Do You Think This Car Is a Good Deal?

[Denali n DOO]

We haven't had a second car since I gave the company car back in Jan. Time to get a car. I didn't want a new car with payments for 6 years and I didn't want to be locked into a lease. I thought about a good used $4000-$5000 car for now. My friend dicided he wants to sell his car and wanted me to detail it for him so he'd get top dollar. I detailed it for exchange of some beers . I've had a couple days now to look it over completly and I'm liking it. It's a 2003 Grand Prix GT. has 141000kms (88000miles). It has seen 2 winters prior to him buying it. He has always been stored for the winters and oil sprayed every year since he's had it. It has had oil changes every 5000km with Lucas Synthetic Oil. The transmission was serviced last year with new fluid and a solenoid it had a shift issue? All rotors (powder coated hub piece) and pads are new. No rust at all on the car, like new underneath and in engine bay, door jambs etc. The paint on the hood is messed up and needs repainting, he put the cover on it once when storing and the hood was hot, something happed to the paint on the hood because of that. The rest of the paint is nice. It needs tires, bottom door trim re attached driver side a clip is broke, small door ding, rear door small window triangle rubbers are shot on both sides, rear driver side window doesnt work, no power? He said he was gonna sell for $6000, I can have it for $5000. What do you think I should offer? What should I know about a 2003 Grand Prix as far as reliability?

 

[03TB93]

personally ive never been a big fan of pontiac. Ive never know anyone whos had one but ive also never heard anything good or bad about them.. When i see them around town there nice cars but they always seen like there is moisture in the taillight. This to me just makes me wonder about the way the rest of the car is built, and also i know pontiac went out of business which is another not so good sign.. This is just my 2 cents tho. They LOOK like nice cars but im not sure about qualitly. 5 grand seems alittle hight as well but again, Im not sure what they go for or the ratings on them these are just things to keep in the back of your head. Good luck with the decision man Look up the rating of these cars and Kelly blue book value and than go from there. visually looks nice tho for sure
-Dan

 

[Bub]

A N/A 3800 is always a good idea. My girl has a 93 Regal she treats like shit but it has 195,000 on it and never skips a beat. Do it

 

[fletch09]

looks nice. leave the hood alone and tell everyone it's a special carbon fiber hood.
my wife had 2 grand am's (1996 & 2000) w/ the 3400 engine. iv'e heard that mechanics call them Grand Damn's
because they are hard to work on.
IIRC both had head gasket problems. the 2000 replaced it twice in 110,000 mi that we had it.
first time was under warranty.
have not had any experience w/ the 3800's though.

 

[Lima Tango]

That sounds a touch pricey to me. With the paint, mechanical, and tire issues listed, I wouldn't pay more than $4k. You're going to be more than a grand into it just getting it into good condition and it doesn't even book for $6k. The 3800 is a great engine, I have had two and they are solid and powerful, though not that efficient on gas. Expect 20-22mpg combined.

The most common issue i've seen with this and similar pontiac models is weird little things going wrong - power windows, random gauges, HVAC switches, things like that. It's usually nothing big, but sometimes little things like a window motor can get expensive. If you're willing to put up with the occasional problem like that, the actual drivetrain should treat you right.

 

[northcreek]

FWIW...We had a Bonneville with the 3800 and it was one of the best cars that we have ever had.From what Iam seeing the price seems fair too.The fact that you know the guy is a bonus when buying a used car.Also parts for these cars are everywhere.For $5K I would go for it....Mike.

 

[D0M0]

Hey! thats a nice ride!

Im pretty familiar with the 3.8. my last car was an 2001 impala (same engine) I would say between $4k fair condition and $5.5k on the high end. especially if thats damage on the hood that i see.
The most major issue with the 3.8 is that the upper (and sometimes lower) intake gaskets fail. At the dealership it can range from $800 to $1300 for the repair. They usually use a crappy OEM gasket to repair, which will fail again. Doman makes a replacement for it that is more of a permenate fix. usually when your in there, just best to replace both. Other than that, like the other guy said, just little weird stuff like window switches (very easy fix, contacts usually has to just be cleaned) or gages may go out.

other than that, if the tranny goes, there is a guy who does a great job on them.

here is the site that i was on. they are with impalas but have plenty of info on the 3.8 News - NAIOA and the one for grand prix specificall GPONA - Grand Prixs of North America

Hope it helps!

 

[jrSS]

I had the nat. aspirated 3.8 and the supercharged gtp. I loved my grand prix. Sound kinda cool for a v6 too. They are great engines. And the best way to take oil filter off is to take passenger wheel off..my .02

 

[Boricua SS]

ahhhh.. something tells me i know a little bit about this car... i mean after all, i have a 2001 grand prix gt as my daily driver thats been in our family since 2001, and my brother had a '98 grand prix GTP and then my first car was a '93 grand prix

but that price is actually about right... i acquired my moms car last year with 124,xxx miles on it and the dealership was going to give her $4500 on trade in... kbb for private seller was over $6000.. and this is an '01... you have an '03 w/fewer miles and slightly modded (i see the LED tails, looks like Black Clear front lenses, etc...)... so $6,000 (5,000 your price) is a good deal if you ask me, maybe shoot him an offer of $4500 and see if he bites... the 3800 series motor is one of the best damn motors GM put in there cars... common things to look for... first and foremost is the valve cover gaskets... the '97-'03 models had a recall for some of the cars due to a bad gasket leaking oil on a plug and causing fires.. my gaskets leak, but the recall didn't pertain to my GP... secondly is the tranny solenoid that you talk of... which was already replaced, so you should be good there... here is a link to a forum i belong to for my Grand Prix that will better list and explain things for you...

The 97-03 W-body buyers guide / Common problems

hope this helps bro i say go for it.. you'll love the GP GT!!! i love mine!!!

 

[Denali n DOO]

ahhhh.. something tells me i know a little bit about this car... i mean after all, i have a 2001 grand prix gt as my daily driver thats been in our family since 2001, and my brother had a '98 grand prix GTP and then my first car was a '93 grand prix


but that price is actually about right... i acquired my moms car last year with 124,xxx miles on it and the dealership was going to give her $4500 on trade in... kbb for private seller was over $6000.. and this is an '01... you have an '03 w/fewer miles and slightly modded (i see the LED tails, looks like Black Clear front lenses, etc...)... so $6,000 (5,000 your price) is a good deal if you ask me, maybe shoot him an offer of $4500 and see if he bites... the 3800 series motor is one of the best damn motors GM put in there cars... common things to look for... first and foremost is the valve cover gaskets... the '97-'03 models had a recall for some of the cars due to a bad gasket leaking oil on a plug and causing fires.. my gaskets leak, but the recall didn't pertain to my GP... secondly is the tranny solenoid that you talk of... which was already replaced, so you should be good there... here is a link to a forum i belong to for my Grand Prix that will better list and explain things for you...

The 97-03 W-body buyers guide / Common problems

hope this helps bro i say go for it.. you'll love the GP GT!!! i love mine!!!

Hi guys, thanks for all the input!!! The driveway does look good with this and the Voy in it! Sounds like the motor is pretty reliable from what most of you are saying. It also had new plugs and wires and a catalytic convertor last year too! I told him for some more beers I could wax it too ! So I kept it for another day. Heres a few pics after waxing. The hood really sucks ...

 

[Boricua SS]

i think its a no brainer here...

that car is clean bro... with the exception of the hood... DOOO ITTTT!!!

 

[Sparky]

The 3800 is usually a good engine, just treat it right, keep up with oil changes, etc... Which sounds like that has happened so you should be good there. Some had intake manifold cracks develop because the thing is plastic but whatever. Not a bad fix.

Anyway, there is a small aftermarket for the 3800. You could cam it, or you could get the supercharger for it, or...

 

[Denali n DOO]

Alright so after its been sitting here a couple weeks I thought I'd take a closer look and decide what I'm doing, buying it or not. I'm thinking not. I pulled the engine cover off and noticed a couple things I didn't like. Where upper rad hose goes into engine had bright green crap around it. I took the rad cap off and saw the brightest glow in the dark green I've ever seen. He flushed system but did not put Dex Cool in it, alot of brown crap in there too. I also noticed it leaking oil just above the pully. This isn't good is it? Of course I see all this before I take the Envoy to the dealer to explain the oil in the coolant. Oh boy what a day of discovery this is.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

Isnt the -good for anything- coolant, that is a replacement for dexcool green? It could very likely be that.

 

[D0M0]

Yeah that looks like it needs a new thermostat. And if you see brown floating around, the intake gaskets are prolly failing.

Once those are fixed, its a great engine. if you do the work yourself, its a fairly cheap repair.

 

[Voymom]

That sounds a touch pricey to me. With the paint, mechanical, and tire issues listed, I wouldn't pay more than $4k. You're going to be more than a grand into it just getting it into good condition and it doesn't even book for $6k. The 3800 is a great engine, I have had two and they are solid and powerful, though not that efficient on gas. Expect 20-22mpg combined.

The most common issue i've seen with this and similar pontiac models is weird little things going wrong - power windows, random gauges, HVAC switches, things like that. It's usually nothing big, but sometimes little things like a window motor can get expensive. If you're willing to put up with the occasional problem like that, the actual drivetrain should treat you right.

He drives a GMT....I don't think he would have an issue with "little things" constantly going wrong

 

[Jkust]

I had the Supercharged Bonneville version with the series II 3.8 of that for several years. I didn't spend a dime on anything. The only bummer was the CCR struts went out and I let them be since they were discontinued and you had to convert and put in standard non computer controlled ones. Here's what I'll say. I think even 5k is a bit pricey and I wouldn't dream of owning a 3.8 without the supercharger. It is an amazing fast car with the supercharger and can be easily modded to perform even better. I liked that Bonneville so much I wouldn't mind another. It was old school technology competing with the much more modern foreign cars. I would say it came as close as I have heard to a 6 cylinder sounding like a v8. The only thing I can really complain about was the turning radius was horrible. Here's some pictures from when I sold it when it hit about 100,000 miles. You can even see our first Rainier in the garage in the picture that is supposed to show the heads up display but isn't showing. When I sold it the first guy to see it bought it and traveled 9 hours and couldn't believe how nice it was and that there are honest people on Craigslist. It was on on Craigslist about an hour when this guy called and came out and bought it.

 

[Denali n DOO]

I had the Supercharged Bonneville version with the series II 3.8 of that for several years. I didn't spend a dime on anything. The only bummer was the CCR struts went out and I let them be since they were discontinued and you had to convert and put in standard non computer controlled ones. Here's what I'll say. I think even 5k is a bit pricey and I wouldn't dream of owning a 3.8 without the supercharger. It is an amazing fast car with the supercharger and can be easily modded to perform even better. I liked that Bonneville so much I wouldn't mind another. It was old school technology competing with the much more modern foreign cars. I would say it came as close as I have heard to a 6 cylinder sounding like a v8. The only thing I can really complain about was the turning radius was horrible. Here's some pictures from when I sold it when it hit about 100,000 miles. You can even see our first Rainier in the garage in the picture that is supposed to show the heads up display but isn't showing. When I sold it the first guy to see it bought it and traveled 9 hours and couldn't believe how nice it was and that there are honest people on Craigslist. It was on on Craigslist about an hour when this guy called and came out and bought it.

Thats a good looking car! Holy buttons on the console batman! Thats the first time I've seen the inside of a Bonneville and it sure looks nice, HUD as well! So the GTP 3.8 would be a better motor to have than a plain 3.8? I'm not in too much of a rush to buy yet so I'll keep doing some homework. I like the body and the no rust on this car but if I gotta start doing thermostat, intake gasket and rad flushing then the price has to come down. Are intake gaskets more common to fail than a head gasket on the 3.8's. That crap in the rad don't look to good tho.

 

[McGMT]

Thats a good looking car! Holy buttons on the console batman! Thats the first time I've seen the inside of a Bonneville and it sure looks nice, HUD as well! So the GTP 3.8 would be a better motor to have than a plain 3.8? I'm not in too much of a rush to buy yet so I'll keep doing some homework. I like the body and the no rust on this car but if I gotta start doing thermostat, intake gasket and rad flushing then the price has to come down. Are intake gaskets more common to fail than a head gasket on the 3.8's. That crap in the rad don't look to good tho.

SO 3.8's are strong motors to begin with except when they switched over to the plastic intakes. But that is what makes the charged one better, they are MONSTERS and with the supercharger the plastic intake goes bye bye and they are reliable as hell.

And one note, I notice how people always say this brand is better than this and this one is junk. Well, A Bonneville is a Grand Prix is a Regal.......... A Sunfire is a Cavalier..... The only difference between them is appearance and some small option changes. Everything is made at the same place by the same people from the same materials... That drives me nuts...

 

[Jkust]

Thats a good looking car! Holy buttons on the console batman! Thats the first time I've seen the inside of a Bonneville and it sure looks nice, HUD as well! So the GTP 3.8 would be a better motor to have than a plain 3.8? I'm not in too much of a rush to buy yet so I'll keep doing some homework. I like the body and the no rust on this car but if I gotta start doing thermostat, intake gasket and rad flushing then the price has to come down. Are intake gaskets more common to fail than a head gasket on the 3.8's. That crap in the rad don't look to good tho.

Yep, thanks, my Bonneville had every optional piece of equipment and I really loved it. I totally babied it there wasn't a spec of rust on the frame or anywhere and I almost never ever parked next to another car unless I absoulte had to. I'd walk blocks in order to avoid busy parking lots. It held up really well which is more than I can say for a lot of my cars bodies. The Supercharged 3.8 is a large improvement in HP but especially torque over the naturally aspirated 3.8. You could gas it and it never stopped pulling hard. A standard pass of the guy in front of you had you going over 100mph without even trying. It was scary fast. The intake gasket was the achilies heal of the engine and was blamed on the dexcool. Any one of these you find now would surely have had the replacment put in. At the time I really liked the sporty appearance of the Bonneville and especially the seats and dash. It was really just a neat car but got 20 3/4 mpg per mixed use tank, never any better but when you have one you tend to have a heavy foot. Probably was the only car I've ever owned that is destined to be a classic.
If you got a high mile supercharged version, you can actually do a tune up on the supercharger which isn't a big diy job. There are sights dedicated to the Bonneville just like the 360's.

Funny thing I actually sold it for 5,000 dollars and it was 12 years old. My wife laughed and said there's no way anybody would pay that much and even facebook posted how rediculous the price was. Like I said it sold instantly to a guy who had the same car exact the stripped down basic model and he had 300,000 miles on it and to him 98,000 miles on mine was just getting broken in. That is one of those cars you wished you kept and stored if nothing else. I think it was great work on GM's part.

 

[McGMT]

Yep, thanks, my Bonneville had every optional piece of equipment and I really loved it. I totally babied it there wasn't a spec of rust on the frame or anywhere and I almost never ever parked next to another car unless I absoulte had to. I'd walk blocks in order to avoid busy parking lots. It held up really well which is more than I can say for a lot of my cars bodies. The Supercharged 3.8 is a large improvement in HP but especially torque over the naturally aspirated 3.8. You could gas it and it never stopped pulling hard. A standard pass of the guy in front of you had you going over 100mph without even trying. It was scary fast. The intake gasket was the achilies heal of the engine and was blamed on the dexcool. Any one of these you find now would surely have had the replacment put in. At the time I really liked the sporty appearance of the Bonneville and especially the seats and dash. It was really just a neat car but got 20 3/4 mpg per mixed use tank, never any better but when you have one you tend to have a heavy foot. Probably was the only car I've ever owned that is destined to be a classic.
If you got a high mile supercharged version, you can actually do a tune up on the supercharger which isn't a big diy job. There are sights dedicated to the Bonneville just like the 360's.

Funny thing I actually sold it for 5,000 dollars and it was 12 years old. My wife laughed and said there's no way anybody would pay that much and even facebook posted how rediculous the price was. Like I said it sold instantly to a guy who had the same car exact the stripped down basic model and he had 300,000 miles on it and to him 98,000 miles on mine was just getting broken in. That is one of those cars you wished you kept and stored if nothing else. I think it was great work on GM's part.

I got rid of our 98 Buick Regal GS this spring when we bought the TB. It was a SC 3.8 had 238,000 miles on it, never had a problem with it the last 85,000 miles. Before that all I did was a new intake gasket and HVAC parts. Had to install some new resistors in the instrument cluster and the HVAC controls to make the displays light up again but it was a VERY reliable car and had power to spare...

Sold it in april this year with 238k on the clock and no paint on the hood for 1800 bucks... muh haha

 

[Jkust]

I got rid of our 98 Buick Regal GS this spring when we bought the TB. It was a SC 3.8 had 238,000 miles on it, never had a problem with it the last 85,000 miles. Before that all I did was a new intake gasket and HVAC parts. Had to install some new resistors in the instrument cluster and the HVAC controls to make the displays light up again but it was a VERY reliable car and had power to spare...

Sold it in april this year with 238k on the clock and no paint on the hood for 1800 bucks... muh haha

Ok we've got to stop with the nostalgia or I'm going to pull open craigs list and start looking. I actually really liked the Buick Riviera that got the supercharged 3.8 as well. I think the first car I ever saw HID's on was a late 1990's riv and I've felt inadequate eversince until the 9-7 had them.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot the huge downside of the supercharged engine is that it requires premium gas. I had it when gas hit 4 bucks a gallon for 87 and that sucked to buy 92.

 

[northcreek]

Any signs of coolant in the oil? as others have said the plastic intake manifold(plenum) is usually the culprit.There is a water passage that runs through it and over time it gives out.I replaced the one on my old Bonneville but, not before pulling the heads because I was sure that it was a head gasket....NOT!!
It's not a bad job to do(plenum) and I found a cheap one on Ebay.That crap in the radiator may be block sealer which the current owner "failed" to mention....Mike.

 

[Jkust]

Any signs of coolant in the oil? as others have said the plastic intake manifold(plenum) is usually the culprit.There is a water passage that runs through it and over time it gives out.I replaced the one on my old Bonneville but, not before pulling the heads because I was sure that it was a head gasket....NOT!!
It's not a bad job to do(plenum) and I found a cheap one on Ebay.That crap in the radiator may be block sealer which the current owner "failed" to mention....Mike.

If there's coolant in the oil, it's likely already too late.

 

[McGMT]

If there's coolant in the oil, it's likely already too late.

Most of the time those cracked intakes arent fixed or diagnosed until they go to hit the key and it acts like it is seized up... I have seen people junk perfectly fine vehicles because they thought the motor locked up, shame that all they had to do was suck out the coolant thru the sparkplug holes and throw on a new intake... Ignorance is bliss I guess....

That oil leak in the valley there is usually seepage from the valley seal getting old or the spots on each end of the flat rubber seal where RTV sealant is used... No big deal doesn't really LEAK so much as seeps...

 

[Sparky]

FWIW the brown in the radiator could also be caused by old dexcool mixed with green stuff turned into goo. I've seen that before. If I were to get that car I'd flush the whole system out completely and refill with dexcool the proper way. Thermostat is no big deal, but that residue could have been from when they burped the system - that is a bleeder screw there that you can use to get the last bit of air out of the system but naturally you'll get a coolant spurt when you do that.

As far as the oil leak, well, it's hard to say where it could be coming from since it is cruddy down there.

 

[Short Bus]

How about a Fiero with the 3.8S/C

[video=youtube_share;CBFhcdPaKHw]http://youtu.be/CBFhcdPaKHw[/video]

 

[northcreek]

Most of the time those cracked intakes arent fixed or diagnosed until they go to hit the key and it acts like it is seized up... I have seen people junk perfectly fine vehicles because they thought the motor locked up, shame that all they had to do was suck out the coolant thru the sparkplug holes and throw on a new intake... Ignorance is bliss I guess.......

Yes!..I forgot to mention the seized thing,that was the case with mine.That AF had gotten into everything.After the replacement plenum I got many trouble free years out of the Bonny.This was a 1995 3.8 and I have to believe that at some point they changed the design of the plenum because it was so prone to failure....Mike.

 

[TollKeeper]

The 3.8 is probably one of the top 3 best V-6 engines to ever come out of GM.. EVER. The 3x00 60* v6, the 3x00 90*v6, and the good old 4.3.

With that said, that intake plenums do not look like they have ever been touched. And that florescent green stuff you are seeing makes me think that someone put a dye into the anti-freeze so see where it was going. in other words, it looks like its going to need plenum gaskets. The good side is that there is not much of anything on these cars that is expensive to fix. 30 dollar water pump, 100 dollar alternator, 30 dollar power steering pump. And being that the Grand Prix is a Impala is a Monte Carlo is a Regal is a Century is a intrique... Parts are very plentiful in the salvage yards.

You didnt post pics of the interior, so I cant tell if its a GT1 or a GT2.

There is a HUGE following for those cars, and those engines. Supercharger kits, Turbo kits, auto cross kits, 5 speed kits... And a whole host of other things. Or you could just leave it be, and drive it for YEARS. And more than likely never have a problem with it.

They are great cars, and people of the W-body forums I am a member of have ALOT of miles in these cars. There was a member who went off list last year after he junked his 98 GTP. It wasnt worth repairing with 497k miles on it.

That is a Gen 3 GP, I have a Gen 2 GP, Gen 4 was the last model they ever made... I think the Gen 3's look the best, followed by 2. Gen 1 is the rear wheel drive models.

Price seems to be WAY high. I would pay no more than 3000 knowing its going to need a intake gasket kit.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

May actually be picking up a 2002 Impala LS Sport. 150K but cleaner than most I looked at with half the miles. Leather is perfect, everything works, no rust, motor seems clean and everything is tight. $3500 seems pretty fair to me.

 

[Jkust]

I'm not seeing 150k miles of use on that Impala. I'd say that is a good choice for that kind of money.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

My buddy took it in trade at his dealership and is holding it until I get back for another look, but could not find anything wrong before. Be a nice little upgrade from the base model Eclipse with not a big hit in mpg. 28 vs 30.

 

[D0M0]

Interesting! Has the SS Appearance package!

Yeah $3,500 sounds like a good deal

 

[C-ya]

We (well, the wife) have an '04 Impala. We bought it in January of '06 with 24K on the odo. It has the 3.8, which I love, altho the 3.5 that I drove once as a rental seemed to have more get-up and go. So far, I have changed the thermostat on ours, done a tranny fluid and filter change, routine oil changes and drove it. We are now at 122K. I feel the 3.8 is, as was stated above, one of THE best motors GM made. It would be a toss-up for me to say which is better, the 3.8 or the 4.3 - I just sold my '98 GMC C1500 with a 4.3 with 242K on it, and she wasn't ready to quit yet.

I have noticed on all of the "current" GM V engines (mid-'90's to now), the intake manifold gaskets are prone to failure. I replaced the ones in my truck, my buddy's '98 K2500 5.7, and a few other vehicles to help friends. The plastic/rubber combo just doesn't cut it for the long-term. Easy job to fix, tho.

To Denali about the GT, I think if you can get the price down a bit, I'd get that Poncho.

To Hardtrailz, that looks like a sweet, clean Impala. We got leather, too, because it is easier to clean when you have kids.

 

[Sparky]

I'd jump on it, and the first thing I'd do is put a black tail panel on it again. I'm not a fan of how those look with the body colored rear panel like that, but that's just IMO. Then I'd retrofit projectors for the headlights.


I might also get some LED tails like these
00 05 Chevy Impala LED Red Clear Tail Lights Left Right Side Rear Lamps Assembly | eBay
Maybe tint the tail panel a bit more to blend it in a little better.

But that's just me

 

[jrSS]

I like the body colored panel.

 

[Short Bus]

I like the body colored panel.

IMO The body colored panel looks better.

 

[willn513]

I like the body colored panel.

+1 for the body colored panel. Looks sweet.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

its in my driveway. Checking her out on the commute to work. Seems great as of now. Only mods it will get is led interior and tinted windows. Maybe wheels when the tires wear out.

 

[jrSS]

I need me a descent DD for my daily work commute.