E-Fans

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
I am dealing with my fan clutch dying for the third time and thinking or switching over to E-fans. Found some good info, but looking for any other opinions, ideas, or thoughts to help my decision.

Thinking LT1 fans since they are fairly easy to get.
 

TXBlazer

Member
Nov 21, 2011
533
Cypress, TEXAS USA
I would suggest talking to Alvin at PCM4less about their Efan Harness, and make sure that their harness will work on the 4.2, and it would be a bonus if they did your tune, cause they can add the LS1 fan patch to your tune and you're good to go!!!!:biggrin:
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
They did my tune and I am waiting to hear back on if it will work on my 06, it says 08+ I6. But otherwise it seems the easiest way. Just hoping the temps will be ok, but I dont get extreme heat very often or tow much. Just sick of replacing the fan clutch.
 

Boricua SS

Member
Nov 20, 2011
3,080
Ohio
HARDTRAILZ said:
They did my tune and I am waiting to hear back on if it will work on my 06, it says 08+ I6. But otherwise it seems the easiest way. Just hoping the temps will be ok, but I dont get extreme heat very often or tow much. Just sick of replacing the fan clutch.

I know i dont have the I6, but i do have E-fans.. they've been in since April (remember the Mod thread where the hole was punched in my radiator lol) and my temps have been absolutely fine.. and my SS sees track time.. so its usually under half to full throttle.. now mind you, i have the 160 T-Stat as well... but my temps never reach over 200*.. I have LS-1 Fans.. and the first fan come on at 192*... again i know its not the I6, but i'd figured i could relate due to having efans...
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Perfect. Just the kinda real info I was hoping for. Our climate is similar, so it seems I should be good. Hopefully pcmforless responds soon
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
I guess I should ask, What is a fair price for LS1 fans? I seem to have read they may be the beter way to go.
 

Boricua SS

Member
Nov 20, 2011
3,080
Ohio
HARDTRAILZ said:
I guess I should ask, What is a fair price for LS1 fans? I seem to have read they may be the beter way to go.

Dorman has a replica set (p/n 620634) which is what i have as well, i got mine off of Amazon for $116 shipped... you shouldn't pay more then $120-$150 for brand new fans... I've seen actually LS-1 Fans on ebay for around the same price.. but those are used out of salvaged vehicles, etc...
 

TXBlazer

Member
Nov 21, 2011
533
Cypress, TEXAS USA
HARDTRAILZ said:
Perfect. Just the kinda real info I was hoping for. Our climate is similar, so it seems I should be good. Hopefully pcmforless responds soon

I have them on my 5.3 and will soon have them on her 4.2....My 5.3 always sits right at 200* and you have to remember I'm in TX so we just came off of almost 100 days of 100 plus weather....never ever went over 200* and I still have my stock Thermostat....soon to be 160*, mine have been installed for 2 years and not a hitch. I also got lucky and neither of my trucks 5.3 or 4.2 have the ElectroClutch fan in them....mine are both OEM clutch fans (GM changed the fans in late '07 I believe)

Boricua SS said:
Dorman has a replica set (p/n 620634) which is what i have as well, i got mine off of Amazon for $116 shipped... you shouldn't pay more then $120-$150 for brand new fans... I've seen actually LS-1 Fans on ebay for around the same price.. but those are used out of salvaged vehicles, etc...

Right on, on the pricing & P/n. I paid $75 for mine, they were new GM, OEM LT1 fans still in the OEM box, snagged them from another member on the Foggy Side!
 

Bartonmd

Member
Nov 20, 2011
545
Boricua SS said:
I know i dont have the I6, but i do have E-fans.. they've been in since April (remember the Mod thread where the hole was punched in my radiator lol) and my temps have been absolutely fine.. and my SS sees track time.. so its usually under half to full throttle.. now mind you, i have the 160 T-Stat as well... but my temps never reach over 200*.. I have LS-1 Fans.. and the first fan come on at 192*... again i know its not the I6, but i'd figured i could relate due to having efans...

Your track time and such does not depent on the fan, though... If you aren't off road, and aren't towing a trailer in the mountain switchbacks, you aren't going to experience any issues... The times that Roadie had overheating problems with the e-fans was 4LO, near WOT, for several minutes, going up the side of a mountain... Same thing for 20mph switchbacks with a 6500# trailer, in the desert...

Yeah, you make a lot more power, and create a lot more heat, but you're going fast while you're doing this, so the fans don't even come into play... It's all cooling air from the speed...

I think Kyle will be fine, mostly because while he does operate under the off-road, mountainous conditions, he's not doing it with any regularity in 115degF dry air, and more specifically, if he ever does go out there and get into that situation, he'll just have to stop and cool off... The issue is very likely that he goes through mud and such, that gets stuck on/in the fan, and causes it to be out of balance, and grenade on him... Being that the worst is, he'll have to stop and cool off IF he goes somewhere that it's a problem, the other thing to think about is that he's replaced the fan clutch more times than he's been out west, so it's probably the better way to go for him...

Mike
 

Boricua SS

Member
Nov 20, 2011
3,080
Ohio
DARKASS04EXT said:
what is the benefit of the LS fans on a basic daily driver? Ive got an 04 EXT 4.2 w/ 3.42 g80.

For me, I got a few more ponies and an extra mpg out of it.. on my tune/intake/efans I average 19.1 mpg highway..and for the summer, my SS is my daily driver..
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Apparently I would need the DIY kit from pcmforless and need to buy more stuff than just the fans, so back to the research.
 

janesy86

Member
Nov 21, 2011
41
Yea, for us with older (-08') rigs, you have to figure out a few things to make them work. Not just plug-n-play unfortunately, like the SS's and 08' 4.2
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
This is something I've looked into off an on. A friend of mine put a custom e-fan setup on a previous car of his so he might be able to help me out with setting up e-fans on my TB if/when my fan clutch dies (I'm at 150k now and it still works fine, but I don't know if it has been replaced before or not). As long as someone like PCMforless can kill the code for the fan on my 02 then I would be good. The fan setup I'd be looking at doing would be it's own separate system, the PCM would have nothing to do with it.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
I am still hoping to accomplish it, but will need some time to read old threads and figure out the simplest way to do it. I dont do well with wiring...
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
Too bad you aren't closer to me, I'd gladly help you out with the wiring side of things.
 

06Envoy

Member
Dec 4, 2011
419
I too have been thinking of doing efans...

So far in my research & slow moving plans, this is what I found...

I've got PCM4L to tune out the fans code on both the 5.3 and the 4.2.

I was going to buy THIS fan set. Which I'm glad to see is the same PN as posted here already. Not the cheapest though.
My questions for those are;
1) Do they just drop in the 5.3l Envoy bay?
2) Do they just drop in the 4.2 TB bay?
3) Are these what they call the LS1 fans?

As for controlling them on the 5.3 Envoy, I was going to get one of these kits from PCM4L. I have no clue if that will work on the 4.2 though. I'm still researching myself.

I'm so glad that I'm not doing the research on my own now....
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
The description on that harness says it allows the computer to control them. I don't think the 4.2's computer (except for maybe 08-09) can do that.
 

Matt

Member
Dec 2, 2011
4,019
Sparky said:
The description on that harness says it allows the computer to control them. I don't think the 4.2's computer (except for maybe 08-09) can do that.

:thumbsup: Absolutely right. 02-07 have to find a way to run the fans independantly...which sucks.
 

06Envoy

Member
Dec 4, 2011
419
Ok, so now I'm wondering if for the 4.2 I6 guys we couldn't just use a regular temp controller?
I did this on my Yukon.
It worked ok, and was programmed with the correct temps out of the box.
IIRC, it was a flex-a-lite temp controller. Stuck the probe through the fins of the rad.
Should work for the I6 too.

Here are some pics of my homemade efan install on the old Yukon.
picture.php


picture.php


picture.php



I'll dig around my old posts to see if I can find the part number...
 

ScarabEpic22

Member
Nov 20, 2011
728
06Envoy said:
I too have been thinking of doing efans...

So far in my research & slow moving plans, this is what I found...

I've got PCM4L to tune out the fans code on both the 5.3 and the 4.2.

I was going to buy THIS fan set. Which I'm glad to see is the same PN as posted here already. Not the cheapest though.
My questions for those are;
1) Do they just drop in the 5.3l Envoy bay?
2) Do they just drop in the 4.2 TB bay?
3) Are these what they call the LS1 fans?

As for controlling them on the 5.3 Envoy, I was going to get one of these kits from PCM4L. I have no clue if that will work on the 4.2 though. I'm still researching myself.

I'm so glad that I'm not doing the research on my own now....

No, go onto PCM4Less' website and order the I6 DIY Efans kit. Those are the correct fans though, unless you want to go big and buy the Spal fans setup PCM4Less has now.

Yes they will drop in no problem, the brackets are also correct to mount the LS1 fans properly.

Sparky said:
The description on that harness says it allows the computer to control them. I don't think the 4.2's computer (except for maybe 08-09) can do that.

Well...you can have the 02-05 P10 PCM control the fans but you need one of the elusive fan controllers Alvin made very few of because they had some issues with them.

Its honestly easier to kill the codes and diagnostic routine using EFILive (personally verified it work) or HPTuners (havent verified personally, but people say they've done it) and run a standalone fan controller. Flex-a-lite has a good one but its not cheap, around $100 for the controller alone (Flex-a-lite Variable Speed Efan controller/).

Matt said:
:thumbsup: Absolutely right. 02-07 have to find a way to run the fans independantly...which sucks.

Yep it does, but at least we've figured out how to do it! Two or so years ago people thought it was impossible on an I6...


There have been reports that with the smaller radiator the I6s have that efans dont cool properly under hot and humid conditions or with extreme conditions (towing heavy loads). Personally I have trans coolers on both of my TBs and I wouldnt have it any other way. Even with the fan clutch, brake duct trans cooler, and modified fan curve to command more lockup earlier I still saw trans temps over 200F while towing my 5000lbs boat (for those following, its ~1000lbs heavier than I previously thought over the past few years). I was towing in D, but even when I dropped to 3 the temps only dropped maybe 10F over the next 20 miles. It did take about 3 hours to get the temps this high in 75F weather, but when it was 99F I saw engine temps of 220F and trans temps of 210F. Not good. And this is with the fan clutch, havent installed my efans yet. Im thinking I might wait and buy the Spal fans setup PCM4Less offers and get a Simple Engineering 1.5" radiator to get the temps under control. Just my personal experience, and this was all done here in Washington. Not Texas or the south where its usually hot, these were some of the hottest days of the year up here. A little unnerving, Im scared to think what my trans temps were before I installed the trans cooler...


If anyone needs help with their efans let me know, this thread has pretty much all the info you need for an I6 to run efans now.
02-07 I6s need LS1 fans, PCM patched/DTCs killed, wiring harness (PCM4Less) and a variable speed controller (VSC). Set fan operation using the VSC so fans come on around 205F.
08-09 I6s need LS1 fans, ECM patched/DTCs killed, and wiring harness (PCM4Less). Set fan temps in the tune which needs to be a custom one that has some electric fan code swapped in (ie not a stock tune).
 

MichEnvoyGuy

Member
Dec 3, 2011
522
My original fan clutch was replaced in 2003 under warranty according to the service history.

(Knock on wood) It hasnt given me any problems aside from ticking at idle sometimes, which it has done the last 3 years.

My Envoy has 150,000 miles on it. When the fan clutch does finally give up the ghost, it seems to me that it would be cost prohibitive to drop a tune+e-fans+a controller+harness into it. What would the total project cost? $375+? :eek:

Wouldnt it just be more economical to buy a new fan clutch (~$100) with a good warranty? (sorry to be a buzzkill!)

Sorry, its the bookeeper in me that counts beans over here :undecided: I think the idea of e-fans is awesome but I couldnt justify putting the money into a higher mileage truck. I can barely keep up with the things that keep going bad on the truck, let alone modding it :biggrin:
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
MichEnvoyGuy said:
Wouldnt it just be more economical to buy a new fan clutch (~$100) with a good warranty? (sorry to be a buzzkill!)

Sure if you could find one for that. My $100 one was junk in a couple months and the replacement one in under a year. Not a fun job either, so e-fans even with my mileage is looking good.
 

MichEnvoyGuy

Member
Dec 3, 2011
522
HARDTRAILZ said:
Sure if you could find one for that. My $100 one was junk in a couple months and the replacement one in under a year. Not a fun job either, so e-fans even with my mileage is looking good.

Well, now, something with the fan clutches that you are buying and you just doesnt get along! :tongue:

There are members here that are on their original, or like me - close to the original fan clutch with high mileage. Not all of the replacement fan clutches fail on an annual basis, like yours do - you are just cursed...lol.

There is the much talked about Dorman, with a lifetime warranty on rockauto for $128, FWIW.
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
Had the stock original for 120K, then maybe 5 from cheap one, then about 10 from its replacement, They all still worked, but had bearing noise or death tick. The used stocker I put on after those started throwing a code a couple months and I went ahead and put the ticking one back on and it is tossing the death code now, so maybe I will try the dorman, but it really seems this could be done for around $200.
 

MichEnvoyGuy

Member
Dec 3, 2011
522
HARDTRAILZ said:
Had the stock original for 120K, then maybe 5 from cheap one, then about 10 from its replacement, They all still worked, but had bearing noise or death tick. The used stocker I put on after those started throwing a code a couple months and I went ahead and put the ticking one back on and it is tossing the death code now, so maybe I will try the dorman, but it really seems this could be done for around $200.

Hey, if it can be done for around $200 then I think thats a lot better. I have a 2002, so it sounds like I would need a manual cooling fan controller $30, of course the tune $150+ shipping, the fans $100, and probably some brackets and miscellaneous hardware $25.

Everybody has their priorities. At 150,000 miles and a pretty rusty frame, I dont know if I can justify any mods at this point.
 

ScarabEpic22

Member
Nov 20, 2011
728
To do efans correctly (IMHO), you need a set of Dorman LS1 fans (~$120 off Amazon), Flex-a-lite Fan controller ($100 off SummitRacing), and a tune ($109-200 depending on vendor). Thats a minimum of ~$330 and a max of ~$420. If you want to buy a pre-fabbed harness, then PCM4Less' harness is $150. You'll have to hack it up anyway to run the Flex-a-Lite controller, but it will make your life easier. All depends on how much DIY you want to do.

Im tempted to buy a set of Spal fans for the SS and a Flex-a-lite controller + PCM4Less harness for my 02 then use the LS1 fans I have now on the 02 and drop the Spals on my SS. Already have the harness, just not sure they'll move enough air when its 100F outside while towing 5000lbs up a grade for 10mi. Yep, Ive got 2 of these lovely grades on my drive from Spokane to Seattle, not fun to tow them in the summer.
 

07Blazerman

Member
Dec 4, 2011
102
HARDTRAILZ said:
I am dealing with my fan clutch dying for the third time and thinking or switching over to E-fans. Found some good info, but looking for any other opinions, ideas, or thoughts to help my decision.

Thinking LT1 fans since they are fairly easy to get.

How about the '08 and up fan clutch and getting the codes deleted by pcmforless? Fan clutch is half the price and a non viscous unit.
 

jimmyjam

Member
Nov 18, 2011
1,634
if you tow then why are you going to do efans? i've got 2 12" spals on a 2" ron davis radiator and they tell you its not recommended for towing

and as far as dormans go, i had an issue with those fans and guess what, the replacement motors for OEM sets don't work with the dorman fan blades. so if one motor goes on you, you have to junk the whole kit and kaboodle. you are better off hitting the u-pull-it for some OEM fans IMO
 

HARDTRAILZ

Original poster
Moderator
Nov 18, 2011
49,665
07Blazerman said:
How about the '08 and up fan clutch and getting the codes deleted by pcmforless? Fan clutch is half the price and a non viscous unit.

Need to research this idea. Had not really considered it. Thanks
 

Sparky

Member
Dec 4, 2011
12,927
Hm I wonder if there is a motor (dual speed preferably) that you could attach the stock fan blades to. Might be better than a pair of smaller, weaker fans that don't cover near as much radiator area :undecided:
 

Hatchet

Member
Nov 21, 2011
2,405
mite i add Kyle to do what i did with my e-fans... hook it to a 3 way switch... so you can turn it off when ur going through water or on when u want it. i have mine set up as: On - Off - Computer controlled
 

jimmyjam

Member
Nov 18, 2011
1,634
Sparky said:
Hm I wonder if there is a motor (dual speed preferably) that you could attach the stock fan blades to. Might be better than a pair of smaller, weaker fans that don't cover near as much radiator area :undecided:
you mean the stock clutch fan? that would require a LARGE motor based on the blade pitch and size
my spal fans draw near 40a a piece on startup, (somewhere in the 70a neighborhood total) i don't know how much larger a motor you would be willing to use

dual speed with dual fans is possible, i'm running them in my truck. this is the way that ls1 fans run in the cars they came with (gtos, camaros, etc)
three relays, two of them switch the fans between being wired in series (low speed) and parallel (hi speed)
 

limequat

Member
Dec 8, 2011
520
Ok, here's the wiring diagram for the 2006-2007 TBs. I've tested this on 2006, it would have to be tested for 2002-2005.
The key is to use both the existing clutch solenoid relay AND a high current relay for the fan(s). The PCM doesn't have enough oomph to drive a high current relay and the stock relay doesn't have enough oooph to drive an eFan. I don't have a TB, so I can't say where to pull the 12V for the fan, but a robust solution could come right off the battery with heavy gauge wire and a dedicated fuse.

If interested go to limeswap.com. I'll change your existing clutch PWM output to a standard on/off output. You decide the on/off temps.


2006+tb+eFan.gif
 

High Voltage

Member
Nov 18, 2011
462
Sorry Kyle for jumping in your thread with a question.
I am woundering if the e fans would help my heat problem too?
I am running higher than normal trans and engine temps in the heat of the summer trying to push my 35's down the road. I know some of it is because of the body lift and steel bumper + rad skid.
 

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