torque no dod headache, will require tuning, I think this referred to as the LQ4.
GM made so many engines it's hard to keep track of years/models and what they came w/. thanks

 

[Sprung Monkey]

BTW where do you Guys get the computers reprogramed after a differnt engine swap?

 

[TollKeeper]

@limequat can help with that..

LH8 is a good one to get, and should be a straight swap, with PCM programming, and you will have to use your intake. Finding one will come down to finding a engine, with the seller providing the VIN it came from, and it having the 8th digit of that VIN being a L.

LQ4/LQ9 is a no go.. 24x..
L76 is a no go I believe. Thats the Engine out of a G8, and there has been notations of compatibility issues because of the Holden platform it comes from.

Problems with going with a 6.0 is they will always be more expensive. Although they are the work horse, found in the GM truck 2500, they are also found in the sporty vehicles, and commonly used for swaps.

It will come down to how much you want to spend.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

I thought the G8 came w/ aluminium LS2 block?

I believe the L76 is iron w/ L92 heads which are basically LS2 heads on 360cubis inch.

I don't mine spending a little extra for 6.0 because this vehcles main purpose is towing 3500LBs boat on 200 mile trips to gulf of mexico coming back is uphill sea level to 950' above sea level so the extra power would be a help, (not that the 5.3 is a wuss engine it doe's a great job towing even on the steep inclines).

 

[Mooseman]

L76 is also the same as in my Avalanche and is a 6.0L. Unless you also want to invest in a rear diff that can survive behind that engine, you should pass.

Have you checked the flexplate? The odd intermittent knocking and tinny sound might be that. Don't hear of too many on the LS flexplates cracking, there have been quite a few on the 4.2 causing a similar noise. Rod knock would be more regular however my Saab died of rod knock after living with what I thought was piston slap for years. Oil pressure was fine.

On the video, the knocking sounded louder while you were walking back into the truck, telling me it's coming more from the middle bottom.

This is what rod knock sounds like.

And this is what happens when you floor it with a knocking rod:

Has there been any metal in the oil?

 

[Sprung Monkey]

no haven't checked flexplate. doesn't the engine need to be separated from trans to inspect flexplate?
I have drained oil didn't observe any metal particals just the regular tiny grindings on the drain plugs magnet.

 

[Mooseman]

There is an access hole on the bottom of the bellhousing that you can look in. A boroscope also helps. If it is the flexplate, you have to pull the tranny. There's also the hole for the starter but it's not easy to pull the starter in these trucks on the V8.

 

[Mooseman]

Here's what a cracked flexplate looks like:

<FIXED> Lifter noise & dull knocking (bottom end?) troubleshooting

And I also forgot to mention, there's a second crack opposite of the one... @Sparky will do man, may end up asking Brandon's father to borrow his extra truck until I can install the flex plate next weekend. It'll arrive Wednesday apparently. Kinda nervous now seeing how it has two cracks. Also...

gmtnation.com

And at this post he shows what he saw through the inspection hole:

<FIXED> Lifter noise & dull knocking (bottom end?) troubleshooting

Sound anything like this @Capote

gmtnation.com

Keep in mind that this was on a 4.2 however it's possible on the V8 too.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

I’ll take a look see though the hole, my noise however isn’t constant.

I have to admit to losing interest real quick when looking to see how the starter is removed to lock the flywheel down. Thanks for advice I read/study the thread take a look and report back.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

dropping a trans and transfer case in driveway seams easier than pulling a engine.

 

[xavierny25]

dropping a trans and transfer case in driveway seams easier than pulling a engine.

Aways easier, I dropped both out of my brother-in-law's TBSS about 5-6yrs ago for a rebuild. Just one thing when u think you have the truck up high enough for everything to come down and out GO HIGHER.
Pic is before we went up another 10-12 inches in a pitched driveway.

 

[TollKeeper]

@Mooseman may be correct, except one thing.. The L76 has rectangle ports, and your engine, and intake, has cathedral ports..

2008-09 6.0 L76 Pontiac G8 1 58X/4X  Y Alum. Rectangle
2006-10 6.0 L76 Holden VZ2/VE1 1 58X/4X 2009+ N/A Alum. Rectangle
2007-09 6.0 L76 Truck/SUV 1 58X/4X   Alum. Rectangle

2007-09 5.3 LH6 SUV 1 58X/4X  M Alum. Cathedral

 

[Sprung Monkey]

Cruised by and spoke w/ mechanic #2

He gave me a few tips.

1. testing the cracked flywheel w/ prying a large screw driver though the peep hole

w/ trans. in drive. I’ll pry very little w/ my luck I’ll finish it off.

2.testing the fluttering sound at ignition by removing the drive belt, then cranking her up,he thinks that sound could be a pulley.

3. he also thought the oil pickup tubes screen could be cleaned.

His method 10oz of fuel in oil run engine for one minute then change oil & filter.

He also mentioned that the oil pressure is normal to be at zero then build as mine is doing ( I may have to disagree I believe oil pressure is constant like when cold before starting there’s a lot more than zero at leaset 20PSI.)I asked about how much oil should be squiring out the push rods he said that it would be quirting out all over the place w/out the valve cover, which mine is'nt doing.



The LH8 engine tollkeeper recommends sounds good.

Are the GM 8thdigit vin letter progressive like L comes before M doe’s this mean L is a older than 07 engine?

I plan to do 1,2 & 3 torrow and report back thanks for advice.

 

[TollKeeper]

Oil will not be squirting out "all over the place". But you should see a couple droplets popping up with no valve cover, and see a tiny stream running down the valve galley. Not a lot of oil is needed on a OHV engine, although the parts are moving, there isnt a lot of stress..

Now if this was a OHC engine, or a DOHC, thats a different story.

My 2004 has a P engine, LM4. So the letter coding has nothing to do with years, just a quick reference code for the engine.

20 PSI Oil is low in my opinion, but per GM, is well within spec. My 2004 engine, with 203k miles still is 45 psi, or better. Never drops below.

But my engine is kinda like @Mooseman 's old 9-7x, where there is a engine noise, especially when cold, but runs great.. Waiting for the rod to start knocking. But its been doing this for 113k miles (since I have owned it). Does not get worse, or better, just constant when cold.

 

[Mike534x]

Oil will not be squirting out "all over the place". But you should see a couple droplets popping up with no valve cover, and see a tiny stream running down the valve galley. Not a lot of oil is needed on a OHV engine, although the parts are moving, there isnt a lot of stress..

Now if this was a OHC engine, or a DOHC, thats a different story.

My 2004 has a P engine, LM4. So the letter coding has nothing to do with years, just a quick reference code for the engine.

20 PSI Oil is low in my opinion, but per GM, is well within spec. My 2004 engine, with 203k miles still is 45 psi, or better. Never drops below.

But my engine is kinda like @Mooseman 's old 9-7x, where there is a engine noise, especially when cold, but runs great.. Waiting for the rod to start knocking. But its been doing this for 113k miles (since I have owned it). Does not get worse, or better, just constant when cold.

Mine does this as well when the temperature is below 40-45*, usually its more noticeable in the winter. Start up usually has a bit of chatter (I think its coming from the bottom end), or the valves but it quiets down after 15-30 seconds usually. No abnormal amounts of metal shavings either on the drain plug during oil changes so I'm never worried about it.

 

[TollKeeper]

Mine does this as well when the temperature is below 40-45*, usually its more noticeable in the winter. Start up usually has a bit of chatter (I think its coming from the bottom end), or the valves but it quiets down after 15-30 seconds usually. No abnormal amounts of metal shavings either on the drain plug during oil changes so I'm never worried about it.

Same as mine, but takes about a minute for me..

 

[Mike534x]

Same as mine, but takes about a minute for me..

That's weird yours lasts longer then mine. Not really sure if this had anything to do with it, but when I ran a Mobile 1 oil filter the noise lasted much longer but after using Wix its much shorter.

 

[TollKeeper]

That's weird yours lasts longer then mine. Not really sure if this had anything to do with it, but when I ran a Mobile 1 oil filter the noise lasted much longer but after using Wix its much shorter.

I was using Mobil 1 filters, but I recently switched to K&N.

Has not mattered on which filter for me, my oil pressure stays the same. I am thinking about switching my oil to a 0-30 thou.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

update: I added the 10ounzes of fuel injector cleaner and ran the engine for 2 minutes w/ drive belt then drained oil, oil looked like a milkshake didn't observe any chunks of metal.
removed drive belt cranked her up still heard the fluttering sound at ignition but not as pronounced.fluttering reduced by 50%.
the drive belt is missing some chunks on the outer rib one like 10" the other 2 around 5"&-8"attached images. yet to pry on the flywheel will in next couple of days

I have a new belt however it's in the glove box remember the glove box is jammed up locked, hate to break it to get the new belt w/ my luck the airbag will probally explode any suggestions on opening the GB w/out breaking it would be a big help.

what I like to do next is remove all the rocker arms on odd cylinder head.
I assume none of the cylinders need to be on TDC to remove all rockers?
basically want to check the push rods for being warped.
plan to roll them on a piece of glass.
thanks for advice

 

[Mooseman]

then drained oil, oil looked like a milkshake didn't observe any chunks of metal.

Do you mean it looked like a mocha latté? That sounds more like coolant in the oil.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

no the milkshake was a caused from the fuel injector cleaner in oil.

what do you think about none of the cylinders being on TDC to remove all rocker arms so I can inspect the push rods?

 

[Mooseman]

That'll be fine. No valve to piston contact is possible on removal or re installation.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

OK I just wanted to make sure before I started taking the rockers off, I’ll also be inspecting them. The needle bearings have been know to spill out.won’t a single rockers bearings spilled seize the engine?



Here’s the method I used when I swapped valve springs on the car, however I had the front engine cover off so I knew cylinder #1 was TDC by timing marks.

I won't be removeing the front cover for now, I',m a little confussed on the 2 TDCs
got a good video on finding TDC w/ front engine cover still on.

HOW TO: Change Valve Springs on LS Using TDC Method - YouTube



If push rods are straight & not boogered ends & rockers are good, if I have a bad push rod are stock LS1 pushrods the same as the 5.3s?next I’ll remove the valve springs & inspect them.

When I did this on the car I only used TDC of each cylinder to prevent the valves from dropping into cylinder, no compressed air or rope into cylinder was used.

Can’t understand why ppl tell me you must use compressed air or rope to prevent valves from dropping into cylinder? Is there a difference in the 5.3 compared to the LS1 5.7?



I also had pistons on TDC when re tightening rockers, I have been informed that this isn’t necessary re-tighten all rockers regardless of piston position.



I’m hoping for broke top end stuff the noises appear to be coming from the odd cylinders. Will report back. Thanks for advice

 

[Mooseman]

won’t a single rockers bearings spilled seize the engine?

Not necessarily. If they pinball down into the pan, they're likely to just stay there. The pickup screen would also stop them from getting sucked in. And a grenaded rocker would also make a helluva racket.

are stock LS1 pushrods the same as the 5.3s?

Should be. Check the part numbers.

Can’t understand why ppl tell me you must use compressed air or rope to prevent valves from dropping into cylinder? Is there a difference in the 5.3 compared to the LS1 5.7?

If that worked for you, then go for it. The valve may drop a little depending on if the pistons have valve reliefs or not.

I also had pistons on TDC when re tightening rockers, I have been informed that this isn’t necessary re-tighten all rockers regardless of piston position.

Nope, not necessary.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

I was only able to find a 5/16” socket in ¼” (couldn't find the ¼ to 3/8 socket) I’m assuming the rockers bolt is 8mm?

I was able to use a small cheater pipe on the ¼ racket to remove cylinder #1s rockers they both looked good as did the push rods.

Still plan to inspect the remaining odd rockers.just need proper tools.



Been watching videos on getting a junk yard 5.3 apparently these blocks have both 5.3 & 4.8 ingraved, where you won’t know you actuely have a 5.3 until head is removed and I see a dished piston a flat piston means it’s a 4.8 can't the vin# revel engine size.thanks

 

[TollKeeper]

That is true, you really dont know what engine you have, until you open the black to the engraving. Which I think can be seen on the bellhousing side of the block..

Typically, you can just go by the 8th digit of the VIN, and find the engine the vehicle has. But that isnt always the case.

Had a friend who bought a C5 Corvette, with the 6.0. He was running nitrous, and beating on that engine.. until the engine could not take anymore. He pulled the engine, and it was a 4.8!

 

[Mooseman]

You can also check the underhood emissions sticker for the engine size and confirm with the VIN. Head casting number might also give a clue if you suspect a swapped engine.

Yeah, a guy on YT bought a running auction Vette that looked OK, turned out it was a 5.3 truck iron block. He turboed and nitroused it to death, then went to the yard and accidentally got a 4.8! He still used it and beat the snot out of it.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

I found a ¼” 8mm it seams to be a tad loose on the rocker nuts. I’m thinking this 8mm is the correct size socket. However since these bolts are torqued to 22LBs I’d better not use the ¼” w/ the 3/8” adaptor. And just purchase this Husky 3/8 in. Drive 8 mm 6-Point Metric Standard Socket-H3D6P8MM - The Home Depot

What size socket do you Guys use to remove the rocker arm bolts? I thought all the bolts where metric on gm. thanks

 

[Mooseman]

Inside the engine, they should all be metric. IIRC, the rocker arm bolts are 10mm.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

these are the rocker bolts I'm asking about 8mm doe's feel a tad loose.

I didn't want to use the 1/4" adaptor to 3/8" drive thought it would snap off.

 

[Mooseman]

Had been a while since I've been in an LS engine. Could be 8mm. There should be some 3/8 drive 8mm sockets.

 

[Sprung Monkey]

I've decided to just pull the head and look for broken stuff maybe a valve ect.

or should I do the compresssion test first.?

I'm leary of turning her over for compression test mite completely break what is now particalley broke.

since I've recently had this head off I replace y-pipe bolts and header bolts so hopefully there not rusted yet.