So long Envoy. Its been good knowing ya.

[CaptainXL]

So its time to trade in the 2005 GMC Envoy XL. Looking to get a 2005-2006 Chevy Tahoe 4x4. Does anyone know what to look for as far as common problems and such? The one we looked at today has173K on it but just one owner and it is very clean with leather seats. The trans and engine are very smooth. Noticed a slight rough idle when the ac is on. Rpms were steady, cruise works as expected. Has auto everything. Tows 7700 lbs which is the reason for us to move. Any info is appreciated. Thanks.

 

[ItsOnVoy]

That is quite a bit of miles, are you planing to keep it long or just for the time being?

 

[CaptainXL]

That is quite a bit of miles, are you planing to keep it long or just for the time being?

Well there are others we are looking at. Trying to find a diamond in the rough sort of speak. Not neccessarily gonna get this one. Planning to keep until dead. Aside from the expected maintenance items...its hidden corrosion that mainly catches my eye. Being in the north.

 

[gmcman]

Man.......Capt Tahoe just doesn't roll of the tongue as well.

I would look south and either have it trucked or just go pick it up, make it a good weekend trip if corrosion was an issue. What's your budget? What year(s) were the good DOD engines?

 

[CaptainXL]

Well the deal is this. The Tahoe idea is nice but on the backburner for a bit. Thinking a truck would be better. Want etc ( electronic throttle control). Want 8000 lb towing capacity. Want 5.3 or 6.0 liter engine. Also 10 more hp for 2005 onward till 2007. Cant afford 2006 or 2007. So only searching 2005's which seems to be the sweet point for me and my budget.

Does anyone know if the 6.0 has afm? Called DOD as well. Not sure which years were better for DOD. Oh! Also would like Onstar gen 4 which starts in the 2005 models. So only searching for a 2005 Chevy or GMC 1500 crew cab. They are around 13-16k dollars.

Doing a a crapload of research on 1500 and 2500 trucks right now if you havnt quessed thusfar.

Would it be better for me and my 4 person family if I get the 6.0 or the 5.3 liter if I am towing 7700 lb trailer? Towing capacities are all over the board ranging from 7500 all the way up to 9900 with the 6.0 in the GMC Denali. The 6.0 concerns me about gas mileage.

Looked at a Chevy 2500 4x4 crew cab today with a 8.1 liter. Practically shat my pants to learn it gets 9mpg. So thats out of the question. The 2500 (3/4 ton) pickups inspire much confidence. They feel sturdy.

Hopefully my name will become CaptainCrew! Lol. I volunteer to become ambasador/mod of the 3/4 ton pickups if no one has claimed that title yet for this forum.Thanks for the help.

 

[Playsinsnow]

Captain, obviously you know gear ratios are a huge factor in towing capacity. That being said, I was looking up a few things and came across this


Towing Capabilities - 5.3L V8 Silverado Z71 1500 vs 6.2L V8 Yukon Denali | Automotive | Forums | TexAgs

I'd go with the big motor if it is just a tow vehicle. Too many personal variables that are unknown to say one over the other...

 

[CaptainXL]

I'd go with the big motor if it is just a tow vehicle. Too many personal variables that are unknown to say one over the other...

I agree Mr. Play. We tow maybe 4 time a year at 2000 miles a year. So 6.0 it is. So now my 1500 half ton choices have become much narrower. Seriously thinking about a Denali 1500 crew with the 6.0 and 4.10 gears or the 2500 crew with the same. Guess I gotta pay if I wanna play. Pay in gas that is.

Edit. Well I read that link and they seem to think that if you tow very little then the 5.3 will be fine. Which was my thought as well. Perhaps I will stick with the 5.3. Will definitely get 3.75 or 4.1 gears though.

 

[Playsinsnow]

GMCman had a great suggestion by expanding your search south. I can't believe how cheap some are. Sometimes 4x4's are easy to come by because no one NEEDs it down there, lol. I'd skip the 3/4ton unless you find a steal. Either motor though will be a fine choice! Haven't seen the ratings for a 5.3l 4.10 geared setup though. Might be easier to find?

 

[CaptainXL]

Having a hard time believing dealers down south would drop their prices much below nada. They should be similar. But I will investigate.

Oh and to set the record straight...it is just a tow vehicle. Maybe 8000 miles would be put on it in a year.

So any ideas please let me know. Go with the 2500 crew with the 8.1??? Yeah baby. Lol. It's tempting. Ugh. Im conflicted. My brain tells me to be smart and not overspend, yet it also says to be safe and tow with confidence. Lol

 

[Playsinsnow]

If I were getting strictly a tow vehicle, a super-duty would be very high on that list.

It instills confidence. That or a Toy.... Out west, it seems almost everyone with a horse or travel trailer has one. Never spoke to someone who wasn't impressed. Only notice retirees in GM's

 

[CaptainXL]

Go with a Ford? You friggin traitorous pice of garbage. Lol j/k. But seriously I have given it thought.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

NADA is a joke. I have never paid close to that.

 

[Sparky]

For a tow vehicle get a 2500HD with Duramax with the Allison and you're good to go Better mpg while doing it also vs a gasser. I know a guy with a 2500HD that after some tune tweaking can get 24mpg highway if he isn't towing which makes me mad lol.

I wouldn't want a SuperPukey with a PowerJoke.

 

[djthumper]

I would go with Sparky on what he said.

I can't believe the prices you quoted that you are seeing around Grand Rapids. We are below that out here, it must be what the local market is doing.

 

[stormsurge]

I would go with sparky on this one. My brother tried the 5.3 with his camper up to Yellowstone. The first thing he did when he got back was trade it in on a duramax and he loves it. They where 2010's though. I had a 1999 z71 with a 5.3 that pulled real nice. I have a friend with a 2003 2500 with the 6.0 he likes but all he tows is his old chevelle drag car. The fords we had at work pulled good but they broke down a lot. Head gaskets went bad.

 

[gmcman]

Using it for 8K a year is somewhat generous, about half of a normal driver. The 5.3 is a decent motor, but the 6.0 is just so much better.

The 8.1 is an absolute beast, dismal MPG's but it's an awesome towing motor.

Nothing wrong going to the dark side for a tow vehicle, you may find a nice 2003 F250 SD or maybe even an Excursion. The 2003 was the last year I believe the 7.3 was in the F-series.... I would avoid the 6.0 PSD like the plague, JMO.

An 8.1 Suburban is #2 to the Excursion if I wanted to start a bar fight....lol. But it's a close #2.

The Dmax,Allison you are going to pay for so what's your budget? I wish the Cummins was in an SUV.

 

[gmcman]

2006 Suburban 2500 LT w/ 8.1 Liter

 

[CaptainXL]

Right. So my budget is $15,000 or less. Would prefer being around $10,000.

Looking all over the state atm. The car seats are what is making my search difficult. Need crew cab. But hey got to have comfort for the kids now and when they grow up. Extended cabs are just too cramped and a car seat will not fit facing rearward.

Here is what I need:

2000-2006 Chevy Silverado or GMC Sierra K2500
Under 150K miles.
Crew Cab
Diesel would be preferred but the wife thinks they are loud and smells. But still says I can get one.

I drove a few trucks today...

1. 2005 GMC Sierra Denali ($16,999)- loaded of course. Has the 6.0, AWD and GT5 4.10 gears. Torque and HP galore on this ride. Was fun but we didn't care for it. It was a mess with leaking doors, torn leather seats and worn steering components. Just didn't want the extra bells and whistles. But would be a good fixer upper. 135k miles.

2. 2006 Chevy Silverado 2500 Crew 4x4 ($13,995). 6.0and GT5 4.10 gears. Nice ride but the engine seemed rough and the steering was loose and had previously smoked the rear differential. All the fluid came out and ruined the bearings and axle seals. It was repaired and seems fine. The steering was loose as if the steering column wasn't tightened. later found out that the thing had some steering shaft R&R work. Guess they didn't put it back together right. Overall not a bad truck. Gonna get an inspection on this one at the dealer. 120k miles.

3. Same config as #2 but had the 6.6 diesel. Having the turbo is cool and the quick shifts at wot get it on the highway in a hurry. A quick truck. Might go with this as well. It has 135k miles.

I did some calculations this evening and came to the conclusion that I need a serious rig towing our 35ft trailer. The total trailer weight is 8500 lbs. Also there seems to be very few 6.0 liter half tons with 4.10 gears. And after some thought decided to just stick with the 3/4 ton pickups with the 6.0 gas or 6.6 diesel. The 4/5 ton pickups just seem much more capable and safe.

 

[CaptainXL]

If no one has any objections I think we will be going with a 250/2500 diesel. Either 6.4 or 6.6 from GM. The tow ratings of the 150/1500 trucks are just cutting it too close. It also seems that there are not a lot of 1500 6.0 liter trucks with the 4.10 gear ratio. That is the only combination that will tow the trailer. I also want to have a relatively good safety margin to work with.

Does anyone know the reliability of the diesels used by GM Duramax. I have been looking at Ford Powerstroke but would rather not go over to the dark side.

 

[Playsinsnow]

Came across this... "High" mileage reliability - Duramax Diesels Forum


Read probably a half dozen other diesel forums in the last few minutes and the consensus seems to be the same. As in the same answer you would give me if I were to ask about buying a high mileage TB... Or maybe even an Envoy

The 6.6 that was new in '06 was class leading...

 

[djthumper]

I have heard a lot of good things on the new 6.6 that Plays mentioned.

 

[CaptainXL]

I have heard a lot of good things on the new 6.6 that Plays mentioned.

Yeah but the 1999-2004's have injector leaking issues and head gasket problems. Doing more research. Guess I need to join a diesel forum if I am serious at all about this.

 

[Playsinsnow]

Yeah but the 1999-2004's have injector leaking issues and head gasket problems. Doing more research. Guess I need to join a diesel forum if I am serious at all about this.

I would stick to '06 or newer unless you find that diamond in the rough on an older model. Perhaps someone already addressed the issue on the older one. Or buy the cheapest one you can find and spend the difference in maintenance. I would look at camping or trailering forums also for your thoughts. Or lease a shiny brand new one?

 

[gmcman]

I have read about many peeps needing injector replacements with the pre-05. I agree there is a price premium on the 06+ but that would be a serious tow machine.

 

[HARDTRAILZ]

If no one has any objections I think we will be going with a 250/2500 diesel. Either 6.4 or 6.6 from GM. The tow ratings of the 150/1500 trucks are just cutting it too close. It also seems that there are not a lot of 1500 6.0 liter trucks with the 4.10 gear ratio. That is the only combination that will tow the trailer. I also want to have a relatively good safety margin to work with.

Does anyone know the reliability of the diesels used by GM Duramax. I have been looking at Ford Powerstroke but would rather not go over to the dark side.

Don't get a 6.4.

Honestly if you go diesel. Get a Cummins. I am a die hard GM, but tons of friends are big diesel guys and having been around them for years, the cummins just flat works. Duramax's are great, but the Cummins would actually make me own a dodge. Never a gas one, but the diesel...yes.

 

[tblazerdude]

your windows, speedometers, courtesy lights, all might not work, but the cummins diesel is by far hands down the way to go. I have seen multiple 2500's and 3500's from dodge with over 400k mi with routine maintenance only. btw, owning a diesel costs more. Your oil changes will be in the $100 range. You have to have the engine lifters adjusted annually. New ones require DEF fluid, another added expense. Fuel filters are an annual replacement item, and much more expensive. Exhaust work costs more and has frequent problems. But diesels are more reliable, and put out major tq numbers. I snow plowed with a 98 cummins dodge 3500 dually for 3 years. Never broke down, and pushed massive amounts of snow.

 

[triz]

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?endYear=2010&zip=33707&photosOnly=true&listingType=used&driveCodes=4WD|AWD&listingTypes=used&maxPrice=14000&mmt=[CHEV[CHEVC25[]][]]&vehicleStyleCodes=TRUCKS&modelCode1=CHEVC25&driveCode=4WD|AWD&showcaseOwnerId=793516&makeCode1=CHEV&startYear=2004&searchRadius=500&bodyStyleCodes=TRUCKS&listingId=352437951&listingIndex=13&Log=0

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?endYear=2010&zip=33707&photosOnly=true&listingType=used&driveCodes=4WD|AWD&listingTypes=used&maxPrice=14000&mmt=[CHEV[CHEVC25[]][]]&vehicleStyleCodes=TRUCKS&modelCode1=CHEVC25&driveCode=4WD|AWD&showcaseOwnerId=793516&makeCode1=CHEV&startYear=2004&searchRadius=500&bodyStyleCodes=TRUCKS&listingId=351362412&listingIndex=23&Log=0

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=33707&endYear=2010&photosOnly=true&listingType=used&driveCodes=4WD|AWD&listingTypes=used&maxPrice=14000&mmt=[CHEV[CHEVC25[]][]]&vehicleStyleCodes=TRUCKS&modelCode1=CHEVC25&driveCode=4WD|AWD&showcaseOwnerId=793516&makeCode1=CHEV&startYear=2004&firstRecord=26&searchRadius=500&bodyStyleCodes=TRUCKS&listingId=351707680&listingIndex=3&Log=0

I personally like the last one. Its between your budget. Right around the mileage your looking for. But you need to hop on a plane.

 

[Playsinsnow]

The first one looks very nice too

 

[CaptainXL]

The wife made me do it.

http://grandrapids.craigslist.org/cto/3998261939.html

 

[CaptainXL]

I personally like the last one. Its between your budget. Right around the mileage your looking for. But you need to hop on a plane.

I like the last one as well but not sure how jacking up the truck will affect towing. Probably a negative.

Soooo. I got you looking as well? Gonna go the truck route as well? He he.

Thanks for the help guys.

 

[djthumper]

The wife made me do it.

2005 GMC Envoy XL 4X4 SUV

Wow!

 

[Playsinsnow]

The wife made me do it.

Alright, I'll bite. Was it a gun to your head or a don't come to bed list it now threat? I only ask so that if the day comes I'll have prepared lol

 

[dmanns67]

It will all become real when you get the first phone call/email. On the bright side you will be getting a "new to you" vehicle out of it.

Must be hard though, I could never see myself parting ways with my TB.

 

[Playsinsnow]

It will all become real when you get the first phone call/email. On the bright side you will be getting a "new to you" vehicle out of it.

Must be hard though, I could never see myself parting ways with my TB.

It gets real when some stranger wants to drive it and you actually hand him the keys knowing whoever certainly is not pulling it into a service bay, lol.

 

[CaptainXL]

It will all become real when you get the first phone call/email. On the bright side you will be getting a "new to you" vehicle out of it.

Must be hard though, I could never see myself parting ways with my TB.

I Understand. You guys with newer TB's that have no need for towing anything like I am should be content. You don't want to be in my shoes.

Alright, I'll bite. Was it a gun to your head or a don't come to bed list it now threat? I only ask so that if the day comes I'll have prepared lol

Nah, I was just kidding. She finally got sick of me complaining about the dealer trade in pricing. So I just agreed with her and said we should try to get the most out of a private sale. We will see. The price is inline with the upkeep I have given the voy. Its basically in better condition then when ;I bought it 2 1/2 years ago. Also SUV's are in demand in the fall because people like the 4wd for snow. It's priced accordingly. I will allow $500 off if I need to make a deal with a savy buyer.

 

[Playsinsnow]

Nah, I was just kidding. She finally got sick of me complaining about the dealer trade in pricing. So I just agreed with her and said we should try to get the most out of a private sale. We will see. The price is inline with the upkeep I have given the voy. Its basically in better condition then when ;I bought it 2 1/2 years ago. Also SUV's are in demand in the fall because people like the 4wd for snow. It's priced accordingly. I will allow $500 off if I need to make a deal with a savy buyer.

Hey, no problem. I like it when she puts it into perspective for me to shutup. One last question... What kind of trailer again? Any chance of downsizing the trailer to keep the Voy since it is "in better condition" than 2.5 years ago?

 

[CaptainXL]

Hey, no problem. I like it when she puts it into perspective for me to shutup. One last question... What kind of trailer again? Any chance of downsizing the trailer to keep the Voy since it is "in better condition" than 2.5 years ago?

The funny thing is that ultra-lite trailers designed to be pulled by SUV's (5000 LB's or less) can often be much more expensive than heavier 7-8000 lb trailers. So it was either get a $31000 trailer for the Envoy at 5000 lbs or get a cheaper yet higher class luxury trailer for $20000. We are basically upgrading to a 35 ft. 7600+ cargo weighted trailer. We used to have a 31 ft trailer. But it was totalled.In the RV industry you usually pick your RV and then find a vehicle to tow it. Much harder to go the other way around. Especially if you are saving a wad of cash.

 

[Playsinsnow]

How "luxurious" are you going? There are TT's in the Twin Cities greater area for less than $20k brand new 26ft+.

I also agree about buying an appropriate tow vehicle for the trailer. Except when already owning a vehicle that is somewhat capable so that the money saved is spent on the travels? Personally if I were going that large, I would get a fifth wheel trailer.

 

[CaptainXL]

How "luxurious" are you going?.

It's got an outside kitchen, 2 slide outs, auto leveling, aluminum wheels, a 20 inch LCD TV and double door stainless fridge. So yeah...its a monster.

Prime Time Manufacturing, Manufacturers of travel trailers and fifth wheels

 

[Playsinsnow]

It is very nice indeed.